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Nellie (known as Helen) Farnworth.

ProfilePosted byOptionsPost Date

Brian

Brian Report 18 Jan 2013 16:40

My Gt Aunt Lilian Jemima Bucklar b 25 Oct 1866 d 31Dec 1885 in Hove, East Sussex.
She married Cyril Farnworth (b 1889 in Turton, Lancashire) in Tientsan, China on 8 Oct 1919.
Cyril had 6 siblings all born in Little Bolton, Lancashire, viz Alice b 1875, Ann b 1876, Wilfred b 1879, Frank b 1880, Harry b 1884 and Constance b 1897.
The Will of Lilian left Nellie (aka Helen) Farnworth, her niece, a substantial legacy. Nellie must have presumably been the daughter of either Wilfred, Frank or Harry but my research into her past has so far drawn a blank.
It would be appreciated if anyone can supply further details of Nellie.

Many thanks in anticipation, Brian Bucklar

Andrew

Andrew Report 18 Jan 2013 16:45

She could also have been a daughter of one of the girls born out of wedlock

Andy

patchem

patchem Report 18 Jan 2013 16:49

You have her marrying in 1919, but died in 1885. Is this the other way round?
Who else did she leave her money to, and were there any middle names for them?
Thanks

Added:
For ref:
1911 England Census
Sarah Alice Farnworth Age in 1911: 63 Estimated Birth Year: abt 1848 Relation to Head: Head
Gender: Female Birth Place: Turton, Lancashire, England
Civil parish: Bolton County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England Street Address: Cubbins Sharples Bolton Lancs
Marital Status: Widowed Registration district: Bolton
Registration District Number: 461 Sub-registration district: Tonge
ED, institution, or vessel: 12 Piece: 23361
Sarah Alice Farnworth 63
Alice Farnworth 37 single
Amy Farnworth 35 single
Wilfred Farnworth 32 single
Frank Farnworth 31 single
Henry Farnworth 27 single
Constance Farnworth 24 single
Source Citation: Class: RG14; Piece: 23361; ; .

Reggie

Reggie Report 18 Jan 2013 16:51

Your dates don't make sense

My Gt Aunt Lilian Jemima Bucklar b 25 Oct 1866 d 31Dec 1885 in Hove, East Sussex.
She married Cyril Farnworth (b 1889 in Turton, Lancashire) in Tientsan, China on 8 Oct 1919.

Reggie

Reggie Report 18 Jan 2013 16:53

For the sake of accuracy

England & Wales, Death Index, 1916-2006
Name: Lilian Jemima Farnworth
Birth Date: 26 Oct 1886
Date of Registration: Jan 1986
Age at Death: 99
Registration district: Hove
Inferred County: Sussex
Volume: 18
Page: 1329

Reggie

Reggie Report 18 Jan 2013 16:54

Nellie could have been the wife of a nephew, who'd outlived her husband.

Try some research on freebmd

Catherine

Catherine Report 18 Jan 2013 17:03

for info:-

1891 England Census about Lilian Jemima Bucklar
Name: Lilian Jemima Bucklar
Age: 4
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1887
Relation: Sister
Gender: Female
Where born: Leicester, Leicestershire, England
Civil parish: Islip
Ecclesiastical parish: Islip
Town: Islip
County/Island: Northamptonshire
Country: England
Street Address:

Occupation:

Registration district: Thrapston
Sub-registration district: Thrapston
ED, institution, or vessel: 6
Neighbors: View others on page
Piece: 1220
Folio: 78
Page Number: 22
Household Members:
Name Age
Waller Bucklar 28
Sarah Ann Bucklar 24
Jemina Bucklar 34
Lilian Jemima Bucklar 4

Catherine

Catherine Report 18 Jan 2013 17:04

1901 England Census about Lilian J Bucklar
Name: Lilian J Bucklar
Age: 14
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1887
Relation: Daughter
Father's Name: Harry Bucklar
Mother's Name: Eliza Bucklar
Gender: Female
Where born: Leicestershire, England
Civil parish: Leicester formerly North Evington
Ecclesiastical parish: Evington St Denis
County/Island: Leicestershire
Country: England
Street Address:

Occupation:

Registration district: Leicester
Sub-registration district: North East Leicester
ED, institution, or vessel: 29
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 216
Piece: 2998
Folio: 112
Page Number: 33
Household Members:
Name Age
Harry Bucklar 46
Eliza Bucklar 48
Maud E Bucklar 25
Lilian J Bucklar 14
Ernest E Bucklar 12
Leonard W Bucklar 5
Ivy Sinnett 18

Stuart

Stuart Report 18 Jan 2013 17:13

If her name was Helen Farnworth, then there are only 3 born between 1890 and 1945. The dates presume that the wives of the male siblings of Cyril were approx the same age as their husbands or about earliest date one of the girls could have had a child. They are
1908 - Bolton, Lancs Sep Qtr 8c 445
1920 - Lanchester, Durham Dec Qtr 10a 696
1938 - Leicester Jun Qtr 7a 442 Helen A (mmn Hinton, so a younger bride of one of the brothers, if at all)

If she was Nellie, then there are quite a few, all in Lancs including
1912 - Bolton, Lancs Jun Qtr 8c 672

(Did Lilian make an early will and not change it, as most of these possible nieces could well have pre deceased her or were they a long lived family)

patchem

patchem Report 18 Jan 2013 17:19

Do you know if this is Wilfred's death?
Deaths Dec 1952
FARNWORTH Wilfred 74 Barton 10b 306

There are several possible marriages for him.

