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Can anyone help me please, I've been researching my family history for many years but when it comes to my grandfather on my fathers side I always seem to come up against a brick wall, his name is Henry Alfred or Alfred Henry Griffiths born around 1872 possibly in Somerset although my father always said it was Neath in Wales, he was married to Gertrude Ellen Amy Edwards 25 March 1906 at st Gabriel s church in West Ham London, he died in Keynsham Somerset 3 June 1937 and is buried in Frome Somerset, we believe his mother to be Eliza Fear born around 1849 and that she may have been previously married to a "Wright" before she married Charles Griffiths my great grandfather, Eliza had 8 children in total;
Henry
William C
Charles
Gilbert
Egbert
Ralph
Flora
Bessie Brindle F
the last 6 were born in Shepton Mallet William was born in Bristol whereas Henry appears not to have been born at all.
if anyone can help me trace Henry's birth i would be eternally grateful.

Clive

Hello Clive, have you found Charles and Eliza's marriage?

Could Henry Alfred have been born before it?

What birthplace is given for him on census records?

Is this him please?

1911 England Census
about Henry Samuel Griffiths
Name: Henry Samuel Griffiths
Age in 1911: 38
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1873
Relation to Head: Head
Gender: Male
Birth Place: Shepton, Somerset
Civil parish: Bristol
County/Island: Gloucestershire
Country: England
Street Address: 62 Repton Road, Brislington, Bristol
Marital Status: Married
Occupation: Foreman Of Motor Garage
Registration district: Bristol
Registration District Number: 319
Sub-registration district: Knowle
ED, institution, or vessel: 18
Household schedule number: 134
Piece: 14945
Household Members: Name Age
Henry Samuel Griffiths 38
Emma Jane Griffiths 40
Reginald Victor Griffiths 10
Iris Kathleen Griffiths 8/12

??????

England & Wales, Death Index, 1916-2006
about Henry A Griffiths
Name: Henry A Griffiths
Birth Date: abt 1872
Date of Registration: Apr-May-Jun 1937
Age at Death: 65
Registration district: Bathavon
Inferred County: Somerset
Volume: 5c
Page: 599

I think this is the correct 1911 to work from:

GRIFFITHS, Alfred Head Married 5 years M 37 1874 Seaman Bristol
GRIFFITHS, Gertrude Wife Married F 30 1881 London
GRIFFITHS, Gertrude Daughter F 3 1908 London
GRIFFITHS, Sarah Daughter F 1 1910 London

RG number: RG14 Piece: 1697
Reference: RG14PN1697 RG78PN59 RD22 SD2 ED20 SN192
Registration District: Poplar
Sub District: Bromley
Enumeration District: 20
Parish: Poplar Borough

Address: 30 Bloomsbury ST County: London

No other children born.

Clive - I think that must be your tree on ancestry that I've come across. On it you have Charles Griffiths and Eliza Fear as having married 1877 - do you have that as a fact or is it an estimate?

If it's a fact, then Alfred Henry's birth most likely wouldn't be registered as Griffiths, it would be whatever his mother was called at the time.

That's if it was registered at all. Although civil registration came into effect 1837 there was no compulsion on parents to register births until around 1874 although there are many who still slipped through the net.

Just posting the 1911 for Charles and Eliza:

GRIFFITHS, Charles Head Married M 54 1857 Cooper Cook Work Gloster Lechlade
GRIFFITHS, Eliza Wife Married 34 years F 60 1851 Bristol

RG number: RG14 Piece: 14465
Reference: RG14PN14465 RG78PN875 RD311 SD2 ED7 SN93
Registration District: Frome
Sub District: Frome
Enumeration District: 7
Parish: Frome

Address: 3 New Buildings Frome County: Somersetshire

Clive, apart from Alfred's marriage cert, what other certificates have you obtained to break down this brick wall?

You believe his mother to be Eliza Fear - have you obtained any birth certificates for his younger siblings to confirm this?

According to his service records he says he was born Liverpool!!

British Army WWI Service Records, 1914-1920

Name: Heny Alfred Griffiths
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1875
Age at enlistment: 42
Birth Parish: Liverpool
Document Year: 1917
Regimental Number: 334330
Regiment Name: Royal Engineers
Number of images: 29

Definitely him because the wife (Gertrude) and children (Gertrude, Sarah, Bessie and Alfred) match up.

I won't post all the details as you'll be able to access it as an Ancestry member.

