General Chat

When my Dad died in 2001 I found a document showing that he was adopted from a workhouse, the Burton on Trent Union, in 1918 when just a few weeks old.
There are lots of clues on his birth certificate but I cannot find ONE SINGLE LEAD !
My Dad was born ROY VILLIER CRYER SMITH on 8/4/1918 at 56 Moor Street, Burton on Trent. His parents were Lilian Leah Smith (nee Cryer) and George Smith.
Occupation of father says 'of independent means'.
I cannot find a marriage, a birth for Lilian Leah Cryer ( or Lilan Leah anybody that might fit !! ).
I have searched every census for the extremely rare surname Villier thinking it must have a great significance - nothing !
Has anybody got any ideas whatsoever where I might search for clues ?
Thanks to all
Brian

Don't know if it's any help but there's a Lily L Cryer aged 1 in 1901 living in Burnley, Lancashire. I've come across Lillians before who were known as Lily.

I was going to suggest trying the births index for a Lillian Cryer but I'm sure you must have thought of that already.

Edit - perhaps not. She looks like the Lily Ladysmith Cryer who was registered in Burnley in Jun qtr 1900.

One extra thought - I wonder if Villier on your dad's birth certificate was written down because the registrar misheard the name "Villiers".

I was just thinking, with the date of his birth being about ten years before official adoptions came in, perhaps his adoptive parents registered him as if he was their own child. It would depend on the time delay between the birth and the registration but, given that parents had six weeks to get a birth registered, it might also explain the gap of a few weeks.

Hi Brian...have bookmarked for when I can give this some thought and to nudge it up for others who may be able to help.

Susan

Seems odd he was adopted if his dad was wealthy.

Another thing to consider was that war was going on and your father could have been the result of an affair.

Have you looked at electoral rolls to see who lived at that address? It could be a relative of Lilian's. There are no other births with mother's maiden name Cryer in Burton. Could be Lilian went up there to privately have the baby.

Rose

Have you looked at the workhouse records, which would give admission & discharge for the mother .

A big THANK YOU to all !!
Being a relative 'novice' to the world of genealogy it did not occur to me that there may be electoral roll records available so that opens up a new line of enquiry.
On BMD and census records I have endlessly tried every permutation I can think of for Lilian Leah Cryer - Lily, Lillian, Leah Lilian, omitting the first name, omitting her middle name etc etc.
I printed off a list of all births registered Lilian Leah thinking that she could have married a 'Cryer' and been widowed or divorced.
Of course researching a name like George Smith is searching for the proverbial needle in a haystack but there is no trace of a marriage.
Were they married abroad ( independent means therefore wealthy ??) as Villier suggests the continent ?
Was George Smith away in the Great War and was my Dad the illigitimate son of a wartime affair ?
From the certificate that I have he appears to have been given up to the Burton on Trent Union at birth and adopted by my Grandad within weeks.
I did go to Lichfield library who hold the admissions register for the Burton on Trent Union but frustratingly I could find no mention of my Dad.
I intend to go back and have another try !
To add spice to the mystery my Mum, who is now 89, recalls a story that my Dad's mother was an actress !! This takes me into the realms of an Agatha Christie mystery but would it be feasible that a lodger (actress) staying with the Smiths gave birth and handed the baby over for adoption leaving no link to herself ?
Could her name have been Villier ?
The most striking thing about my Dad is the choice of middle names - Villier and Cryer. I believe that they hold the key to unlocking the mystery.
Sorry for rambling on but I hope this gives you a flavour of what has been driving me mad for 8 years !
Brian

Brian, Dont take the birth certificates at face value. My two cousins asked me to find their mother's birth family
She had been adopted, and I knew her birth name, when I obtained her birth certificate, never had I seen such a load of lies. Her mother had put her surname down with a different spelling,just changing one letter, her two uncles names, as her father, and her own mother's maiden name as hers.This was in 1919, Done to hide illegitimacy.
What I did ,I looked back at the 1901 census, and then the 1891 census, and found the family, and this is how I had found the true name.
I then looked up and found the mother had married in 1920, and remembering what my aunt had told me, about her father, found yes it was true he was a Canadian Soldier, and they went to Canada, but did not take their daughter with them. I then put a notice on a Website for Canada and found the family. Not that I got in touch with them, but just let my cousins know who their mothers family were

Brian,

I live in Burton on Trent and I have just looked through the Phone Directory.

There are no Cryers or Viller/Villiers/Villers in the book so it looks as if he left the area. There are no descendents here now, unless they were female and got married.

Good luck in your search, but I don't think the answer is in Burton.

Hi

Do you know if George has a middle initial ? I wonder if Lillian has been married before, her maiden name would still be Cryer, on the birth but she may have married under another name .

