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Army Records

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ProfilePosted byOptionsPost Date

Michele

Michele Report 7 May 2012 19:10

I would really like to know if my granddad fought over seas, he was Christopher McDonnell b 1881 he was in the Royal Irish Rifles 5th Battalion, he's rank was Private, all i know is he enlisted in 1910 in Dublin and had his final discharge in 1916 as no longer physically fit.
He enlisted at Island Bridge Barracks,

DF

DF Report 7 May 2012 19:50

Hi,
Try asking your question on www.circlecity.co.uk/wartime/board/index.php. Absolutely brilliant site.
Deb

Michele

Michele Report 7 May 2012 19:53

thanks DF i'll give it a go

Michele

Michele Report 7 May 2012 19:56

I was told 5th battalion were the reserves so wondered if they got to fight over seas any where

GinaS

GinaS Report 8 May 2012 14:45

Hi Michelle,

All british army records were brought back to Britain, when I am not sure, but quite a few years ago.

GinaS

rootgatherer

rootgatherer Report 9 May 2012 12:29

The records for this man are on Ancestry. Year of birth out but interestingly he finished his term in 1910 so I wondered if he is your man who re-enlisted?

Name: Christopher McDonnell
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1879
Age at enlistment: 19
Birth Parish: Ballyboughal
Birth County: Dublin
Document Year: 1898
Regimental Number: 6481
Regiment Name: Royl Dublin Fusrs
Number of images: 18


The above served in South Africa 1899 - 1902 and Aden 1903.

His NOK is older brother James of Donaba...(?) Co. Dublin.

Porkie_Pie

Porkie_Pie Report 9 May 2012 12:58

GinaS, British army records never left britain?

Your sevice record from service overseas would have just been added to your main record back in the uk,

when serving overseas only basic records that were needed for that tour such as your next of kin card pay and admin docs (usualy copies) would follow you on your tour abroad

Roy

Potty

Potty Report 9 May 2012 14:46

This could be his "medal card", although no medals are listed. Image shows date of discharge as 17/1/1916 due to "Sickness". Enlistment date 3/09/1914:

Name: Chris McDonnell
Regiment or Corps: Royal Irish Rifles
Regimental Number: 5/8217

was plain ann now annielaurie

was plain ann now annielaurie Report 9 May 2012 17:08

The Medal Roll for the man found by Potty shows he was awarded the Silver War Badge. It states that he did not serve overseas.

Porkie_Pie

Porkie_Pie Report 9 May 2012 17:47

The Silver War Badge, sometimes wrongly referred to as the Silver Wound Badge, was instituted from 12 September 1916 under Army Order 316. It is a circular badge with the legend "For King and Empire - Services Rendered" surrounding the King George V cypher. The badge had a pin for wear as a brooch.

The badge was awarded to all of those military personnel who had served at home or overseas during the war, and who had been discharged from the army under King's Regulations. Expiry of a normal term of engagement did not count and the most commonly seen KR is 392(xvi), meaning the soldier had been released on account of being permanantly physically unfit.

It was possible to be awarded a badge if the man had not served overseas - and if his service record is now lost this may be the only remaining evidence of service for such a soldier


From http://www.1914-1918.net/grandad/swb.htm

Roy

valerie

valerie Report 11 May 2012 02:41

hi michelle.

my grandmothers name was adelaide mcdonell and so far we have drawn a blank, does she appear in your tree. she married william fogarty?

val

valerie

valerie Report 11 May 2012 02:41

hi michelle.

my grandmothers name was adelaide mcdonell and so far we have drawn a blank, does she appear in your tree. she married william fogarty?

val

Michele

Michele Report 12 May 2012 17:49

Potty, yes this is his medal card no 5/8217 , i cannot seem to find his enlistment papers any one know why ?

Porkie_Pie

Porkie_Pie Report 12 May 2012 18:23

Only abt 30% to 40% of WW1 army records have survived

Service Records were irretrievably damaged or lost completely as a result of enemy bombing in 1940 during the Second World War. The exact number of serving British soldiers is not known because of the loss of the records

medal cards did survive due to being stored in another location

this is the one that Potty has got as Chris McDonnell with the same regimental number but they have him as Charles? from the national archives web site
card of McDonnell, Charles
Corps: Royal Irish Rifles
Regiment No: 5/8217
Rank: Private

the site does not list a possible Chris or Christopher McDonnell but they do list a
card of McDonnell, C
Corps: Royal Irish Rifles
Regiment No: 8773
Rank: Private

Roy

was plain ann now annielaurie

was plain ann now annielaurie Report 12 May 2012 22:28

The image of the entry on the actual medal roll for the Silver War Badge is on Ancestry and it give Chris as the christian name for the man with Reg number 5/8217

Porkie_Pie

Porkie_Pie Report 12 May 2012 23:27

Is the image a good clear one? is their any chance it was mistranscribed by Ancestry? ( it would not be the first time )

I only posted because TNA has it down as Charles?

same regimental number so it looks like either ancestry or TNA have transcribed it wrong

in most cases TNA transcriptions are superior to Ancestry

I don't have Ancestry any more so cannot look my self

Roy

Potty

Potty Report 13 May 2012 10:35

Yes, Roy, it is quite clearly Chris. I cannot see the Silver War badge mentioned anywhere and the card does not look same as most others I have seen. Normally the lines marking out the columns and rows are red; on this one they are black and the layout is different.

It gives his date of enlistment as 3.9.14; date of discharge 17.1.16; Cause of Discharge: Para 392 XVI K.R. Sickness. Further down next to Action Taken it has B/68.

If he originally enlisted in 1910 he must have left the Army before 1914 so possibly his records will be on FMP. There are two Christopher McDonnells coming up on there, but I don't have a subscription to view them.

I wonder where Michele has got his date and place of enlistment from?

Michele

Michele Report 13 May 2012 12:40

Hi Potty,
I have his enlistment record from my mum an it says, Christopher enlisted 1910 discharged 1916, said he served in colours for 6, 4of 12 years

Porkie_Pie

Porkie_Pie Report 13 May 2012 12:57

surly you mean 6 yrs 4 mths and 12 days?

can you confirm his Regiment Number is 5/8217

because the national archives may need to amend their records with regard to having a Charles McDonnell down with that regimental number

regimental numbers where in those days issued by the regiment you were enlisting in so it's possible for another soldier to have the same number but not with in the same regiment,


Potty, the medal card Design changed most soldiers who enlisted before WWI did have a different type of medal card

see http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/documentsonline/medals.asp#other

Roy


Potty

Potty Report 13 May 2012 13:14

Thanks for that, Roy. You learn something new every day on here!

I wonder why the medal card gives an enlistment year of 1914 and not 1910?