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mother's Birth Certificate

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ProfilePosted byOptionsPost Date

mouseman

mouseman Report 10 Mar 2011 16:42

Hello Madmeg

I have not sent for the death certificate of Ada May Jones.... yet.
Born July 1910 and died in Blackpool........2002.

What would this tell me.... I know it would or should tell me where she was born but what would other information would I gain.

Speak again to the novice
Margaret.

Corrinne

Corrinne Report 10 Mar 2011 16:55

Hi Margaret.
please can you just clarify where/what county do you think your mum was born in? is it blackpool or durham? or somewhere else?
Thanks

mouseman

mouseman Report 10 Mar 2011 20:44

Hello Corrinne

My mother Ada May Alderson was born in Lanchester. Co.Durham
On the 1911 census Ada May is listed as under 8 months with her mum Sarah Jane Alderson at the home of her grandparents.she married my father in Bradford Yorkshire 1927 they separated around 1938/40.

I thank you for your help but feel you have not read previous pages from the other helpers

Many Thanks
Margaret

Madmeg

Madmeg Report 10 Mar 2011 23:41

Hi Margaret

The death cert will tell you nothing right now. It won't tell you where she was born. It will only tell you where she died, who her husband was, and who registered the death.

EDIT - I was forgetting it was 2002 - thanks Kay - my brain had knocked 100 years off! Yes, it should show place of birth, maiden surname of a woman who has married, and the "qualification" of the informant, e.g. husband.

So don't spend any more money yet.

EDIT - I'm afraid I would risk another certificate

I am going to have to sit down and think about all this, I was so convinced I was right, I am most upset about the outcome. I'm still not convinced I'm wrong, but proving it might be impossible.

Meg

Madmeg

Madmeg Report 11 Mar 2011 00:38

The only birth suitable for Ada is the one found by Rutland Belle, March Qtr 1910 in Gateshead, Co Durhand. No middle name.

But that child would not be under 9 months on the 1911 census. Under 12 months, yes. Maybe somebody miscalculated. But there is an Ada Alderson with a different family in Durham who fits the bill for the one born March 1910.

I tried looking for Ada Brankston or Branston, no luck.

I am thwarted with the birth - does anybody agree?

So let's look at the Ada Margaret Powell who married Fred Barker in 1941. She gives her father as Alfred. If this is "our" Margaret, her first husband was Alfred Thomas Powell. I am guessing that she never knew who her real father was. There are no other children called Powell, with mother's maiden name Alderson, after the date of adding mothers maiden name Alderson - 1913? So maybe Ada Margaret (she might not have remembered she was called Ada May, or made up Margaret) just said she was a spinster, and also made up a father Alfred, as per her first husband's name. And she said he was deceased when he wasn't. Or maybe he was, she didn't know.

The age when this Ada Margaret married Fred Barker is pretty spot on to be Ada May (30). Though she says she is a spinster. Well, her first husband wasn't dead so she may have lied. However, there is no Ada May or Ada Margaret Powell born in the North, an odd Ada M, in Liverpool.

On her next marriage to John A Jones, when both names are recorded - both Alderson and Barker, she names her father as Alfred Thomas, a market gardener. Not deceased. Her age then is 39, a little low, but not significant. And she has lied again about her father, He was Alfred, yes, but he first husband was Alfred too.

Sorry Margaret, but I still feel I have the right lady. Even though her middle name is now Margaret not May.

Peeps, I don't know how to prove I am right, but I think I am. I don't think there is any proof possible. Suggestions please. I hate making assumptions, but sometimes you have to do so.

Margaret


Vera2010

Vera2010 Report 11 Mar 2011 00:53

Madmeg/Margaret

I have just popped into this one. I was just having a look for Ada May dob which is very elusive. Gateshead as you rmay know is not near to Durham although it was in Co Durham. Now goodness knows where Tyne and Wear, Sth Tyneside.

I have had a look at Durham bmds which are on line and loojked for Branston Brankston without any luck.too

Going to read what you have done so far looks like a lot of work..

