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Im not sure if its the new way of finding relatives on here but Im having trouble can anyone help me?? Im looking for the HOWELL family.
Ive found them on the 1911 census but cant find them any earlier.On the 1911 it says.
DAVID HOWELL (56)...dock labourer..born SALFORD.
MARTHA ALICE HOWELL (48) home...born BOLTON
17 IVY TERRACE, ECCLES NEW ROAD, SALFORD.
MARRIED 30 YEARS...

CHILDREN
DAVID HOWELL (24)..single ....born SALFORD
ROBERT HOWELL (22)...single....born SALFORD
ANNIE HOWELL (13)...single......born SALFORD.
It says on the 1911 census that there was 8 children born but only 4 living.

Then there is
WILLIAM SMITH (5)....single...born MANCHESTER.

MARTHA ALICE HOWELL'S maiden name was SMITH. so I take it hes something to do with her it doesnt say what he is on the 1911 census.

ANNIE was my grand mother so I know what happened to her but I cant seem to find any trace before 1911.Can anyone help Id be very grateful as a lot of people have helped me on here with other relatives who didnt want to be found !
Elaine

1891 has a David and Margaret Howell that match on birth places

Name: David Howell
Age: 4
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1887
Relation: Son
Father's Name: David Howell
Mother's Name: Margaret Howell
Gender: Male
Where born: Salford, Lancashire, England

Civil parish: Salford
Ecclesiastical parish: Christchurch
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England

Street Address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Education:

Employment status: View image

Registration district: Salford
Sub-registration district: Regent Road
ED, institution, or vessel: 9
Neighbors: View others on page
Piece: 3220
Folio: 114
Page Number: 42
Household Members: Name Age
David Howell 27
Margaret Howell 25 - Bolton
David Howell 4
Robert Howell 2 - Salford

Class: RG12; Piece: 3220; Folio: 114; Page: 42; GSU roll: 6098330.

??

1891 England Census
about David Howell
Name: David Howell
Age: 4
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1887
Relation: Son
Father's Name: David Howell
Mother's Name: Margaret Howell
Gender: Male
Where born: Salford, Lancashire, England

Civil parish: Salford
Ecclesiastical parish: Christchurch
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England

Street Address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Education:

Employment status: View image

Registration district: Salford
Sub-registration district: Regent Road
ED, institution, or vessel: 9
Neighbors: View others on page
Piece: 3220
Folio: 114
Page Number: 42
Household Members: Name Age
David Howell 27 (Carter) Born Worsley Lancashire
Margaret Howell 25 Born Bolton Lancashire
David Howell 4
Robert Howell 2

For Ref.......

Household transcription
1911 census

Person: HOWELL, David
Address: 17 Ivy Terrace Eccles New Road Salford

HOWELL, David Head Married M 56 1855 Dock Labourer Salford Lanchire VIEW
HOWELL, Martha Alice Wife Married30 years F 48 1863 Home Bolton Lancashire VIEW
HOWELL, David Son Single M 24 1887 Dock Labour Salford Lanchire VIEW
HOWELL, Robert Son Single M 22 1889 Dock Labours Salford Lanchester VIEW
HOWELL, Annie Daughter Single F 13 1898 School Salford Lancashire VIEW
SMITH, William M 5 1906 School Manchester Lanchire VIEW
RG number: RG14
Piece: 24070
Reference: RG14PN24070 RG78PN1384 RD465 SD4 ED27 SN161
Registration District: Salford
Sub District: Regent Road
Enumeration District: 27
Parish: Salford
Address: 17 Ivy Terrace Eccles New Road Salford
County: Lancashire

Elaine..it would help if you can explain the discrepancy between your 1911 information re Martha Alice..and the two contributions above for 1891 and 1901..which show Margaret rather than Martha Alice???...and Annie aged 13 in 1911..where was she in 1901???
.......then we can move on.

Derek

1901 has not been found yet.

Maybe she used her middle name ???

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Marriages Dec 1886 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Evans Annie Bolton 8c 355
GLEAVES Elizabeth Alice Bolton 8c 355
HOWELL David Bolton 8c 355
Smith Alice Bolton 8c 355
WADDINGTON Abraham Bolton 8c 355

Thanks everyone for the help.

Derek I can find them on the 1911 census but nothing for the census before that.I know Martha Alice is the right name because Annie their daughter names her daughter Martha Alice that was my mam.
On the 1911 census it says that David and Martha Alice had been married for 30 years.

