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Put it to us the members!

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ProfilePosted byOptionsPost Date

Porkie_Pie

Porkie_Pie Report 22 Aug 2012 00:28

John, I could not disagree more, So before you get all giddy and pull any rugs from under anyone

First, Regardless of what Estelle said about reading the boards "daily"? they may scan the odd thread but i would dispute that because

a, The lack of response to threads on all boards

b, The site has been unusable in the past with errors and its only when members have posted on GR's face book page that any response has been forthcoming

c, When the site has had serious problems in the past the response that GR have posted is along the lines of, Hi, guys sorry for the errors you've had over the last day or two but we had only just found out, usualy as i said before after members posted on FB,

Second, (What Roy and Detective are saying is purely conjecture and they want to believe that silent people agree with their point of view)
my response as in my post above 21 Aug 2012 19:06 is

(The problem with believing in the silent and resentful is that they are invisible and their for cannot be counted)

I take it that unless you are privy to official data that the rest of us have not then your analysis is also pure conjecture and that you also believe that silent people agree with your point of view,

Third, (And they feel bolstered by the continual official "good feedback, one of two problems" line that Genes are taking)
I cannot speak for the others but You have seriously underestimated Me in particular with that statement,

Just because i have not joined in and slated them on the boards does not mean that i have agreed with the way they have handled the situation,
I was actively on their case months before this last new version was thrust on members,
I have continually hounded GR both through the contact us and the feedback facility plus multiple complaints to them on FB to the point that i was banned from posting on GR's FB page months ago and i fully expected to be banned off GR
(How may members complaining have gone that far for the cause) ???

All this whilst still trying to help members with look up and research advice plus the help i give members on getting around their technical problems with the site,

And lastly, I do not cross swords I prefer to use a machine gun and i don't bear a grudge But i will debate and have an opinion on most things


Roy

jax

jax Report 22 Aug 2012 00:31

Why would I want to start a thread about loving the new tree?

I very rarely start threads the last one was to ask if anyone else had recieved an email asking if they would like to beta test the makeover...and yes Phil replied a few times on that thread...so yes I knew the staff read some of them.

Reporting threads or posts is something I do not do unless it is abusive, even then I normally leave it

SylviaInCanada

SylviaInCanada Report 22 Aug 2012 01:40

Just to correct one thing


John quoted me .........................

John Report 21 Aug 2012 09:43

One lister (Francesca)says 97% are against new tree. Another (Sylvia in Canada) says that 80% are in favour. I am confused.



He has in fact quoted me incorrectly!


I've said it before, and I'll say it again.


Please get your facts straight




What I said was that my personal experience was that of the 20 or so CLOSE FRIENDS that I have on this site, as many as 80% are satisfied with the new tree.


I did not in any way imply, or state, that 80% of MEMBERS were satisfied.




So .......... there is no way in which you can compare this with Francesca's statement that 97% are dissatisfied


Although ........... I wonde rhow she can know that?



No-one know how many members are active on the site .............. except GR staff


No-one knows how many members working on their tree are satisfied or dis-satisfied with the working of the tree


No-one knows how many free vs paid members there are on GR .


and free members cannot post on here as the paid members are doing.





SO ........................



where did Francesca get her figures from








SylviaInCanada

SylviaInCanada Report 22 Aug 2012 01:45

and, John ....................



RR'ing people who disagree with you, or who post information that you disagree with


as per your threat of RR'ing myself, Detective etc if we dare to post one more time "contact support@genesreunited.co.uk"


is most definitively frowned upon


particularly, as you have announced that you will do this.



GR does ban repetitive RR'ers, when they discover them :-)




In my mind, the only responsible reasons for RR'ing is for racist and/or homophobic remarks, or breach of privacy

any other posts come under the heading of "discussion"



and RR'ing those means you are censoring others



You got people's backs up in your first few days.


Please don't do it again.


I was beginning to think you were reasonable ................. not an angry man hitting out indiscriminately against the messengers




sylvia

LadyScozz

LadyScozz Report 22 Aug 2012 01:53

Gawd, a bunfight.

Some like the new tree

Some dislike it and want the old one back

Like it or hate it, the new tree is here (until it is replaced?)

I hated it to begin with, because it didn't work (for me). I don't like it now, because it is too slow, and I have to fiddle about with the Compatability.

I have NO IDEA what ALL the members think!

I'm concerned about GR's records of members. My subs expire TODAY and I haven't had an email from them. I've sent numerous emails to them, got one response letting me know I would get an email in time. I wonder when that will be? Yes, I DO know we have a month's grace.

