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Grace Sanders

ProfilePosted byOptionsPost Date

Julia

Julia Report 26 Apr 2013 11:35

My 2xG Grandmother Grace Sanders was born in Barnstaple/Bideford in, I think 1850/51. She moved to Exeter and was living with a Samuel Coles around 1878, but married a Frank Hole in 1888. She gave birth to a son, Charlie in 1885, illegitimately, but later gave birth to Maud Hole with Frank as the father. Grace has been found in some Exeter newspapers as being a 'woman of loose character' and has been drunk and disorderly along with Samuel Coles.

Her age isn't quite confirmed (she was 10 years older than Frank) so I'm not sure if 1850/51 is correct. But I'm unsure how to find her birth in North Devon. there are a few Grace Sanders, but I would really like to get further back. Her marriage certificate states her father was a seaman and was called Samuel Sanders. But I can't find him either.

Does anyone have any advice of how I can find more about Grace's parentage and earlier life in N. Devon? Probably a visit to the records office, but I'm unsure what I'm looking for!

Thank you. Julia

AnnCardiff

AnnCardiff Report 26 Apr 2013 11:43

Name: Grace Saunders
Event Type: Census
Event Date: 1871
Gender: Female
Age: 20
Relationship to Head of Household: Lodger
Birthplace: Barnstaple, Devonshire
Schedule Type: Household
Registration District: Exeter
Sub-District: St David
Parish: St George
County: Devonshire
Household Gender Age Birthplace
Self Samuel Coles M 20 Exeter, Devonshire
Lodger Grace Saunders F 20 Barnstaple, Devonshire

Shirley~I,m getting the hang of it

Shirley~I,m getting the hang of it Report 26 Apr 2013 11:52

It may be her birth wasn,t registered there were no penalties before 1875 for non reg.

Try FamilySearch site for a possible baptism

Reggie

Reggie Report 26 Apr 2013 11:52

As there were no penalties for not registering births until 1875, your best bet is to look for a baptism

Fredk

Fredk Report 26 Apr 2013 11:52


1911 Census Household Record
Household information
Address 1 Artizans Dwellings Rack St Exeter
Parish Exeter
Town Exeter
Type of Building Private House
Number of Rooms 5
Inhabited Y
Reference RG14PN12684 RG78PN728 RD271 SD1 ED16 SN216
Administrative County Devonshire
Registration District Exeter
Registration Sub District Exeter
Enumeration District 16
Householder 1
Name Francis Hole
Relationship to Head of Household Head
Condition / Years Married Married
Gender M
Age 51
Estimated Year of Birth 1860
Occupation Report Letter
Employed Y
Working at Home N
Industry Gas Company
Place of Birth Exeter Devon
Householder 2
Name Grace Hole
Relationship to Head of Household Wife
Condition / Years Married Married / 24 Years
Total Children Born Alive 4
Children Still Living 4
Gender F
Age 60
Estimated Year of Birth 1851
Employed N
Working at Home N
Place of Birth Mideford Devon
Householder 3
Name Maud Hole
Relationship to Head of Household Daughter
Condition / Years Married Single
Gender F
Age 22
Estimated Year of Birth 1889
Occupation Laundress
Employed Y
Working at Home N
Industry Steam Laundry
Place of Birth Exeter Devon

Potty

Potty Report 26 Apr 2013 11:55

She seems to be consistent with her age and POB on all the censuses but no birth coming up for her in Devon. This is the only Grace with a father Samuel that I can find but he is a bricklayer:

1851 England Census
about Grace Sanders
Name: Grace Sanders
Age: 5
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1846
Relation: Daughter
Father's Name: Samuel Sanders
Mother's Name: Agnes Sanders
Gender: F (Female)
Where born: Biddiford, Devon, England

Civil parish: Pilkington
Ecclesiastical parish: Stand
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England

Street Address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Disability: View image

Registration district: Bury
Sub-registration district: Radcliffe
ED, institution, or vessel: 1g
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 76
Piece: 2216
Folio: 414
Page Number: 21
Household Members: Name Age
Samuel Sanders 30
Agnes Sanders 32
William Sanders 10
Samuel Sanders 8
Grace Sanders 5
Henry Sanders 3


