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Cyril Charles PAYNE/Fanny Rebecca PAYNE/sibs c1863

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Trena Report 6 Mar 2013 23:44

Husband's grandmother ~ Fanny Rebecca PAYNE born c1865 as per census, & d/c ~ except 1881 & m/c when it is c1862-63.

1881 states birth place Bermondsey Surrey. 1891 London, Bermondsey. 1901 Blackfriars. 1911 London.

Married September 1882 Brighton Sx - Benjamin David HEATER

M/c ~ Witnesses: Cyril Charles PAYNE & Ann KENNELLY
Father: Henry PAYNE - Locomotive Engine Driver

Ann KENNELLY was Ben's mother Ann YARWOOD ~ m. 1) David HEATER 2) John KENNELLY 3) Edward ROWLAND)

1881 - Fanny is laundry maid in KENNELLY household.

Try as I might, I cannot find our Fanny's birth. Sometime ago I was in touch with a lady whose ancestor was a Cyril Charles PAYNE. Her chap also had a connection to Brighton, but she was adamant her Cyril Charles PAYNE and the one on Fanny's m/c were not the same person. She also had a different father for her CGP with Brighton birth place, although after marriage he moved (for a time) near Bermondsey/Southwark areas. I wanted to try to sort them out further, but she refused all further communication as she believed I'd erred with my names and info.

Is anyone able to find our Fanny? I've been searching for her for years and cannot believe she is being so elusive.

Many thanks ~ Trena


MarieCeleste Report 6 Mar 2013 23:56

Hi Trena, it's quite possible that her birth was never registered as there was no onus on parents before the mid 1870s

Mike *

Mike * Report 7 Mar 2013 00:08

possibly ???

Births Dec 1862
PAYNE Frances - St Olave 1d 41

St Olave covers Bermondsey


Trena Report 7 Mar 2013 00:11

Cheers MarieCeleste. Just hoping I've overlooked the obvious. Had same problem with my g-gran even though I had an exact birthdate. She was eventually found with completely different spelling of her suranme, which even SP didn't pick up on. Fingers crossed in this case.

Mike *

Mike * Report 7 Mar 2013 00:25

Is this Fanny and CyrilCharles in 1871 ??

Not father Hennry though .

Name: Fanny Payne
Age: 8
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1863
Relation: Daughter
Father's Name: Charles Payne
Mother's name: Mary Payne
Gender: Female
Where born: Bethnal Green
Civil parish: Hackney
Ecclesiastical parish: St Michael and All Angels
County/Island: London
Country: England
Registration district: Hackney
Sub-registration district: South Hackney

Charles Payne 43
Mary Payne 37
Charles Payne 16
Thomas Payne 10
Eliza Payne 17
Fanny Payne 8
Henry Payne 5 Months


Kucinta Report 7 Mar 2013 01:30

Probably the baptism for the St Olave birth Mike posted - doesn't tie in with the info from the marriage cert.

Name: Frances Payne
Record Type: Baptism
Baptism Date: 2 Nov 1862
Father's Name: Frederick William Payne
Mother's name: Elizabeth Payne
Parish or Poor Law Union: Bermondsey Christ Church
Borough: Southwark
Register Type: Parish Registers

Father a mariner.


Trena Report 7 Mar 2013 18:57

Thank you Mike and Kucinta. Much appreciated for the suggestions.

I truly do not believe those given are my husband's family.

I can only go by what was on the 1882 m/c. It clearly has Henry PAYNE as father (locomotive engine driver) and the witness as Cyril Charles PAYNE.

On all census, the m/c, son Cyril's b/c, d/c and headstone, grandma is down as Fanny and/or Fanny Rebecca. When I first saw her name, I too assumed it was for Frances, but eventually came to believe she was actually named Fanny.