I might be gone at midnight (would that be UK midnight or Aus midnight?)

jax

jax Report 22 Aug 2012 02:04

My subs run out at uk midnight 21st Aug two hours ago....I did'nt get an email either but I had turned off the auto renew...so I had more control over whether I subscribed and which card I used

I did get offered 20% discount though when I clicked subscribe

LadyScozz

LadyScozz Report 22 Aug 2012 02:09

I got an email this morning........... this is pasted......

Thank you for your email, If you choose to take out this renewal you will recieve $3.99 off of this subscription. I hope this helps.

I responded.....

How do I pay, and how much?

I haven't been on Auto Renew for years, but have always had an email up until now.

Must go look at My Account........... then check that it doesn't go on to Auto again (it's done that in the past!)

JustJohn

JustJohn Report 22 Aug 2012 08:54

Yes, I am getting pretty angry about this. The point about percentages seems very simple.

97% against the tree (ref Francesca) is simply adding up all those who have opposed thread and all those for. Simple maths - anyone can do it. You can get a slightly different answer - I make it 93%. But that is FACT. Well over 90% against on Community.

Twenty friends like the new tree, says SylviainCanada. And most of those friends are on here telling us how much they like the tree, so we can work that out. That is probably the 7% that I have counted.

Staistical probability then comes into play for the silent majority. The idea that they like the tree and are all working with it is fanciful and not probable. It is probable that they hate it in roughly the same proportions as those who have been active and semi-active here in last month.

And if another innocent lister comes on and says "I don't like the new tree" or "am I the only one who cannot use the new tree", I will certainly join the discussion if they are told to "write to the team", clear their cache, look for the save button, change your browser. Anything to stop that thread, it seems to me.

With most of us who are anti this new tree, you are missing the point. We do not really want to fiddle about with this new tree. We want to have a collective go at getting Genes to repond to our unhappiness.

And if I get told once more that I am not welcome on a Genes thread, I will report that as bullying and you will then see my very angry. Genes can decide who is the aggressor.

At the moment, I am controlled. I have tried to contribute constructively to this wave of sentiment against the new tree. I hate even checking relatives on my tree now if there is a possible match. That tree has been a best friend for years. I wanted a makeover - not a change from Petula Clark to Lady Gaga.

+++DetEcTive+++

+++DetEcTive+++ Report 22 Aug 2012 09:41

Now, now John – watch your blood pressure ;-)

OK – my post 21 Aug 2012 10:35

“GR don't spend time reading the Boards.”

In light of Estelle’s response, (Sadly we don't have the time to reply to everything. That really would be a full-time job and, as I am sure you all understand, the team are very busy.) and (I will try to look in and post whenever possible though. There is quite a lot going on right now and just not enough hours in the day!) I am happy to amend that to

“GR are unlikely to spend all of their time reading every single thread on the Boards”

If disgruntled members added to an existing thread, then Sylvia, I and others would not need to keep repeating GRs advice that they should >also< be contacting

theteam@genesreunited.co.uk.

There! I’ve said it!

As previously posted *Only GR know the true statistics. Only GR do......assuming that fellow members have used the correct link to express their opinion...*

Yes, the majority of people who have posted about the site/tree are disgruntled. That cannot be denied. If someone wants to work out the actual number of members who have posted, then they could create an excel table, and record the membership number for each poster every time they commented on the topic. That way multiple posts by the same person could be identified and ignored.

I use Firefox, and mine runs fine. If I wasn’t a regular on the Boards, I’d be quite happy adding to it, not realising that anyone else was having difficulties. So are people like me the silent majority, or are they the people who are disgruntled?

We…….don’t…...know.

Bearing in mind that this is the holiday season in the UK, GR may well have to wait until well into the autumn to see what effect the site changes have had on their footfall.

JustJohn

JustJohn Report 22 Aug 2012 10:05

As usual, Detective - very reasonable and persuasive. And factual (like I hope my "Mr Angry of Pontypandy" letter was).

I was very pleased to see that contribution from Estelle yesterday. First comment I have seen from any of teh team since we had the "new layout has good reception" announcemnt of 2nd August folloed by Phil Moir's "have adjusted this and that" on 9th Aug. And there seems to have been a lot of revolting customers like me since 2nd Aug.

BP has gone down from 160 to 140. Now wait for someone to send it back up :-S

RolloTheRed

RolloTheRed Report 22 Aug 2012 10:20

no need to guess

http://www.alexa.com/siteinfo/friendsreunited.co.uk
http://www.freewebsitereport.org/www.genesreunited.com.au
http://www.freewebsitereport.org/www.genesreunited.co.uk
http://widestat.com/genesreunited.co.uk

JustJohn

JustJohn Report 22 Aug 2012 10:51

I think 2 out of 5 for the website is a real problem. That would have been the catalyst for this major site overhaul.