The birth certificate is my only source of information apart from the Burton on Trent Union document. It doesn't give me a middle name or initial for the Father, just plain George Smith. They have clearly declared themselves married because in the 'Mother' column it says Lilian Leah Smith formerly Cryer.
George Smith, living at 56 Moor Street, is given as the informant on 6th June which is exactly seven weeks after my Dad was born on 18th April 1918.
Cryer may well be a name from a previous marriage and I have attempted to cross reference all the registered 'Lilian Leah' births with Cryer in marriage searches but no luck.
Today I have searched the 1911 census to see who liveed at 56 Moor Street and even 65 just in case but no sign of any Smith, Villier Cryer etc just 2 young families working locally.
Thanks again for all the advice !
Brian

Hi Brian

Could not find her birth, but was just wondering given that this is just after the first world was could she have been a widow when she married George ? her maiden name would still be down as Cryer, but you would then not find a marriage for a Cryer to a Smith.

The searching is nearly over !

My sister in law, Pat, decided to search forward for LILIAN LEAH CRYER as no trace had ever been found of her birth or marriage to 'George Smith' who plainly never existed.

She found a marriage for Lilian L Cryer to Joseph Warrilow in Burton in 1936 and when the certificate arrived the mystery began to unravel.
It was indeed Lilian LEAH Cyer, a widow aged 48 and her father was WILLIAM RUFUS CROOK. We had long know that a Lilian Leah Crook had married Robert Thomas A Cryer in Bath in 1909 but could never find a link.

I have been able to piece together a fairly complete family tree for the 'CROOKS' and the 'CRYERS' from Bath and I am now searching for the final piece of the jigsaw i.e. to try and discover the circumstances of my Dad being given up to the workhouse at birth.

I can only guess that Lilian became pregnant by somebody called 'Villier' and arranged to leave the clues to his true identity with the middle names of Villier and Cryer. It is interesting that 'Mr Smith' did not register the birth until 6th June, some 8 weeks after my Dad was born.

I have traced one other son of Lilian, he was born ROBERT GEORGE W CROOK in Bath in the Jan-Mar quarter 1909 because that was several months before she married Robert Cryer. Robert appears to have grown up and lived in Burton on Trent because he married SARAH ELLEN B CROSS there in 1937. I have traced only one child so far, DAVID R CROOK born in Burton in 1947.

To complete my story I would like to appeal for information on any of the following :-

1) David Crook and/or Sarah Cross and their families.
2) Any family of Joseph Thomas Warrilow from Burton who was a widower when he married Lilian in 1936.
3) Any descendants of the Crook and Cryer families from Bath in the early 1900's.

I would like to thank everybody who responded to my earlier post and offered help and advice.

Best wishes and a Happy Xmas to all.

Brian

Well that was almost a Christmas present to you Brian, to find all that out.
It would be lovely if you could find some other descendents of these people but well done for getting this far.

My o.h.'s father told him recently that his g.grandfather was adopted, the only reason they knew was that a great aunt of o.h. had mentioned it. There is no other information at all and with g. grandfather long gone and named James? Smith, I have no idea how anything could be back traced now. I did suggest we get certificates of o.h.'s grandfather's birth certificate in case there was anything there and g.grandfather's birth and death certificate too if we could get a birthdate or death date to narrow things down, would that show any relevant info?

Lizx

Thanks for the update Brian. Lucky she had an unusual name.

I see Robert died in Hull in 1934.

Rose

Hi Liz
I have discovered it is very difficult, nigh on impossible, to research adoptions before 1st Jan 1927 but as I have proved you must not give up because you never know what small clue may be around the corner.
I would certainly try and get copies of birth, death and marriage certificates relating to your grandfather and great grandfather because there might be something there, a name or address or occupation that helps in other directions.
Thanks Rose I had just discovered myself that Robert Cryer died in Hull as you say in 1934 which suggests that he was separated from Lilian but she must have known because she remarried 2 years later as a widow.
With the kind help of Sheila I also know that Robert George W Crook died in Burton in 1974 so it looks as if my main hope of finding direct descendants lies with his son David R Crook born in 1947.
Hopefully when I get a copy of the death certificate the informant will have been David and give me his address at the time. Unfortunately I have located 17 marriages for a David R Crook between 1964 and 1995 but none of them in either Burton on Trent or Staffordshire which leaves me with a headache !
Once again many thanks to all !

Brian

Thanks Brian, I will get o.h. to cough up for certs in the New Year and see what we can find out!

Good luck to you with the rest of your research

Merry Christmas.

Lizx

this is all fascinating to read
thanks brian for sharing with us,

Could this be the death of David?

Are there many David R 's born in 1947?



NAME:
David Robert Crook
BIRTH:
19 Sep 1947
DEATH:
Jul 1994 - Wigan, Lancashire, England




Penny

a death of a Lilian L Warrilow was registered in Burton on Trent in 1960 aged 73

Her death certificate will give you the informant which may be her nearest relative at the time.

George