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Charles David Llewellyn - A Will Update!

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ProfilePosted byOptionsPost Date

HeyJudeB4Beatles

HeyJudeB4Beatles Report 29 Sep 2012 18:45

GO TO LAST POST!!

Firstly, sorry if I have posted this - or similar - before. Not easy to check!!

Anyway, Charles David is my grandfather's youngest/older sibling if that makes sense :-)

i.e my grandfather was the "baby" and Charles David was the next. I have a marriage for Charles David

Marriages Jun 1900 (>99%)
Driscoll Ellen Bristol 6a 160
Larkin Deaney Bristol 6a 160
Larkin Denney Bristol 6a 160
Llewellyn Charles David Bristol 6a 160
Mathias Edith Mabel Bristol 6a 160

1901 census gives

Name: Mabel E Llewellyn
Age in 1901: 23
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1878
Relation: Wife
Spouse's Name: Chas D Llewellyn
Gender: Female
Where born: Newport, Monmouthshire, Wales
Civil parish: Newport
Ecclesiastical parish: St Paul
County/Island: Monmouthshire
Country: Wales
Street Address: View image
Condition as to marriage: View image
Education: View image
Employment status: View image
Occupation: View image
Registration district: Newport (Monmouthshire)
Sub-registration district: Newport
ED, institution, or vessel: 31
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 116
Piece: 4959
Folio: 116
Page Number: 24
Household Members:
Name Age
Chas D Llewellyn 21
Mabel E Llewellyn 23
Rose Phillips 22
Eva Edmonds 19

I don't know why they married in Bristol - if my research is right they were both born in Newport. Have sent for it.

I can find Charles in 1911

Name: Charles David Llewellyn
Age in 1911: 31
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1880
Relation to Head: Head
Gender: Male
Birth Place: Newport, Monmouthshire, Wales
Civil parish: Newport
County/Island: Monmouthshire
Country: Wales
Street Address: 50 Constance St Newport Mon
Marital Status: Married
Occupation: Barman
Registration district: Newport
Registration District Number: 587
Sub-registration district: Newport
ED, institution, or vessel: 31
Household schedule number: 334
Piece: 31990
Household Members:
Name Age
Charles David Llewellyn 31

This is DEFINITELY him as in the image his mother - my great grandmother is "cited"

He is shown as married....and I thin that this is her death

Name: Edith Llewellyn
Birth Date: abt 1876
Date of Registration: Oct-Nov-Dec 1959
Age at Death: 83
Registration district: Caerleon
Inferred County: Monmouthshire
Volume: 8c
Page: 115

But where was she in 1911?

I have tried seaching St Cadoc's a hospital in Caerleon for the "insane" to no avail..... :-S

Mike *

Mike * Report 29 Sep 2012 19:10

Is this her birth ?


Births Jun 1878
MATHIAS Mabel Edith - Bedwelty 11a 100


rather than this one


Births Dec 1877
MATHIAS Edith Mabel - Newport M 11a 208

HeyJudeB4Beatles

HeyJudeB4Beatles Report 30 Sep 2012 07:04

Sorry - called away. I believe it is the Newport one - will know for sure when the certificate comes (hope it is because all the work I have done on her family is for the Newport one :-)

Flip

Flip Report 30 Sep 2012 07:32

The enumerator has put his mother Mrs M Llewellyn has head of the household on his summary page, so it looks like she is missing from the census as well - wonder if they were away somewhere together?

Choccy

Choccy Report 30 Sep 2012 07:43



this looks like his mother in 1911 -

1911

RG14PN31980 RG78PN1840 RD587 SD2 ED21 SN92
Reg. District: Newport
Sub District: Newport
Parish: Newport
Enum. District: 21
Address: 51 Commercial St: Newport Mon
County: Monmouthshire


WRIGHT, Albert Henry Head Married M 36 1875 Licence Victualler Newport Monmouthshire
WRIGHT, Maria Wife Married
13 years F 34 1877 Assisting In Business Newport Monmouthshire
WRIGHT, Albert Merchant Son M 6 1905 Newport Monmouthshire
WRIGHT, Reginald Steer Son M 2 1909 Newport Monmouthshire
WRIGHT, William Henry Son M 0 (9 MONTHS) 1911 Newport Monmouthshire
WRIGHT, Robert William Boarder Single M 25 1886 Labourer Steel Works Newport Monmouthshire
LLEWELLYN, Mary Jane Assistant Single F 37 1874 Restaurant Newport Monmouthshire
SIMONS, Nellie Elizabeth Servant Single F 22 1889 General Servant Domestic Cheltenham Gloucester
GOULD, Katherine Servant Single F 17 1894 Nurse Newport Monmouthshire
THAYER, Freda Olive Servant Single F 18 1893 Barmaid Pill Somerset
>>>>>LLEWELLYN, Maria O Connor Visitor Widow F 69 1842 Trowbridge Wiltshire
BAKER, John William Visitor Married
23 years M 52 1859 Sea Captain St Georges Somerset
BAKER, Mary Margaret Ann Visitor Married
23 years F 46 1865 N K Dundee Forfarshire


