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Census look ups please

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ProfilePosted byOptionsPost Date

moonstar

moonstar Report 12 Jan 2013 13:14

Hi, is anyone free to search some census records for me?

I'm looking for any records for my Great Grandfather William Henry Shaw.
I have his marriage certificate (25.04.1909 to Sarah Challinor (born 1884) - married in West Derby, Liverpool). On his marriage certificate he states his age as 23 which would mean he was born in 1886, However there is family talk that he was infact a good years old than this and perhaps this was a lie or mistake?
His father is listed as a John Shaw - Carver and Guilder
I was wondering if we could find him on any census reports living with Sarah to see firstly what ages he states and secondly where he states he was born. Then if possible if anyone could find him actually on a census report with his father John?

Many thanks, hope I have included everything, Sarah

Gins

Gins Report 12 Jan 2013 13:18

Liverpool, England, Marriages and Banns, 1813-1921
about William Henry Shaw
Name: William Henry Shaw
Birth Year: abt 1876 <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Age: 33
Marriage Date: 25 Apr 1909
Parish: Everton Christ Church
Spouse's Name: Sarah Ann Challinor
Father's Name: John Edward Shaw
Spouse Father's Name: Robert Challinor

He states he is 33 not 23

George_of_Westbury

George_of_Westbury Report 12 Jan 2013 13:31

Also on the marriage record that Gins found he is a Widower.

George

moonstar

moonstar Report 12 Jan 2013 13:37

Thankyou I hadnt even noticed that

Astra

Astra Report 12 Jan 2013 13:41

Name: Sarah Ann Shane
[Sarah Ann Shaw]
[Sarah Ann Shaw]
Age in 1911: 26
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1885
Relation to Head: Wife
Gender: Female
Birth Place: Liverpool, Lancashire, England
Civil parish: Everton
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England
Street Address: 68 Buckingham St Everton Liverpool
Marital Status: Married
Registration district: West Derby
Registration District Number: 455
Sub-registration district: North Everton
ED, institution, or vessel: 5
Piece: 22488
Household Members:
Name Age
William Henry Shane 40
Sarah Ann Shane 26
Harriett McGuinness 34
Edith Shaw 8
Harriett Shaw 6
William H Shaw 5
Frederick J Shaw 3
Edward Shaw Under 1/12

Flip

Flip Report 12 Jan 2013 13:45

I looked at that one Astra, but it states married 10 years?

PricklyHolly

PricklyHolly Report 12 Jan 2013 13:46

??

1871 England Census
about William Henry Shaw
Name: William Henry Shaw
Age: 4
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1867
Relation: Son
Father's Name: John Edward Shaw
Mother's Name: Ann Shaw
Gender: Male
Where born: Manchester
Civil parish: Cathedral
Ecclesiastical parish: Cathedral
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England
Registration district: Manchester
Sub-registration district: Market Street
ED, institution, or vessel: 8
Household schedule number: 29
Piece: 4045
Folio: 7
Page Number: 7
Household Members: Name Age
John Edward Shaw 31 (Carver and Guilder)
Ann Shaw 37
Richard Owen Shaw 10
John Edward Shaw 6
William Henry Shaw 4
Charles Shaw 2
Arthur Shaw 2 Months

Edit: Ooops just noticed his age is way out?


Astra

Astra Report 12 Jan 2013 13:50

Yes I noted that too but maybe they included his first marriage. Just don't know. They are living in Buckingham Street which is where they were both living when they married.

Name: Edith May Shaw
Birth Date: 4 Sep 1902
Baptism Date: 2 Nov 1902
Parish: Everton Christ Church
Father's Name: William Shaw
Mother's Name: Sarah Shaw

moonstar

moonstar Report 12 Jan 2013 13:50

Thankyou for your posts. Checking with a relative here, who has just confirmed 68 Buckingham Street, Liverpool. So on this 1911 census William has stated his age as 40 which would make year of birth 1871 so yet another one. On this census report does it confirm where William lists he was born at all?

Astra

Astra Report 12 Jan 2013 13:53

He gives Manchester as his birth place in 1911

moonstar

moonstar Report 12 Jan 2013 13:56

Ah just refreshed screen as seen your additional posts.
Prickly Holly - on this 1871 census the father's name and occupation is correct but like you say this would mean William was born in 1867. Definately seems that William liked to tell fibs about his age on later report/certificates or maybe this is just another William Henry.
Rather confusing.
I'm going to see if I can find any other previous marriages for him.
Thanks

Flip

Flip Report 12 Jan 2013 13:58

Sarah Challinor
Age: 18
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1883
Relation: Daughter
Father's Name: Robert Challinor
Mother's Name: Harriet Challinor
Gender: Female
Where born: Liverpool, Lancashire, England

Civil parish: Everton
Ecclesiastical parish: St Ambrose
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England

Street Address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Education:

Employment status: View image

Registration district: West Derby
Sub-registration district: South Everton
ED, institution, or vessel: 14
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 176
Piece: 3481
Folio: 183
Page Number: 33
Household Members: Name Age
Robert Challinor 50
Harriet Challinor 47
Sarah Challinor 18
Thomas Challinor 16
William Challinor 9

One of the witnesses at the marriage was Thomas Challinor. All born Liverpool.