Vera

Madmeg

Madmeg Report 11 Mar 2011 01:00

The comforting thing is that the death in Blackpool in 2002 is Ada May Jones. Not Ada Margaret.

So I am still of the belief that Ada May Jones who died in Blackpool is the Ada Margaret Alderson/Barker who married John A Jones in 1952.

I can't possibly tell you to spend another £9.25 that might not be right, but if it were me, and I wasn't eating up the kids' spending money, I would send for that death cert. It would at least tell us that all my suppositions were rubbish, and I will grovel forever. I'm so sorry the other certs didn't bring any proof, but I still feel it is the right person.

PLEASE can anyone else tell Margaret I am possibly right? I don't feel comfortable being out on a limb with all this.

Meg

JaneyCanuck

JaneyCanuck Report 11 Mar 2011 03:18

o m g, M m !

Madmeg asked me to have a look and see what I thought, since I'm sometimes a good ferret. ;)

I haven't got anything like the time tonight (it's just after 10 here in my bit of Canada and I have work to finish and send in before I sleep) to read 7 pages ! of posts -- or probably anytime in the next few days.

So if I stick this here it will remind me to look back at it ... a while later ... and I'll have a think when I have two spare brain cells and 2 spare hours!

Kay????

Kay???? Report 11 Mar 2011 08:01

If its any use.

a 2002 English/Welsh death certificate will have ---if known.

date and place of birth, maiden name and if shes a widow of ?? some do name the man some dont,, plus his occupation.

Madmeg

Madmeg Report 11 Mar 2011 11:18

Margaret, I've just been re-reading all this, and towards the top of page 2 you say the informant of the death of your grandmother, Sarah Jane Thurlby in 1933 was Ada May Alderson, but a bit lower down you say it was A Powell. Which is correct?

Also, I looked again at your posting re the marriage to John A Jones in 1952 - you say it gives Ada Margaret Alderson otherwise Alderson - didn't you mean "otherwise Barker"? I wonder how she managed to convince the registrar that she was a spinster.

Madmeg

Madmeg Report 11 Mar 2011 11:53

I can only find this birth for a possible Ada M(argaret) Alderson who would have been 39 on 13 Oct 1952:

Births Mar 1913 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Alderson Ada M Pattison Reeth 9d 1331

If that is the one who married John A Jones, whose father was Alfred Thomas Alderson, then I cannot find a marriage of such a man to a woman with the surname Pattison.

This is the only suitable marriage of an Alderson to a Pattison, rather later than 1913.

Marriages Dec 1919 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Alderson Harry F W Pattison Leeds 9b 804
Pattison Ivy E Alderson Leeds 9b 804

Kay is right, a death cert in 2002 should show date and place of birth and maiden name. I think you'll have to get it, just to be convinced I am wrong.

jansmith

jansmith Report 11 Mar 2011 12:31

Meg did you also see this on 1st page ?
Do you think that is the same child registered in Gateshead?
England & Wales, FreeBMD Death Index: 1837-1915
about Ada Alderson Name: Ada Alderson
Estimated birth year: abt 1909
Year of Registration: 1911
Quarter of Registration: Oct-Nov-Dec
Age at Death: 2
District: Gateshead
County: Durham, Tyne and Wear
Volume: 10a
Page: 1019

Vera2010

Vera2010 Report 11 Mar 2011 13:52

Margaret

Just wondering how Ada May who was born in Co Durham ended up living and marrying in Bradford, Yorkshire. Have you any knowledge of this?

Regards

Vera

Corrinne

Corrinne Report 11 Mar 2011 15:01

Margaret
"I thank you for your help but feel you have not read previous pages from the other helpers"

I have read the previous pages many times, however the thread isn,t crystal clear. Many things do not add up and I think some of the people you have found may not all be part of your family and that is where it is confusing, you need to check carefully what you have as it is so easy to go down the wrong line.

no offence meant I am only trying to help

Margaret in Sussex

Margaret in Sussex Report 11 Mar 2011 16:10

Please correct me if I am wrong....