I was attracted to Genes over 9 years ago, but it has always seemed to change things to suit abilities of programmers rather than needs of customers. Some put up with it, others have a moan and those moans blow away.

The basic idea is brilliant - and pretty unique. And, although we probably all thought Genes was not keeping pace with other sites, we enjoyed building our trees, chatting fluffily, asking questions and getting good and quick answers. I was unaware of all this chat and interaction, but was helping people every week via hot matches.

I had a quick look at the stats and it looks to me that Genes have a major opportunity to be a very successful and very profitable outfit. The jewel in the crown, so to speak. They have a young, friendly and knowledgeable small team and their proposition is still attracrtive and unique in the marketplace.

But I think they have got to strip out all the recent programming "improvements" and return to the very basic tree and layout they had. Then ask a random sample of members what they want, and develop slowly from that base.

I know the tree is free, but it is what draws us to the site, makes us want to chat to others and makes us want to invest further by upgrading our membership. And footfall brings more advertising and publicity.

Francesca

Francesca Report 22 Aug 2012 11:23

Jax & 'Others': Read no further if my views are likely to cause offence!
If you don't like my opinions please choose not to read them. You ask who I am.
I'm a paid up member of Genes Reunited since 2006. I only started writing posts on this website in July 2012 when they withdrew the Old family tree format and replaced it with the New one which upset me greatly. Before then I was a contented GR member building my family tree and sharing information with other members. Now I've introduced myself here comes the good news.
Soon I won't be a paying member of Genes Reunited any more.
So you and your friends will not have to suffer my seditious views fouling up YOUR / OUR [?] 'General Chat' and 'Suggestions' threads for much longer.
Rest assured it wasn't your kind words of welcome that drove me away, Jax.
It was the sub-standard New Tree format and Genes Reunited's unusual customer care policies that persuaded me to leave. I won't let a lynch mob run me off the website (I know how overstretched and short-handed you are at present) but neither will I give another penny to a company that treats it's loyal customers with such contempt. When the time comes I'll wish you all a fond farewell. Until then I'll continue to express my views on the threads whenever I wish. I've still got a bit of catching up to do compared to you in terms of the numbers of posts we've both written. Surely you wouldn't begrudge me that ?
It would be impolite of me to disclose whose opinions I'm sick of reading, so I won't.
THE NEW TREE IS A USER-HOSTILE DISASTER... in my opinion (and 'others').

Porkie_Pie

Porkie_Pie Report 22 Aug 2012 18:29

John, I agree that 2 out of 5 is a problem for any web site however that score of 2 out of 5 is actually an improvement,

The last time i checked which was in June so before the new site was launched, GR's score was 3.6 out of 10

correct me if I'm wrong but when i was at school that represents an improvement of 0.2% which would appear to give the impression that the majority of members are happier now than before the new site was launched

I did point the statistics out to GR at the time and Phil Moir did say that it was a concern and they would strive to improve

So if the states are to be taken seriously then the notion that a large portion of members silent or not are less happy now than before doesn't stack up,

This thread has become more of an argument than a debate which saddens me

We are all members and we are all entitled to our own opinions and no one should feel that their opinion is less valid than anyone else

The reality is that GR needed to change but its the way they have gone about changing things thats caused all these problems,

Jonesey posted a thread (Do one thing-Do it well-Then move on)
I agree with what he has said,

GR should only introduce one thing at a time and only launch that change after a full and prolonged period of beta testing

If GR had beta tested (correctly) then we would not be posting on threads like this one

They could have intoduced the different functions/changes one at a time to the tree so that all members only had one new issue to focus on at any one time this would have given them time to adjust instead of the multiple changes that have just confused some members

For those who say the site is slow then according to the states i would suggest that it's not all down to GR,

Performance says that Pages loads in 2 Seconds, which is faster than 52% of other sites, (so about average) for UK users and for au users its says Performance Page loads in 3 Seconds, faster than 17% of sites so not as good


Roy

Francesca

Francesca Report 25 Aug 2012 10:27

Regarding the speculation about the views of the 'silent majority' (who haven't yet expressed them by writing to the website) there seems to be two schools of thought:

1) If they haven't complained they must be content with the New tree format.
Ergo it is only the several hundred members who have been vocal with their complaints, on the Boards & Blogs, who are actually unhappy with the New tree. Everyone else is quite happy. AN OVERWHELMING MAJORITY ARE HAPPY WITH THE NEW TREE.