You coud be right Astra, maybe they lived together for a number of years as he wasn't free to marry?

PricklyHolly

PricklyHolly Report 12 Jan 2013 13:59

Following on from the 1871 i posted..........

??

1881 England Census
about William H. Shaw
Name: William H. Shaw
Age: 15
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1866
Relation: Son
Father's Name: John Shaw
Mother's Name: Ann Shaw
Gender: Male
Where born: Manchester, Lancashire, England

Civil parish: Salford
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England

Street Address: 28 Cromwell St
Education:

Employment status: View image
Occupation: Scholar Student

Registration district: Salford
Sub-registration district: Regent Road
ED, institution, or vessel: 83
Neighbors: View others on page
Piece: 3976
Folio: 95
Page Number: 11
Household Members: Name Age
John Shaw 41 (Carver and Guilder)
Ann Shaw 45
Richard Shaw 19
John E. Shaw 16
William H. Shaw 15
Charles Shaw 11


Potty

Potty Report 12 Jan 2013 14:02

Sarah, what is the name and DOB of your grandparent who was William's child?

moonstar

moonstar Report 12 Jan 2013 14:03

?? This would tie in with the marriage record stating he was 33 - 1876 marriage

Maddie

Maddie Report 12 Jan 2013 14:04

is this the one from the 1881 census
name: William Henry Shaw
gender: Male
baptism/christening date: 25 Oct 1866
baptism/christening place: CATHEDRAL,MANCHESTER,LANCASHIRE,ENGLAND
birth date:
birthplace:
death date:
name note:
race:
father's name: John Edmond Shaw
father's birthplace:
father's age:
mother's name: Ann
mother's birthplace:
mother's age:
indexing project (batch) number: C07354-7
system origin: England-ODM
source film number: 438181
reference number:

moonstar

moonstar Report 12 Jan 2013 14:18

Its Harry Shaw born 12.04.1921 - West Derby, Liverpool. Have siblings if you need them?
Ta

moonstar

moonstar Report 12 Jan 2013 14:38

Think you may well be on the right track, Flip, that William and Sarah could have been living together and having children before they actually got married. On the 1911 census first child is listed as Edith Shaw 1903 so this is well before they got married in 1909.
Soooo confused?!?

Flip

Flip Report 12 Jan 2013 15:07

Think this could be William, I recognised the census handwriting, he is in Prince Edward Street, on the previous image to Sarah, so round the corner:

William H Shaw
Age: 35
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1866
Relation: Visitor
Gender: Male
Where born: Manchester, Lancashire, England

Civil parish: Everton
Ecclesiastical parish: St Ambrose
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England

Street Address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:<<Married

Education:

Employment status: View image

Registration district: West Derby
Sub-registration district: South Everton
ED, institution, or vessel: 14
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 51
Piece: 3481
Folio: 172
Page Number: 11
Household Members: Name Age
John Fenlon 39
Eliza Fenlon 38
Adelaide Fenlon 16
Pency Fenlon 11
Reginald Fenlon 7
Elizabeth M Fenlon 4
William H Shaw 35 <<<<<
Nancy Whittington 28
Robert H Whittington 9 Months

Flip

Flip Report 12 Jan 2013 16:23

OK, got half-way through a reply and GR crashed out my message, so this is a bit disjointed:

The sister in law from the 1911 census Harriett McGuinness was Sarah's sister:

Harriet Ellen Challinor
Date of Registration: Jul-Aug-Sep 1898
Registration district: Liverpool
Inferred County: Lancashire
Volume Number: 8b
Page Number: 140 (click to see others on page)
Spouse: Michael McGuinness

The family in 1891
Sarah Challinor
Age: 6
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1885
Relation: Daughter
Father's Name: Robert Challinor
Mother's Name: Harriet Challinor
Gender: Female
Where born: Liverpool, Lancashire, England

Civil parish: Everton
Ecclesiastical parish: St Ambrose
Town: Liverpool
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England

Street Address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Education:

Employment status: View image

Registration district: West Derby
Sub-registration district: South Everton
ED, institution, or vessel: 12
Neighbors: View others on page
Piece: 2944
Folio: 81
Page Number: 28
Household Members: Name Age
Robert Challinor 36
Harriet Challinor 35
Edward Challinor 16
Harriet Challinor 15
Margaret Challinor 13
Frederick Challinor 12
Mary Challinor 10
Robert Challinor 8
Sarah Challinor 6
Thomas Challinor 5

The witnesses at Sarah's marriage were Thomas Gerard? & Mary Ann Challinor - thnk this is their marriage:

Thomas Gerrard Challinor (labourer)
Birth Year: abt 1886
Age: 21
Marriage Date: 18 Aug 1907
Parish: Everton Christ Church
Spouse's Name: Mary Ann Steadman
Father's Name: Robert Gerrard Challinor (labourer)
Spouse Father's Name: John Steadman (fisherman)

Witnesses at this marriage were William Henry & Sarah Ann Shaw!

So, I think we've got the right Sarah, but need to find William Henry Shaw in 1891 to see who he married. Think PH's 1871/81 are right - the father's occupation ties in, but where is he in 1891? Without that census or earlier marriage we can't find his wife's death - if the 1901 census is correct he was still married so I would assume she died shortly before their marriage otherwise they would have probably married earlier.