General Chat

FIFA has decided to fine all the countries thousands of pounds even if they just had a minute silence and laid a poppy wreath.

http://www.bbc.com/sport/football/38368144

Just read what you directed us to, Pat.

Shame on them.

Although I am not a footy connoisseur, may I ask if symbols are not allowed, what's the item that some players take out through the top of their shirts and kiss? What, also, if it is not a visible symbol, is the sign of the cross made by many players before play and upon goal scoring?

I agree what a disgrace.

I also agree with Joy on the players who make the sign of the cross
and some players who kneel down in the middle of the pitch to give
prayer to their God.

This is accepted by fans and players alike, the wearing of the poppy
is a symbol of respect.

You are right JoyLouise and the national emblems are allowed, thought that could be seen as political.

Another anomaly - if England and Scotland are fined for doing the same thing then surely the fine should be the same, not fining England over twice as much as Scotland.

FIFA has been proved to be corrupt and they fine our teams for showing respect says it all doesn't it. :-S

What a shower of idiots. I am a big footie fan and find this disgraceful how dare they. :-| :-| :-|.. Many players are grabbing at their shirts to either kiss their team badge or sometimes family memories on their undershirts Joy

FA fined.......£35,308

SFA and WFA......£15,692

IFA......£11,769

In the context of the UK the poppy is not political.

However FIFA includes in its membership all kinds of regimes some of them extremely nasty. Two of them, Qtar and Russia will even host the next two Wold Cups.

The UK red poppy commemorates those who have given their lives in defence of their country and, the crucial bit, freedom and democracy. That goes down like a stone with Vladimir Putin and his ilk. So yes, the poppy is a political symbol of great force. All the greater indeed as it is not linked to the shenanigans that pass for political parties.

The fine is bigger for the English FA 'cos they have much more money. Indeed for them it is a fleabite. Should they wear the poppy again in similar circumstances ? Yes, of course not to do so would be utterly shameful.

FIFA has done little good for soccer and it is about time it was wound up and a different kind of organisation established. The World Cup in Russia 2018 may well become its swan song wrecked by racism, corruption and drugs.

Gosh, Rollo, I agree with everything there.

Edit: Rollo, where have you been? You've not posted for a little while.

Egregious decisions.

I too agree with everything you say Rollo, (and everyone else) - This must be a first!!!!
My father was killed 74 years ago this evening. My Dutch friends who tend his grave and those of his companions are having a special service tonight, as they do every year at this time. The FA can #### !! (it's too rude to print but I'm sure you get my meaning!)

I also agree with what has been said here , it makes me angry.
Magpie
Thinking of you on the anniversary of your Dads passing. <3

Gosh several firsts here. Thank you Rollo for saying what I would have done. i.e. I agree with everything you have said on this thread. :-)

Thank you Sylvia.

From the British Royal Legion site :

The poppy is

A symbol of Remembrance and hope
Worn by millions of people
Red because of the natural colour of field poppies
The poppy is NOT

A symbol of death or a sign of support for war
A reflection of politics or religion
Red to reflect the colour of blood
Wearing a poppy is a personal choice and reflects individual and personal memories. It is not compulsory but is greatly appreciated by those it helps – our beneficiaries: those currently serving in our Armed Forces, veterans, and their families and dependants.

Just to mention another flower .. Hollyhocks to FIFA :-P

I think England should pay the amount of the fine to the Royal British Legion and then tell FIFA that they have paid it to a decent band of people rather than the "shameful bunch" at FIFA and if they don't like it........tough!

Kath. x

Totally agree including paying the fine to the Legion.

That is the British Legion's point of view. It doesn't really stand up except in the context that the red Flanders poppy has no connecition with British political parties who have not sought to hijack it in the same way they have misused various flags..

There has never been such a thing as an unpolitical war.

Most modern wars including the Great War are seen as just by both sides and the dead honoured. The events which propel states into war are highly political. Thus any symbol commerating or honoring the fallen can be considered to be politically aligned with the mores of one or more of the combatents. In the case of the poppy it stands for men and women who laid down their lives for freedom and democracy - a charged and contentious issue in 1921 and even more so today. That is why FIFA is against the poppy - Russia, China, Qater to name but a few are no supporters of such ideas which are in direct conflict with the tenets of these states..

The rejection of the war of 1939-1945 by Germany as a just war is highly unusual. All symbols of the Third Reich are illegal in Germany. Nevertheless ex-combatents are paid better pensions than Brits receive.

When the rules of FIFA were drafted the organisation was largely in the hands of Europe. Now it is not and the rules are read differently. Nonetheless I believe that the UK soccer federations should defend the traditional meaning of the rules.

One of my grandfathers was a professional soldier and fought from Mons to the end of hostilities. He was always very hostile to all the razmataz of the Legion, poppies, Menin Gate etc etc as he thought it utterly hypocritical given the absymal treatment of ex servicemen. His cousin, a Qaker, drove a field ambulance from 1915 to the end of hostilities. He also was less than enthusiastic about the activities of the Legion. One of his daughters was a leading light at Bletchley 1941-46. Neither ever wore poppies.

I myself always wear my poppy. The arguments of the 1920s and 1930s are behind us and the flower is a powerful reminder of just what this nation is supposed to stand for.

The French flower of remembrance for the fallen is the cornflower.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bleuet_de_France

More of the the British ROYAL Legion's .... The Story Of The Poppy ....... The inspiration of the poppy as a symbol of Remembrance. ...
http://www.britishlegion.org.uk/remembrance/how-we-remember/the-story-of-the-poppy/
My ancestors that died in WW1 and WW2 were not professionals, they were ordinary soldiers and seamen that lost their lives in France and Flanders also at Dunkirk .

That is why I wear my Poppy WITH PRIDE.

Disgusted with FIFA, I hope next year the football teams do exactly the same again & defy FIFA. They are so out of touch with the public. Carry on boys & wear your poppies with pride next year.

I do think FIFA was wrong in the way they handled this and could have used a bit more discretion.

However you also have to be very careful not to deride those who don't feel able to join in as disrespectful.

I am one who does not wear a poppy, for which I have personal reasons and when our office chose to introduce two minutes silence, many of us chose that time to take our break and perhaps take a quiet walk in the grounds. Some even carried on working at their desk.