There was only one Nellie Farnworth showing on 192.com - living in Wigan in 2002.
She possibly died in 2002, and was born in 1921.
Father could have been John, so leave her out.

Shirley~I,m getting the hang of it

Shirley~I,m getting the hang of it Report 18 Jan 2013 18:08

If Helen was still alive in 1986 when Lilian died then this is the only death after then to 2005

Name: Helen Farnworth
Birth Date: 8 Oct 1909
Date of Registration: Nov 2000
Age at Death: 91
Registration district: Dev & Marl
Register Number: 4D
District and Subdistrict: 7891
Entry number: 7


??
Name: Nellie Farnworth
Age in 1911: 2
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1909
Relation to Head: Granddaughter
Gender: Female
Birth Place: Darwen, Lancashire, England
Civil parish: Darwen
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England
Street Address: 12 Ashworth Terrace
Registration district: Blackburn
Registration District Number: 474
Sub-registration district: Darwen
ED, institution, or vessel: 19
Piece: 25156
Household Members:
Name Age
Margaret Ann Marsden 69
Ann Jane Farnworth 35 married 6 years
Nellie Farnworth 2
Source Citation: Class: RG14; Piece: 25156; ; .


Marriages Sep 1904

Farnworth William Blackburn 8e 937
Marsden Ann Jane Blackburn 8e 937

Brian

Brian Report 18 Jan 2013 18:35

Apologies, but have just noticed that bd of Lilian should be 1886 not 1866

Brian Bucklar

Brian

Brian Report 19 Jan 2013 13:25

Many thanks to all respondents and I apologise for the mistakes in dates. Lilian Bucklar was born 25 Oct 1886 and died 31 Dec 1985

To Andrew. Had not thought about the line that Nelly could have been born to Alice, Ann (Amy?|) or Constance out of wedlock. Should have realised the possibility since my father in law was illegitemate and took the name of his mother.

To Patchman. I had not seen the 1911c but your details tie up and I note that all children were single at the time. Lilian made her will on the 11th day of Oct 1984. Probate was granted on the 3rd day of April 1986 and David John Eric Diplock of 15 Prince Albert Street, Brighton, East Sussex was the named executor. The other executor was Alec Sharples of Battery Cottage, Noss May near Plymouth, Devon. There were 15 named beneficiiaries. The residuary estate was divided into4 equal parts.One was left to Betty Sharples and three shares were left to Nelly.

To Reggie. Yes I got the dates wrong and thanks for the lead to freebmd.

To Catherine. Many thanks for the info.

To Stuart. Many thanks for the info. As above Lilian made her will 11 Oct 1984.

To Shirley. Looks like a match for Nelly (Helen). Could you please give further details of the Reg District Dev & Marl?. Also do you have a volume & Page No of death Certificate?.

Stuart

Stuart Report 19 Jan 2013 13:42

Further details of Shirley's post as requested

Civil Registration event: Death

Name: FARNWORTH, Helen
Registration district: Devizes & Marlborough
County: Wiltshire
Year of registration: 2000
Month of registration: November
Date of birth: 8 October 1909
District no: 7891
Reg no: 4D
Ent no: 007
DOR: 1100

And now! - how does William Farnworth fit??

Shirley~I,m getting the hang of it

Shirley~I,m getting the hang of it Report 19 Jan 2013 16:17

Brian the GRO ref have changed for later death refs i gave the full details you would need to get the death cert.

Devizes & Marlborough registration district).

MARLBOROUGH REGISTRATION DISTRICT

Registration County : Wiltshire.
Created : 1.7.1837.
Abolished : 1.10.1998 (to become part of Devizes & Marlborough registration district).
Sub-districts : Marlborough.
GRO volumes : VIII (1837–51), 5a (1852–1936), 7C (1936–74), 23 (1974–92).
Registers now held by : Wiltshire.

Brian

Brian Report 21 Jan 2013 19:04

To Patcham.
I have Wilfred born 1879 so his death in 1962 could have been possible.

To Shirley.
Your info re Helen/Nelly Farnworth tie up as far as birth date in Oct 19019, death in 2002 aged 91 and aged 2 in thw 1911c . However, the 1911c indicates that Ann Jane Farnworth, nee Marsden was the mother of Nelly and that she married William Farnworth in Sep 1904. The only William Farnworth I have is the father, b 1839 of Cyril (who married Lilian). Not sure whether this is correct but thanks for the data.

I may follow it up with the solicitors who handled Lilian`s estate but donn`t know whether they will divulge any information.

Another lead may be to contact other named beneficiiaries in the will but it is 27 years since Lilian died and I don`t who may still be alive. One contact could be a relation, Joan Thompson, nee Bucklar who was the daughter of Leonard Willet Bucklar, Lilian`s brother.

Many thanks again to all respondents