HeyJudeB4Beatles

HeyJudeB4Beatles Report 30 Sep 2012 07:45

No I have Maria in 1911 - she was at a pub called the Commercial Hotel in Newport which was run by her daughter Maria and her husband Albert Wright

Name: Maria Oconnor Llewelyn
Age in 1911: 69
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1842
Relation to Head: Visitor
Gender: Female
Birth Place: Trowbridge, Wiltshire, England
Civil parish: Newport
County/Island: Monmouthshire
Country: Wales
Street Address: 51 Commercial St Newport Mon
Marital Status: Widowed
Registration district: Newport
Registration District Number: 587
Sub-registration district: Newport
ED, institution, or vessel: 21
Household schedule number: 92
Piece: 31980
Household Members:
Name Age
Albert Henry Wright 36
Maria Wright 34
Albert Marchant Wright 6
Reginald Steer Wright 2
William Henry Wright 9/12
Robert William Wright 25
Mary Jane Llewellyn 37
Nellie Elizabeth Simons 22
Katherine Gould 17
Freda Olive Thayer 18
Maria Oconnor Llewelyn 69
John William Baker 52
Mary Margaret Ann Baker 46

Also on the census for him - and crossed out is one child born and one child died. Difficult to pin down because it's before mmn was added to index. Which is why I wondered if she might be in a hospital somewhere

HeyJudeB4Beatles

HeyJudeB4Beatles Report 30 Sep 2012 07:45

well spotted Choccy!

Barbara

Barbara Report 30 Sep 2012 07:52

The mother?


1911 census transcription details for: 95 Dock ST

Print Close
National Archive Reference:
RG14PN31978 RG78PN1840 RD587 SD2 ED19 SN45
Reg. District: Newport
Sub District: Newport
Parish: Newport
Enum. District: 19
Address: 95 Dock ST
County: Monmouthshire
Name Relation Condition/
Yrs married Sex Age Birth Year Occupation Where Born
WILLIAM, Elizabeth Emily Sister Married F 42 1869 None Usk Monshre
TWIST, Doris Mary Daughter Single F 11 1900 School Newport Mon
TWIST, Kathleen Emily Daughter Single F 10 1901 School Newport Mon
LEWELLIN, Maria Mother Widow F 69 1842 None Pontypool Mon
GIBB, Kathleen Mary Granddaughter F 3 1908 Lewisham
MORRIS, Florence Amy Servant Single F 21 1890 Domestic Servant Newport Mon
TWIST, Caroline Morris Head Widow F 45 1866 None Newport Mon
© brightsolid online publishing ltd

HeyJudeB4Beatles

HeyJudeB4Beatles Report 30 Sep 2012 07:58

No Barbara - different Maria. My Maria was born in Trowbridge and is the one in the Commercial Street census - Maria Wright was her daughter.

I have everything going about all of the children and their families except the missing Mabel Edith/Edith Mabel.

Flip

Flip Report 30 Sep 2012 08:06

Well, that blows that theory out of the water. Is this Charles's death (can't see another birth for a Charles D 1877-80)

Charles D Llewellyn
Birth Date: abt 1879
Date of Registration: Apr-May-Jun 1926
Age at Death: 47
Registration district: Bridgwater
Inferred County: Somerset
Volume: 5c
Page: 382

Flip

Flip Report 30 Sep 2012 08:10

From probate - Charles David Llewellyn of 45 Wellington Road, Bridgewater, died 2/5/1926, administration (with will) granted to Eva Bevan, spinster. £174 10s 5d.

HeyJudeB4Beatles

HeyJudeB4Beatles Report 30 Sep 2012 08:23

I am not convinced it is his death but I have sent for certificate along with the marriage certificate - though whether it will have any pointers to it being him I don't know.

But I can't find another death that fits. Curiously, my cousin who is in her 80's remembers her great aunts Maria (as in the census) and Jane who dies in the 50's/60's and knew of great uncle William but she knew nothing at all of the existence of a brother called Charles David. Which suggests to me that (a) he died young and (b) maybe "under a cloud". Perhaps he ran off with Eva Bevan!

Jude

Flip

Flip Report 30 Sep 2012 08:27

I'm not convinced about the death either, but can't see a birth which would go with it (England/Wales). I wonder if the death you have for Edith is correct? They may have split up and she could have re-married - maybe by 1911 she was living with someone else under their name, which is why we can't find her.