Fredk

Fredk Report 26 Apr 2013 11:56



1891 Census Household Record
Household Information
Address 18, Preston Street
Parish Exeter
District Exeter, Exeter Eastern
Administrative County Devonshire
Householder 1
Name Francis Hole
Age 30
Estimated Year of Birth 1861
Relationship to Head of Household Head
Occupation Masons Labourer
Birth Place Exeter
Birth County Devonshire
Householder 2
Name Grace Hole
Age 40
Estimated Year of Birth 1851
Relationship to Head of Household Wife
Occupation Manglewoman
Birth Place Bideford
Birth County Devonshire
Householder 3
Name Eliza Hole
Age 8
Estimated Year of Birth 1883
Relationship to Head of Household Daughter
Occupation Scholar
Birth Place Exeter
Birth County Devonshire
Householder 4
Name Charles Hole
Age 6
Estimated Year of Birth 1885
Relationship to Head of Household Son
Occupation Scholar
Birth Place Exeter
Birth County Devonshire
Householder 5
Name Maud Hole
Age 3
Estimated Year of Birth 1888
Relationship to Head of Household Daughter
Occupation Scholar
Birth Place Exeter
Birth County Devonshire

Shirley~I,m getting the hang of it

Shirley~I,m getting the hang of it Report 26 Apr 2013 11:57

?


Civil Registration event: Birth

PrintClose
Name: SANDERS, Grace
Registration district: Torrington
County: Devon
Year of registration: 1852
Quarter of registration: Oct-Nov-Dec
Mother's maiden name: Not available before 1911 Q3
Volume no: 5B
Page nos 488

Shirley~I,m getting the hang of it

Shirley~I,m getting the hang of it Report 26 Apr 2013 12:04

Note mum is a seamans wife


1851 census transcription details for: Silver Stret, Saltish

RG number: HO107
Piece: 1900
Folio: 472
Page: 76
Reg. District: St Germans
Sub District: W S Ponter Saltash
Parish:
Enum. District: 4
Ecclesiastical District:
City/Municipal Borough: Saltish
Address: Silver Stret, Saltish
County: Cornwall
Name Relation Condition Sex Age Birth Year Occupation , Disability Where Born
SANDERS, Jane Head Married F 35 1816 Seamans Wife
Saltash, Cornwall
SANDERS, Susan Daughter Unmarried F 9 1842 Scholar
Saltash, Cornwall
SANDERS, Mary J Daughter Unmarried F 5 1846 Scholar
Saltash, Cornwall
SANDERS, Abraham Son Unmarried M 1 1850
Saltash, Cornwall
SANDERS, Grace S Daughter Unmarried F 0 (3 MOS) 1851
Saltash, Cornwall



Wonder if the family later moved to Devon so she thought that was where she was born


Edit wrong family as they are still in Cornwall on later census and hubby was James a Greenwich pensioner

Julia

Julia Report 26 Apr 2013 12:32

Thanks to everyone for their quick replies to this. All very useful. I had picked up some of the census info, but there's a lot of extra info here that I didn't know.

I also knew that Grace's children - especially Charles - called himself Hole. His birth certificate states no father and his name as Charlie Sanders. His marriage certificate states that his name is Charles Sanders Coles and his father as Francis Coles. So the family appear to be mixed up with their information. I understand that Samuel Coles (who Grace once lived with) died three years before Charles was born, so wouldn't be his father, so why give himself that name. My maiden name is Coles, so the name was obviously carried forward. It's all very intriguing.

I suppose they were not educated enough to know a lot of the detail, and as Shirley says - if they moved when Grace was a baby, that might be all she knows. It's certainly worth following up.

Grace is a complex, scatty character I think, and I love her to bits already!

Thanks all :-D

Shirley~I,m getting the hang of it

Shirley~I,m getting the hang of it Report 26 Apr 2013 12:35

Your last post Julie crossed with my edit . seems not to be your Grace Sanders I,m afraid

Julia

Julia Report 26 Apr 2013 12:38

Ah, ok Shirley - no worries, thanks for checking further. Very kind. Ok - so I think I am set on a Bideford/Torrington birth in 1851. I'm only in Exeter myself, so will take a trip up to N Devon to investigate this further I think.
Thanks