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Hugh Adam McFadzean FINDLAY b1869

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ProfilePosted byOptionsPost Date

Sheila

Sheila Report 22 Aug 2013 18:12

I am getting a bit confused about the marriages of Hugh I have that his 1st marriage was to Jeanie McLanachan in 1894 had 1 son Hugh b 1897, 2nd marriage to Janet McCarlie in 1901 they had 6 children from 1902 to 1915 now yesterday I found a 3rd marriage to Eugena "Gena" Crawford Graham in 1908.

How can he have children with Janet in 1910-12 and 15 when it looks as if he was not married to her at that time.

On in-coming and out-going passenger lists Hugh is traveling with Gena to Montreal.

Please can anyone sort it for me.

Thank you

Sheila

MarieCeleste

MarieCeleste Report 22 Aug 2013 19:06

Hello Sheila, where was Hugh born, where are these marriages alleged to have taken place and where were the children born?

I'd rather not explain on here how he may have had children with a woman he wasn't apparently married to! ;-)

The first thing that crossed my mind was perhaps he was of a faith that permitted polygamy?

MarieCeleste

MarieCeleste Report 22 Aug 2013 19:12

There are numerous (too many to post) shipping lists for him as a seaman. The arrival in Canada states he was a mariner.

Perhaps he had a wife in several ports? Do you have all of the marriage certificates?

MarieCeleste

MarieCeleste Report 22 Aug 2013 19:21

A couple of years ago someone called Barry posted on this thread:
http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/boards/board/ancestors/thread/1273729

He has a connection to Hugh so you may want to try contacting him by pm to see if he has any further info.

EDIT: Just copying his post from that thread

"I have been looking into my daughter-in-law's tree. She has Findlay ancestors from the Kilmarnock/Mauchline/Sorn area.

I have Francis Findlay b. c1790 married Agnes Martin b.c1793 - Francis was a farmer.
Their son Hugh Findlay b. 1818 married Elizabeth McFadzean b. 1828
marriage 24.11.1863 - Kilmarnock 597/00 175 Hugh was a gardener.

Their son Hugh Adam McFadzean Findlay b. 18.07.1869 Lonnport, Kilmarnock 597/00 0543 married Jeanie McLanachan b.1875 in 1894 Kilmarnock 597/00 0067
Hugh was a marine engineer and Jeanie a domestic servant. Jeanie died 1899 age 24 death Kilmarnock 597/00 0014

Hugh remarried on 17.07.1901 to Janet Elizabeth McCarlie of Sorn, Ayr
Their daughter Elizabeth McFadzean Findlay b. Glasgow 1912 married Edward John Cumming b. Jun Q 1914 Edmonton, London in Stoke Newington Jun Q 1936."

MarieCeleste

MarieCeleste Report 22 Aug 2013 19:30

There's a photo of Hugh on this record - do you have it?

Merchant Navy Seamen 1835-1941

Last name: FINDLAY
First names: Hugh Adam
Age:
Day of birth: 18 Month of birth: July Year of birth: 1870
Place of birth: Kilmarnock
County/country of birth: Ayrshire
Card type: CR10
Discharge number: 598018
Identity certificate no.: 112795
Series: BT350
Date range: 1918-1921

Sheila

Sheila Report 22 Aug 2013 21:07

Hello MarieCeleste,

Thank you for the information which matches what I have.
I will see if I can get in touch with Barry.
I found on UK Incoming Passenger List 1878-1960 Gena Crawford Graham.
Glasgow Scotland September 16th 1923 Ship Saturnia Hugh is also there with address given as 72 Gt George St .Glasgow.
I then looked on Scotlandspeople where I found their marriage in 1908 District Hillhead-Glasgow , Lanark Gros Data 644/12 , 0086.
I do not have any photos so I will look for the one you mentioned.
I also have Hugh and Elizabeth as his parents and it looks like a 2nd marriage for his father 1st marriage to Agnes Brown b 1820, no other information.

Thank you
Sheila

MarieCeleste

MarieCeleste Report 22 Aug 2013 21:43

Hi Sheila

I still had that image open so I've sent it to you by private message.

I'll have a look through those crew lists and see if there are any addresses.

MarieCeleste

MarieCeleste Report 22 Aug 2013 21:48

This looks like a business trip, he's a marine engineer:

New York, Passenger Lists, 1820-1957

Name: Hugh Adam Findlay
Arrival Date: 14 Apr 1936
Birth Date: abt 1870
Birth Location: Scotland
Birth Location Other: Kilmarnook
Age: 66
Gender: Male
Ethnicity/ Nationality: English
Place of Origin: England
Port of Departure: Southampton, England
Port of Arrival: New York, New York
Ship Name: Aquitania

Gives next of kin as wife Janet McCarlie Findlay at 128 Clapham Common, London.

MarieCeleste

MarieCeleste Report 22 Aug 2013 21:51

No middle name on this:

New York, Passenger Lists, 1820-1957

Name: Hugh Findlay
Arrival Date: 22 Oct 1914
Birth Date: abt 1870
Birth Location: Scotland
Birth Location Other: Glasgow, Scotland
Age: 44
Gender: Male
Ethnicity/ Nationality: Scottish (Scotish)
Port of Departure: Liverpool, England
Port of Arrival: New York, New York
Ship Name: Adriatic

A master mariner. NOK Mrs Gena Findlay 25 Willow Bank, Glasgow.

