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Street search on the 1911 census?

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ProfilePosted byOptionsPost Date

Flip

Flip Report 15 Oct 2013 00:20

Do you have his parents marriage -

Daniel Logan (mariner)
Birth Year:abt 1851
Age:23
Marriage Date:6 May 1874
Parish:Liverpool, All Saints
Spouse's Name:Rebecca Tipping
Father's Name:Daniel Logan (labourer)
Spouse Father's Name:John Tipping (Boiler maker)
Reference Number:83 ALS/3/3

Both of 8 Court, Horatio street. witnesses John Broadhurst & Mary Ann Swinburn

Pam

Pam Report 15 Oct 2013 10:18

Hi Flip

Yes I have their marriage and Daniel and Rebecca with their children.

I have only found two cousins from my granddads siblings and none of them new of my granddads life

I'm beginning to think maybe he was a bit of an outcast because of his deafness and more so because he married a catholic.

Daniel (the mariner) was the son of Daniel and Sarah Mosely
This is where the plot thickens.
Daniel vanishes after the registration of his son ( who was registered by both parents)
Young Daniel then appears on the 1861 census I think it is living as a lodger with a Sarah and William White.

I found it weird that young Daniel named his children after Williams mother Elizabeth and his daughter Georgina. So I investigated further and found a marriage for a William White and Sarah Mosely
I believe Sarah White is Daniels mother.



Pam

Pam Report 15 Oct 2013 12:00

Thank you for John's christening Flip.

Yes I have them on census but trying to find anything else on Rebecca born Ireland draws a blank
There is a Rebecca with father John and mother Maria born Liverpool on the 1861 but with Rebecca saying Ireland and then Belfast on the 1911 either she is fibbing and she was born Liverpool and maybe disowned her family or she was born in Ireland.
Rebecca and Daniel named a daughter Maria!

Pam


Flip

Flip Report 15 Oct 2013 13:16

There's a tree on ancestry, which claims she was born in Liverpool, after looking at the 1861 census all 3 children are down as born Liverpool, and neither parent from Ireland. Quotes parents John & Mariah, but no maiden name for her.

The tree goes on to say she died at 86 China street, 1/12/1929 of a cerebral haemorrhage.

Bearing in mind she was born Rochdale, and him in Cheshire, I think this could be their marriage, John is a boiler maker - the same as on 1861 census.

John Tipping
Age: Full Age
Marriage Date: 19 Aug 1839
Parish: Prestwich, St Mary
Parish as it Appears: Prestwich
Father's Name: William Tipping
Spouse's Name: Maria Clegg
Spouse's Father's Name: James Clegg
Reference Number: L160/1/4/15
Item Number: 2
Archive Roll: 595

Added, Just realised, this matches the info given on her marriage - father John, boiler maker. Think Ireland was a fantacy!

Pam

Pam Report 15 Oct 2013 13:39

That's what I thought.

I had a feeling maybe she had a spat with her father or he wasn't a very nice dad for some reason and she washed her hands of him but not her mother.

I did trace that family and keep them as a possible for Rebecca's family.
My two cousins are convinced Rebecca was Irish but I have this niggling doubt.
Maybe she didn't want to be linked to them, or them to her

Pam

Pam Report 15 Oct 2013 15:21

I could never find a marriage for Daniel Logan and Sarah Mosley the parents of Daniel (my great grandfather).
I do not know if in fact they were married.

HeyJudeB4Beatles

HeyJudeB4Beatles Report 15 Oct 2013 15:56

I'll have a looksee later...but the fact she married William White as Moseley suggests she and Daniel were never married (or else she would be Logan)

Jude

Pam

Pam Report 15 Oct 2013 16:01

Or she fibbed lol.

Yes I do agree.
What I don't understand is why they both registered Daniel.
Unless there was I'll will between them and his father made sure he got his surname!!
He is on freebmd twice with two different volume numbers.
I do have his birth certificate but I can't get to my research for a few days
Hubby is painting a big piece of furniture in front of my stationery cupboard.

Pam

Pam Report 15 Oct 2013 16:10

My grandson has a copy of my research he is going to look up the birth certificate of Daniel when he gets home.

Flip

Flip Report 15 Oct 2013 20:37

Pam, I'm not convinced by your hypothesis. If both parents registered him I would expect him to appear under his mmn and his fathers name - not both under Logan. Although I'm drawing on recent experience for this, well fairly recent anyway.