1881 England Census
about Charles Griffiths
Name: Charles Griffiths
Age: 25
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1856
Relation: Head
Spouse's Name: Eliza Griffiths
Gender: Male
Where born: Locklade, Gloucestershire, England
[Lechlade, Gloucestershire, England]

Civil parish: Shepton Mallet
County/Island: Somerset
Country: England

Street Address: No Side 14 Gr Ostry
Condition as to marriage: Married
Education:

Employment status: View image
Occupation: Cooper

Registration district: Shepton Mallet
Sub-registration district: Shepton Mallet
ED, institution, or vessel: 9
Neighbors: View others on page
Piece: 2405
Folio: 96
Page Number: 11
Household Members: Name Age
Charles Griffiths 25
Eliza Griffiths 32
Alfred Griffiths 12
William C. Griffiths 4
Charles Griffiths 2
Gilbert Griffiths 1
Joseph E. Brown 20

This is the Alfred on the above census down as Step Son.

1881 England Census
about Alfred Griffiths
Name: Alfred Griffiths
Age: 12
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1869
Relation: Step Son **************************************************
Mother's Name: Eliza Griffiths
Gender: Male
Where born: Bristol, Gloucestershire, England

Civil parish: Shepton Mallet
County/Island: Somerset
Country: England

Street Address: No Side 14 Gr Ostry
Education:

Registration district: Shepton Mallet
Sub-registration district: Shepton Mallet
ED, institution, or vessel: 9
Neighbors: View others on page
Piece: 2405
Folio: 96
Page Number: 11
Household Members: Name Age
Charles Griffiths 25
Eliza Griffiths 32
Alfred Griffiths 12
William C. Griffiths 4
Charles Griffiths 2
Gilbert Griffiths 1
Joseph E. Brown 20

So perhaps he was Eliza'a son and his birth year is 1869.

I think the children's relationship on the 1881 explains everything:

GRIFFITHS, Charles Head Married M 25 1856 Cooper Locklade, Gloucestershire
GRIFFITHS, Eliza Wife Married F 32 1849 Rubble, Somerset
GRIFFITHS, Alfred Son Of Wife Single M 12 1869 Scholar Bristol, Gloucestershire
GRIFFITHS, William C Son Of Wife Single M 4 1877 Imbecile Bristol, Gloucestershire
GRIFFITHS, Charles Son Of Wife Single M 2 1879 Shepton Mallet, Somerset
GRIFFITHS, Gilbert Son Of Wife Single M 1 1880 Shepton Mallet, Somerset

Piece: 2405 Folio: 96 Page: 11
Registration District: Shepton Mallet
Civil Parish: Shepton-Mallet

Address: 14, No Side, Gr Ostry, Shepton-Mallet County: Somersetshire

This looks a possible for his younger brother:

England & Wales, FreeBMD Birth Index, 1837-1915
Date of Registration: Apr-May-Jun 1880
Registration district: Wells
Inferred County: Somerset
Volume: 5c
Page: 547

Just picking one of Charles and Eliza's children mentioned:

Surname First name(s) District Vol Page
Births Jun 1882
Griffiths Egbert Shepton M. 5c 519

I'd suggest ordering his certificate to see what info it gives on Eliza's previous names. We might then be in a better position to track her back and find more on Alfred Henry

Get the cert from GRO, will cost £9.25
http://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/certificates/

Here he is with mum and gran by the looks of it.

1871 England Census
about Alfred J Wright
Name: Alfred J Wright
Age: 2
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1869
Relation: Son
Mother's Name: Eliza Wright
Gender: Male
Where born: St George
Civil parish: St George
Ecclesiastical parish: St Luke
Town: Russell Town
County/Island: Gloucestershire
Country: England
Registration district: Clifton
Sub-registration district: St George
ED, institution, or vessel: 1
Household schedule number: 196
Piece: 2551
Folio: 23
Page Number: 38
Household Members: Name Age
Eliza Wright 30
Alfred J Wright 2
Elizabeth Fear 22

She'd be a bit young to be his gran, Mel?

FMP version

WRIGHT, Eliza Head F 20 1851 Gloucestershire widow. b St Philips. Twister cotton factory
WRIGHT, Alfred J Son M 2 1869 Gloucestershire b St Georges
FEAR, Elizabeth Lodger F 22 1849 Gloucestershire b St Philips

Piece: 2551 Folio: 23 Page: 38
Registration District: Clifton
Civil Parish: St George

Address: Morley Street, St George, Russell Town County: Gloucestershire

Marie yes I thought that after I had looked at the census!! :-S

I wonder if they were sisters??? Eliza and Elizabeth.

By the way I have been looking for the marriage. Have any of you found it yet? Charles Griffiths and Elizabeth Fear????? or Eliza

Mel, I've searched and can't see a likely marriage. The 1911 says 34 years wed which would b c1877 but the 1881 census has Gilbert b 1880 as "wife's son".

I'm guessing they might not have troubled the vicar, as they say! The 34 years might just be how long they'd been together.

Yes I wondered that Marie.

I am going to have a look for Eliza Wright on previous census.

Have just realized that the census I put up for 1871 it is Alfred J and not H. ????? This is rather confusing is'nt it? :-S