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James Cecil Hall

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ProfilePosted byOptionsPost Date

Isobel

Isobel Report 15 May 2013 16:59

Does anyone have access to Canadian birth records please, possibly Quebec? My great grandfather was born 26th June 1900 and having had no luck in UK records, i thought, as his Mother was French, he may be Canadian? Family folklore was that he was the illegitimate son of French nobility, but my late Grandmother said that she only knew his Mother was French, that"s all. Any help greatly appreciated. Oh, and my Great Grandmother went to Canada in @1919 and came back in 1920, maybe with him in tow? Her name was Ivy Scott. Thank you.

Astra

Astra Report 15 May 2013 18:21

Do you have the marriage certificate which should have his father's name and occupation (if he knew it)?

K

K Report 15 May 2013 18:22

Hi Isabel

Does their marriage cert in 1922 list his father?

Kay

AnnCardiff

AnnCardiff Report 15 May 2013 20:25

what's his mother's name?

MarieCeleste

MarieCeleste Report 15 May 2013 21:03

Isobel, can you tell us more about Ivy Scott, e.g. when/where born so can check passenger lists to see who she was with.

EDIT: Given that James Cecil died in Suffolk, is this her death?

England & Wales, Death Index, 1916-2006

Name: Ivy Alice Hall
Birth Date: 25 Jul 1904
Date of Registration: Feb 2004
Age at Death: 99
Registration district: Bury St Edmunds
Inferred County: Suffolk
Register Number: C32D
District and Subdistrict: 742/1C
Entry number: 4

alviegal

alviegal Report 15 May 2013 21:36

Is this their marriage?


England & Wales, Marriage Index, 1916-2005 about Ivy T V Scott
Name: Ivy T V Scott
Spouse Surname: Hall
Date of Registration: Jan-Feb-Mar 1922
Registration district: Pancras
Inferred County: Middlesex
Volume Number: 1b
Page Number: 164
Find Spouse: James C Hall

MarieCeleste

MarieCeleste Report 15 May 2013 21:49

This is the death that matches the birthdate Isobel posted, which is why the Ivy Alice death may fit:

England & Wales, Death Index, 1916-2006
Name: James Cecil Hall
Birth Date: 26 Jun 1900
Date of Registration: Apr 1985
Age at Death: 84
Registration district: Bury St Edmunds
Inferred County: Suffolk
Volume: 10
Page: 2273

However, it doesn't fit the marriage initials and I think that marriage is right.

Need some further input from Isobel.

MarieCeleste

MarieCeleste Report 15 May 2013 21:51

This clarifies the names:

London, England, Electoral Registers, 1832-1965

Name: James Cecil Hall
Year: 1933
County or Borough: Westminster
Ward or Division/Constituency: Paddington
Street Address: 28 Delamere Terrace

at same address is Ivy Theresa Veronica Hall.

alviegal

alviegal Report 15 May 2013 21:51

There is also this death but does not fit with travelling to Canada in c1919 and possibly bringing James back in 1920.



England & Wales, Death Index, 1916-2006 about Ivy Hall
Name: Ivy Hall
Birth Date: 1907
Date of Registration: Feb 1986
Age at Death: 79
Registration district: Bury St Edmunds
Inferred County: Suffolk
Volume: 10
Page: 2749

MarieCeleste

MarieCeleste Report 15 May 2013 21:55

I think this death may belong to the woman on the 1922 marriage and 1933 ER:

England & Wales, Death Index, 1916-2006

Name: Ivy V T Hall
Birth Date: abt 1897
Date of Registration: Apr-May-Jun 1962
Age at Death: 65
Registration district: Willesden
Inferred County: Middlesex
Volume: 5f
Page: 183

Cynthia

Cynthia Report 16 May 2013 12:37

As Isobel is a new poster, I will send her a friendly message on how to find this thread again. :-)

Isobel

Isobel Report 17 May 2013 21:42

Astra: and K: unfortunately i don't have the certificate yet, i have to wait for finances to restock first i'm afraid.

AnnCardiff: I haven't a clue as to his mothers name and there is nobody left alive to ask i'm afraid.

MarieCeleste: Ivy was born in @1897 and died in 1962 after an accident, she comes from Blackpill near Swansea. The address from 1933 fits as i remember Gran talking about Delamere Terrace. The death for James in 1985 is correct also.

***alviegal***: The wedding date is correct too.

I am not sure if i have done this correctly or not, i hope i have, Izzy




MarieCeleste

MarieCeleste Report 17 May 2013 22:30

Hi Izzy, just to mention that when you tick someone's post as answered it actually marks the whole thread as answered (I know it doesn't make sense, but it seems to be a fluke in the way the boards work). When that happens it makes it look as though you don't need any further help.

To remove the answered ticks just go to your first post at the top and there's a button that says "mark this as unanswered" - click on that.

alviegal

alviegal Report 18 May 2013 21:02

So this is your Ivy Scott?