Do you have either or both the BC's? I think they may be 2 different children.

Flip

Flip Report 15 Oct 2013 20:39

Incidentely, and not connected, what type of dog is that in your avatar? It's really cute!

Pam

Pam Report 15 Oct 2013 20:52

Hi Flip

They are the same child I had a lengthy conversion over the phone with the register office as the lady had never come across it before.
She looked it up for me.
When I enquirer about it you could have three free checks that a cert you were wanting was the right one.
I do have his birth cert by his mothers registering of him but its too awkward to get to right now
I'm waiting on my grandson getting home to send me details as he has a copy

The avatar pic is my one year old Shih-Tzu named Kimball-Cho
And yes he's as cheeky and adorable as he looks.

Flip

Flip Report 15 Oct 2013 21:04

OK, I'll take my skeptisim back (even though I can't spell it). Unusual though for both parents to register the birth, but not together. Had they already fallen out?

And I love your dog, I've got a female Llassa Apso, bit bigger than normal, but cute all the same. Does he need a girlfriend? Just trying to promote my potential day job as a dating agency!

Pam

Pam Report 15 Oct 2013 21:10

It's with a c lol

Yes I wondered if there had been a bad falling out and maybe she threatened to register him in a different Christian name and he took the ump hand made sure by doing it himself.

As l say there's nothing of him after that. I have no idea what became of him.

The marriage for a Sarah Mosely and William White took place in 1957 so l would imagine enough time for her to divorce him if he deserted her!

What a lot I have, why couldn't they be just normal.
It was easier tracing my husbands line of Morris's back to the early 1800s than any of my dad's side.

The Lhasa apso is a lovely breed to.

Too late for kimball to have a girlfriend he got the snip when he was six months old, he wasn't a happy boy
We have a Parson Russell cross something or other he is eight and a half, they are great house buddies

Flip

Flip Report 15 Oct 2013 21:33

I doubt divorce came into the equation - it was too expensive for most people back then, and women couldn't divorce their husbands, believe it or not - although husbands could divorce wives.

If she remarried, either it was bigamously, or he was already dead, or they never married in the first place. Whichever way, I doubt you'll ever find out unless someone can find a death for the first "husband".

I have girls lining the block to meet Kimball-Cho, they've ogled over his photo - do you think he would like a platonic relationship? Gotta make a buck somewhere!

Only joking!

Pam

Pam Report 15 Oct 2013 21:54

What was I thinking of course it was only the man who could divorce, my head is on another planet.

I bet she just married William and good on her, she seems to have given Daniel a decent father figure as he followed him into going to sea and sailed out of Liverpool for 25 years.

I trawled the. Deaths more than once looking for Daniels death but never found anything.
I thought he may have gone off to Ireland or re invented himself somewhere else
Maybe he just went where the work was and forgot to return home!

Now now girls calm down Sam will get jealous.

He's so affectionate with everyone even cats lol he just loves to be fussed over and loves children to bits.
He also loves camping and riding on my wheelchair when his legs get tired.

We took him and Sam the forest when he was a puppy and he wanted to go and play with a really big horse.
The rider thought he was adorable.

Pam

Pam Report 15 Oct 2013 22:07

I must sign out now.

Goodnight all.

Flip

Flip Report 16 Oct 2013 06:13

Danl Logan

Death Place:Ballt Naz H, Victoria
Age:77
Father's Name:Danl Logan
Mother's Name:Ann Shiels
Registration Year:1904
Registration Place:Victoria
Registration number:3655
Estimated Birth Year:abt 1827

Have you checked this one out - when I looked at the 1851 census for Sarah/Daniel ancestry was suggesting this link?

Flip

Flip Report 16 Oct 2013 06:30

There's a Daniel Logan on the 1841 census (age 13), although relationships are not given he is with Daniel (50) and Ann, both born Ireland. There is also a catholic christening for him in Liverpool

St Mary's 5/8/1827, born 31/7/1827, parents Daniel & Ann. Sponsors Philip Hughes & Mary Mahon

Flip

Flip Report 16 Oct 2013 06:41

A Daniel Logan arrived in Melbourne, Victoria, Australia in July 1854, having sailed from Liverpool on the Monteagle, nationality English. No image available though someone with better knowledge of Aus records may be able to find out more.

Added: From Victoria immigration records he was an adult (no age given), and was the only Logan on that ship.