MarieCeleste

MarieCeleste Report 22 Aug 2013 21:54

This one's the Canada arrival with Gena, purpose of visit is "pleasure"

Canada, Ocean Arrivals (Form 30A), 1919-1924
Name: Hugh Findlay
Gender: Male
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1869
Birth Place: Glasgow, Scotland
Age: 54
Date of Arrival: 1923
Port of Arrival: Quebec
Port of Departure: Glasgow, Scotland
Ship Name: Athenia

Occupation Mariner. Religion Scottish Presbyterian (just in case it's relevant).

MarieCeleste

MarieCeleste Report 22 Aug 2013 21:56

Sheila, sorry if this is a daft question - but you have actually looked at both marriage certificates to check that the parents info for Hugh is the same on each?

MarieCeleste

MarieCeleste Report 22 Aug 2013 22:04

I'm really wondering if there were two Hugh Findlays or if he was just very brazen?

On this one he's travelling with Gena. He says his next of kin at home is brother James Crawford Findlay in London.

Canadian Passenger Lists, 1865-1935

Name: Hugh Findlay
Gender: Male
Age: 63
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1871
Birth Country: Scotland
Date of Arrival: 26 Aug 1934
Vessel: Sulairia
Port of Arrival: Montreal, Quebec
Port of Departure: Glasgow, Scotland
Roll: T-14913

This is two years before the record where the nok is wife is Janet McCarlie Findlay.

MarieCeleste

MarieCeleste Report 22 Aug 2013 22:12

Sheila, they are two different Hugh Findlays.

This is the probate for the death of your Hugh:

England & Wales, National Probate Calendar (Index of Wills and Administrations), 1858-1966
Name: Hugh Adam McFadzean Findlay
Probate Date: 30 Mar 1945
Death Date: 10 Mar 1945
Death Place: London, England
Registry: Llandudno

Lived 12 Bethune Road London. Died Northumberland House, Green Lane, London. Probate to Alexander Findlay, naval architect and Adam McCarlie Findlay Capt HM Army. Effects £286 19s
.......................................................................................................

Four years after your Hugh died there is this arrival in Canada

UK, Incoming Passenger Lists, 1878-1960

Name: Capt Hugh Findlay
Birth Date: abt 1870
Age: 79
Port of Departure: Montréal, Québec, Canada
Arrival Date: 26 Oct 1949
Port of Arrival: Glasgow, Scotland
Ports of Voyage: Montreal
Ship Name: Laurentia
Shipping Line: Donaldson Line
Official Number: 180899

Travelling with wife Gena C G Findlay.
....................................................................................................................

It's a big coincidence with the names, birthplaces and naval connections but proof that your Hugh wasn't a bigamist and they were two entirely different people.

MarieCeleste

MarieCeleste Report 22 Aug 2013 22:35

Just to tidy up - I've tracked Hugh Adam Findlay from 1922 to 1939 at 128 Clapton Common on the London electoral rolls, wife Janet with him. In 1945 they're at 12 Bethune Road which was his home address when he died.

Sheila

Sheila Report 23 Aug 2013 17:11

Hi MarieCeleste.

The biggest THANK YOU for all the work you have done for me.
I am doing this for my friend John and his brother,
I never thought of there being two with all the same details as John could remember an Aunt Gen that is what made me think Gena Crawford had to be right.
I know these things happen because it happened to me when I was on my own Tree looking for my grandfather it wasn`t until I found a living cousin and he put me straight his grandfather was my grandfather`s brother and he had all the family tree going back 8 generations so that saved me a lot of work.

Now just one more thing about the daughter of Hugh and Janet, Elizabeth who married Edward John Cumming where can I look to see if she later married Frederic Roy Crepin or was it her sister Euphemia Taylor Findlay b 1906 who married him.

Once again thank you for everything.

Best wishes
Sheila

safc

safc Report 23 Aug 2013 18:20

Marriages Mar 1928 (>99%)
CREPIN Frederic R Findlay Hackney 1b 511 xxxxx
FAUX Alice R Triggs Hackney 1b 511
FINDLAY Euphemia T Crepin Hackney 1b 511 xxxxxx
Triggs Arthur Faux Hackney 1b 511

MarieCeleste

MarieCeleste Report 23 Aug 2013 18:26

Hi Sheila, I did notice on the London ER that sometimes Janet was recorded as Jeanette (sometime Scots even change it to Jenette or similar) so that may be "Aunt Jen".

It was Euphemia who became Mrs Crepin:

England & Wales, Marriage Index, 1916-2005

Name: Euphemia T Findlay
Spouse Frederic R Crepin
Date of Registration: Jan-Feb-Mar 1928
Registration District: Hackney
Inferred County: Middlesex
Volume Number: 1b
Page Number: 511

MarieCeleste

MarieCeleste Report 23 Aug 2013 18:27

Her death:

England & Wales, Death Index, 1916-2007
Name: Euphemia Taylor Crepin
Birth Date: 2 May 1906
Date of Registration: Sep 1969
Age at Death: 63
Registration District: Northampton
Inferred County: Northamptonshire
Volume: 3b
Page: 1433

MarieCeleste

MarieCeleste Report 23 Aug 2013 18:34

Sheila, re: your question where to look for a marriage - always start with FreeBMD http://www.freebmd.org.uk/

Sheila

Sheila Report 23 Aug 2013 20:32

Thank you MarieCeleste that has all been a great help I can now put things in order.

I have now found that Elizabeth remarried in 1964 to Alfred Charles Jolliffe Stevens in Stoke Newington

Sheila.