You say that you have ada may's marriage cert.....
23rd july 1927..Bfd... gives her age as 18......

If I am right then I think that means that she was born 1909/10 !!

Sarah Jane married dec 1909 so could it be that she is the ada reg march Q 1910 Gateshead ....& Sarah Jane is trying to cover fact that she was with child at marriage . Possibly to her parents?

Corrinne

Corrinne Report 11 Mar 2011 16:15

Margaret.
I wonder have you ever found any other siblings for Ada May besides the half siblings when her mother re married in 1918. I am surprised that no other children have been born prior to the second marriage.
Has a death of Thomas Alderson yet to be found? does he definately have a midddle name?

On the Death Certificate 1933 it gives person present at the time of death A Powell could this stand for Alfred or Ada?

what about this birth registration mistranscribed.
Births Jun 1909
ANDERSON Ada May Gateshead 10a 1172

half siblings.
1916 rachel thurlby, and john thurlby 1918 both born out of wedlock???







Margaret in Sussex

Margaret in Sussex Report 11 Mar 2011 16:32

Just a thought......... Could have been born in Lanchester BUT registered in Bradford / Leeds area...ie... Holbeck ..... I have one like that... born wellingbro. reg wakefield.!!

Madmeg

Madmeg Report 11 Mar 2011 17:01

Reading through again, and bearing in mind people's doubts I'm now even less certain of anything.

Can I summarise the position as Margaret sees it so far?

You know your father was Alfred Thomas Powell, and who his parents were, because you grew up at their home, 16 Midland Terrace, Bradford, which your mother left when you were young.

You know that your father married Ada May Alderson in Bradford in 1927, because you have the cert. She gave her age as 18 (which may have been untrue) and said her father was Thomas (no middle name) Alderson deceased (which also may have been untrue).

You know that a lady called Sarah Jane Thurlby died "up North" in 1933 and the informant was - A Powell? or Ada May Alderson? You have used both names. The informant lived at 16 Midland Terrace, Bradford, so clearly a relative of yours. And you have the cert.

You know that Sarah Jane Thurlby was previously Sarah Jane Alderson, formerly Brankston cos you have both marriage certs, and the second says she was a widow.

You have found a family of Brankstons in 1911 with a daughter Sarah Jane Alderson and a g/d Ada May age 8 months.

Folks, that all sounds pretty reasonable to me.

Margaret, can you answer my question regarding the surnames of the bride on the marriage of Ada May Barker/Alderson and confirm it says Spinster. Where did they marry?

jansmith

jansmith Report 11 Mar 2011 18:24

think this is the Holbeck one to dismiss it? 1911
ALDERSON, Richard Head Married M 41 1870 Compositor Yorks New Wortley Leeds
ALDERSON, Florence Wife
married 17 years F 41 1870 Yorks Holbeck Leeds
ALDERSON, Arthur Tempest Son M 15 1896 Bookbinder Yorks Holbeck Leeds
ALDERSON, Henry Son M 13 1898 Tailor Yorks Holbeck Leeds
ALDERSON, William Son M 6 1905 Yorks Holbeck Leeds
ALDERSON, Dorothy Daughter F 5 1906 Yorks Holbeck Leeds
ALDERSON, Ada Daughter F 1 1910 Yorks Holbeck Leeds

jansmith

jansmith Report 11 Mar 2011 18:29

? The Gateshead one 1911
Registration District:
Gateshead

ALDERSON, William Head Married M 36 1875 Coal Miner Hewer Bishop Auckland Co of Durham
ALDERSON, Lizzie Jane Wife
Married 14 years F 33 1878 Shinoy Row Co of Durham
ALDERSON, Thomas Son M 11 1900 School So Shields Co of Durham
ALDERSON, Robert Son M 9 1902 Coxgreen Durham
ALDERSON, Adam Son M 7 1904 Coxgreen Durham
ALDERSON, Norman Son M 5 1906 Coxgreen Durham
ALDERSON, William Son M 2 1909 Felling Durham
ALDERSON, Ada Daughter F 1 1910 Felling Durham