Derek

How can Elaine possibly explain the "discrepancy" when all she has found up to now is the 1911 census?

I'm only trying to help!!!!!........Martha???? Alice Smith married david howell
4Q 1886..using the name ALICE SMITH............which as has been said may have been her middle name..........so can SOMEONE who has more records than elaine try to help her by explaining the aforementioned discrepancy???????

One idea might be that since we can't find them on the 1901 thank you Gitter. my old sparring partner......perhaps he re-married a Margaret in between?????..except the 1911 says they had been married 30 years......well i make it 25.........

Interesting tho innit??
EDIT...Have found david Howell at Worsley in 1881.....unmarried of course
Derek

The 1911 census was the first set of census records to be filled in by hand by the public.
Maybe Martha sounded like Margaret to whoever filled in those previous

On the 1911 census Martha Alice says shes 48 and been married for 30 years so that would mean she was born 1863 in Bolton Manchester.Ive just found a death for the same name but the age would be 2 years out.

Death Record




Name

Martha A Howell



Year of Registration

1940



Quarter of Registration

Apr-May-Jun



Registration District

Manchester



Registration County

Lancashire



Age at Death:

79


If she was 79 when she died that would mean she was born in 1861 not1863...

I agree Mike.

Odd that the family doesn't show up in 1901.

I will take a look on FMP to see if they show up on there.

Been looking at FMP but I have not got a sub to view any possible results

I think this child survived, as there is a marriage in Salford in 1916. So she should be with them in 1901.

Baptisms: 6 Jul 1892 Christ Church, Salford, Lancashire, England
Eliza Alice Howell - Child of David Howell & Margaret Alice
Born: 1892
Abode: 35 Lambert Street
Occupation: Labourer
Baptised by: Fred. Knight
Register: Baptisms 1892 - 1898, Page 18, Entry 143
Source: LDS Film 1786366

Curious !

No birth for Martha alice smith in Bolton but there is this one ...


Births Sep 1862
SMITH Margaret Alice - Bolton 8c 335

Just found Martha Alice Smith (maiden name) on the 1871 census.
MATHEW SMITH....DAD....40
ELIZABETH SMITH...MOTHER,,,39
ELIZABETH SMITH....DAUGHTER....14
MARY SMITH....DAUGHTER....11
MARTHA ALICE SMITH...DAUGHTER..8
KING STREET....FARNWORTH....BOLTON.

Eliza was a servant in 1911 living away

Is this just a strange coincidence???


1901 England Census
Name: Martha A Bradbury
Age: 36
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1865
Relation: Wife
Spouse's Name: William Bradbury
Gender: Female
Where born: Bolton, Lancashire, England

Civil parish: Salford
Ecclesiastical parish: Paddington St Paul
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England

Address: 2 Alma Street

Registration district: Salford
Sub-registration district: Regent Road
ED, institution, or vessel: 12
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 163
Piece: 3733
Folio: 86
Page Number: 28
Household Members: Name Age
William Bradbury 46 ....Dock Labourer...Worsley
Martha A Bradbury 36
David Bradbury 16
Robert Bradbury 14
Eliza A Bradbury 9
Nannie Bradbury 3


All children born in Salford.

Baptisms: 2 Nov 1887 Christ Church, Salford, Lancashire, England
David Howell - Child of David Howell & Margaret
Born: 1 Sep 1887
Abode: 2 West George Street
Occupation: Labourer
Baptised by: J. A. Stowell
Register: Baptisms 1882 - 1892, Page 164, Entry 1310
Source: LDS Film 1786366

Baptisms: 7 May 1890 Christ Church, Salford, Lancashire, England
Robert Howell - Child of David Howell & Margaret
Born: 26 Aug 1890 [sic]
Abode: 35 Lambert Street
Occupation: Lurryman
Baptised by: J. A. Pattinson
Register: Baptisms 1882 - 1892, Page 242, Entry 1935
Source: LDS Film 1786366

Baptisms: 6 Jul 1892 Christ Church, Salford, Lancashire, England
Eliza Alice Howell - Child of David Howell & Margaret Alice
Born: 1892
Abode: 35 Lambert Street
Occupation: Labourer
Baptised by: Fred. Knight
Register: Baptisms 1892 - 1898, Page 18, Entry 143
Source: LDS Film 1786366

note the address for Robert & Eliza Alice is the same