HeyJudeB4Beatles

HeyJudeB4Beatles Report 30 Sep 2012 08:35

I don't know about the death for Edith - it is a complete guess. And of course it is such a common name.

That's a good angle to try though

Jude

Flip

Flip Report 30 Sep 2012 08:49

The 1901 census has an Eva Edmonds, barmaid born Newport but I can't see a birth for her. There is an Eva Bevan born Monmouth in 1880 though.

HeyJudeB4Beatles

HeyJudeB4Beatles Report 30 Sep 2012 09:06

I can't find a marriage for this pair in 1899

Name: Edith M Spittle
Age in 1911: 36
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1875
Relation to Head: Wife
Gender: Female
Birth Place: Newport, Monmouthshire, Wales
Civil parish: Newport
County/Island: Monmouthshire
Country: Wales
Street Address: St Briavels Fields Park Rd Newport Mon
Marital Status: Married
Years Married: 12
Estimated Marriage Year: 1899
Registration district: Newport
Registration District Number: 587
Sub-registration district: Newport
ED, institution, or vessel: 06
Household schedule number: 444
Piece: 31965
Household Members:
Name Age
George Spittle 44
Edith M Spittle 36
Ethel Mand Fox 40
Ethel Harris 25
Florance B Shawbridge 20

and Eva in 1901

Name: Eva Edmonds
Age in 1901: 19
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1882
Relation: Servant
Gender: Female
Where born: Newport, Monmouthshire, Wales
Civil parish: Newport
Ecclesiastical parish: St Paul
County/Island: Monmouthshire
Country: Wales
Street Address: View image
Condition as to marriage: View image
Education: View image
Employment status: View image
Occupation: View image
Registration district: Newport (Monmouthshire)
Sub-registration district: Newport
ED, institution, or vessel: 31
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 116
Piece: 4959
Folio: 116
Page Number: 24
Household Members:
Name Age
Chas D Llewellyn 21
Mabel E Llewellyn 23
Rose Phillips 22
Eva Edmonds 19

View original image

Oh look she lives with Charles and Edith!!!!

HeyJudeB4Beatles

HeyJudeB4Beatles Report 30 Sep 2012 09:11

This is probably Eva's birth

Births Dec 1882 (>99%)
Edmunds Eva Newport M 11a 182


HeyJudeB4Beatles

HeyJudeB4Beatles Report 30 Sep 2012 09:23

The connections continue..

in 1891 Eva is living in Capel Street Newport across the road from my grandmother Isabella Irvine who married Lewis Llewellyn who was living round the corner with his brother Charles David :-)

So Charles probably knew Eva Edmonds before he met Edith .....so only thing to prove is that Eva Edmonds and Eva Bevan are one and same and that it is indeed Charles' death in Bridgwater!!

Flip

Flip Report 30 Sep 2012 09:55

It's a bit of a leap though! Not sure if Eva Bevan would have to prove her identity in order to prove the will. Thinking about it, you can get a search done for £6, which includes a copy of the will - it may give more information than the death certificate would.

Just in case you want to try, probate was granted 18/6/1926 London, the form & address for applications can be found here:

http://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/probate/family-history

Scroll down until you find the postal search address and link to the form.

Choccy

Choccy Report 30 Sep 2012 10:21



don't think the 'Spittle' connection is right - here they are in 1901

1901

RG number: RG13
Piece: 4956
Folio: 76
Page: 26
Reg. District: Newport
Sub District: Newport
Parish: Newport
Enum. District: 5
Ecclesiastical District: St Marks
City/Municipal Borough:
Address: St Briarels, Fields Park Road, Newport
County: Monmouthshire


SPITTLE, George Head Married M 34 1867 Clerk
Deaf Newport, Monmouthshire
SPITTLE, Edith M Wife Married F 26 1875
Newport, Monmouthshire
PAYNE, Amelia Sister Married F 35 1866
Newport, Monmouthshire
PAYNE, Melville Nephew M 10 1891
Cardiff, Glamorganshire
KEEN, Rosa Servant Single F 39 1862 Companion Help Domestic
Wells, Somersetshire
MORGAN, Emily Servant Single F 14 1887 General Servant Domestic
Newport, Monmouthshire


and his probate details -

England & Wales, National Probate Calendar (Index of Wills and Administrations), 1858-1966

Name: George Spittle
Probate Date: 27 Feb 1915
Death Date: 14 Dec 1914
Death Place: Monmouthshire, Wales
Registry: London, England

St Braviels, Fields Park, Newport
Probate to Edith Maude Spittle widow
£9958 0s 2d.