1911 census transcription details for: 6 Arfryn Place Merthyr Tydfil
Print Close

National Archive Reference:

RG14PN32430 RG78PN1855 RD590 SD2 ED6 SN61
Reg. District: Merthyr Tydfil
Sub District: Lower Merthyr Tydfil
Parish: Merthyr Tydfil
Enum. District: 6
Address: 6 Arfryn Place Merthyr Tydfil
County: Glamorganshire
Name Relation Condition/
Yrs married Sex Age Birth Year Occupation Where Born
SCOTT, Philip Head Married M 40 1871 Underground Labourer Stourbridge Worcestershire
SCOTT, Emma Wife Married
15 years F 35 1876 Westbury Servin Gloucestershire
SCOTT, Ivy Daughter F 14 1897 Printers Assistant Black Pill Glamorganshire
SCOTT, Phyllis Daughter F 11 1900 School Black Pill Glamorganshire
SCOTT, Alick Son M 9 1902 School Mumbles Glamorganshire


1901 census transcription details for: 2, Police Station, Woodland Terrace, Brynau, Black Pill
Print Close

National Archive Reference:
RG number: RG13
Piece: 5084
Folio: 7
Page: 5
Reg. District: Gower
Sub District: Gower Eastern
Parish: Brynau
Enum. District: 5
Ecclesiastical District: Oystermouth
City/Municipal Borough:
Address: 2, Police Station, Woodland Terrace, Brynau, Black Pill
County: Glamorganshire
Name Relation Condition Sex Age Birth Year Occupation , Disability Where Born
SCOTT, Philip Head Married M 30 1871 Police Constable
Sturbridge, Worcestershire
SCOTT, Emma Wife Married F 25 1876
Bollow, Gloucestershire
SCOTT, Ivy Daughter F 4 1897
Blackpill Brynan, Glamorganshire
SCOTT, Phyllis Daughter F 1 1900
Blackpill Brynan, Glamorganshire
HOWELL, David Visitor Single M 23 1878 Postman
Swansea, Glamorganshire

alviegal

alviegal Report 18 May 2013 21:15

This is the closest I'm finding but it doesn't quite match.
She was Welsh but was a dairymaid and was going to work as a nurse. She was going to Mrs Sabin? in Quebec. She was a Roman Catholic.


Canadian Passenger Lists, 1865-1935 about Ivy Scott
Name: Ivy Scott
Gender: Female
Age: 19
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1897
Date of Arrival: 14 Aug 1916
Vessel: Sicilian
Search Ship Database: View the 'Sicilian' in the 'Passenger Ships and Images' database
Port of Arrival: Quebec
Port of Departure: Liverpool, England
Roll: T-4816

Isobel

Isobel Report 18 May 2013 23:35

Yes ***alviegal***, that's all spot on! Didn't know the last bit though, i thought she went over in 1919, but the other would work perfectly, thank you! I think she came back in 1920 on the Canada, but i'm not sure, thought she might have brought James back with her, that's why i thought he might be from Quebec, as my Grandmother was adamant that his mother was French. Gran spoke fluent French, which is why she was in Belgium with the S>O>E> in 1944. She said her father had spoken of the "old Count", but didn't ever really mention his parents. The Roman Catholic part fits too, and both Ivy and James were RC. Izzy

mgnv

mgnv Report 19 May 2013 02:33

Here's alviegal's 1916 hit:
http://data2.collectionscanada.gc.ca/e/e145/e003602934.jpg
I read it as Sabin also - there's also a note "Stanley Homes" and another note saying "Workhouse References".
I presume Gower Union Workhouse also operated as an infirmary, so she could have gotten some nursing training there.

I checked the Quebec City directory:
http://bibnum2.banq.qc.ca/bna/marcotte/
I checked both 1915/16 & 1916/17 and neither has any entry for Sabin.

Isobel

Isobel Report 19 May 2013 15:21

Thank you mgnv, i have looked and i think it says Family Home - i wish it was clearer. Sabin was from what i can find, a big name in nursing practices in the early 1900's, interestingly there is a family by the name of Hall attached to nursing in Quebec too. It would tie in with what a cousin told me about Ivy having a medical background of some kind too.

alviegal

alviegal Report 19 May 2013 20:59

Is this what you think is her return? She is a domestic.


UK Incoming Passenger Lists, 1878-1960 about Miss Ivy Scott
Name: Miss Ivy Scott
Port of Departure: Portland, Maine and Halifax, Nova Scotia
Arrival Date: 14 Mar 1920
Port of Arrival: Liverpool, England
Ports of Voyage: Halifax
Ship Name: Canada
Search Ship Database: View the 'Canada' in the 'Passenger Ships and Images' database
Shipping Line: White Star Dominion Line
Official Number: 106806

Isobel

Isobel Report 19 May 2013 23:34

***alviegal*** Possibly, she had to come back to the UK before 1922 when she got married. But we might have a little spanner in the works as there was rumour of a child born before 1922 called Cecilly J, born the end of 1920 in Kensington, who could quite possibly be James and Ivy's child.........