2) Roughly 9 out of 10 members, who have expressed an opinion on the Boards & Blogs, are unhappy with the New tree. Using these opinions as a small representative sample of the membership as a whole (as an opinion pollster might) it could be extrapolated that the opinions of the 'silent majority' are in similar proportions. Ergo 9 out of 10 members are unhappy with the New tree. AN OVERWHELMING MAJORITY ARE UNHAPPY WITH THE NEW TREE.

Although there is some logic in both I am not yet totally convinced by either argument.
But there is at least some evidence that the truth is probably much closer to the second argument than the first.

Since these arguments were first put forward there has been a steady trickle of members who have left the silent group and joined the vocal one. Far from all being content they seem to have allied themselves in the main with the group described unkindly by some as the "Moaners". The longer this trend continues the less plausible theory No.1 becomes.

Also, if it is true that there are no silent dissatisfied customers and that aggrieved members always complain vociferously, why weren't the Boards and Blogs totally swamped with thousands upon thousands of complaints about the dreaded Doppelganger Bug (and others) before the fixes went in. Surely the bugs were quite widespread and weren't selective about whose trees they infested. Maybe no-one was using their GR trees and everyone was either away on holiday or happily watching the Olympics in blissful ignorance of the bugs in their trees. Maybe some members are content to have a tree full of bugs and clones, who knows.
Please don't tell me these multitudes all channelled their complaints to the proper recipients and inundated the team@genes with minimal overspill onto the Boards & Blogs. That would really crease me up.

Before the huge holes in my arguments are pointed out, my theories rightly torn to shreds, and my logic ridiculed with justifiable contempt just remember this is only A BIT OF FUN. Merely harmless speculation. I would never dare to suggest that I know the views of those who remain silent. I'll leave it to others to express their views. Preferably the 'silent majority' themselves.
I'll bet you 9 to 1 that I don't have the last word on this subject.

JustJohn

JustJohn Report 25 Aug 2012 14:46

I was the silent majority till 3 weeks ago. Mine will be the last word on this thread because it is definitive and cultured. 93.17% don't like new tree. Yet only 86.15 hate it with an intensity. 7.02% are struggling to get to grips with new tree and most of that 7.02% (I include my cultured and urbane and banale self) are failing miserably and moving rapidly towards the 86.15% camp.

Some poor member has a hot match with me this morning. It is one I am very very interested in. I am having to check other records than what I have on Genes Reunited to reply to him and help. The info is somwhere on my Genes tree but cannot find what I want and my sunglasses are broken.

I have never felt so impotent in the nearly 10 years of membership of Genes. My dream has become a nightmare. I wake at 5am every morning thinking my future is to be terrorised by a pack of Amazonian warriors on fluffy chat threads.

20-1 this is not last word. £20 on the nose, Francesca dear:-)

Francesca

Francesca Report 26 Aug 2012 06:06

Only Genes Reunited have any idea how many of the 'silent majority' (i.e. those members who haven't yet expressed an opinion publicly on the Boards & Blogs about the New Tree) have complained privately directly to the Genes team about their difficulties with New tree and the nature of those complaints.
Also, only they know about the numbers who have recently departed from paid membership of the G.R. website altogether by not renewing their subscriptions.
Some will have let their feet do the talking by cancelling their subscriptions and leaving for pastures new without saying goodbye to the rest of us first.
I speculate that the 'silent majority' might be shedding numbers and shrinking just as rapidly as the 'vocal minority'.

LadyScozz

LadyScozz Report 26 Aug 2012 07:59

I've spent some time reading the Blog about the new tree.

Didn't see many postings from people who like the new version.

Wondering where GR got their statistics? It's not an impossible task for GR to send an email to EVERY member, and ask a question ~ do you like the new tree, Yes or No. Not enough staff? Get a Temp!! Can't afford it? "Millions" of members? That's not exactly peanuts!

I'll put up with the new one (no choice!) but I don't like it. I renewed my subs last week, but wondering if this site will even exist this time next year.

JustJohn

JustJohn Report 26 Aug 2012 09:57

Since I have been knocked off my tree by the imposition of this new deLorean model that has been designed by a keen sixth former in a hurry to make her mark in life, I have strayed into these Community threads for last 4 weeks. Initially to complain about losing old tree, but then have joined in threads and actually started two as OP (Opening Prat, I think)

Quite enjoyed that new experience but frightened it will get addictive and I will soon become Mr Saddo with 50,000 posts to my name. I was called Saddo after about 30 posts, so they were a good judge.

It seems clear to me that Genes needs to go back to old tree immediately and start again. But I also fear they are reacting too late and the war has already been well lost.

Signs would be how many were using old layout and new layout in July when we still had the option, how many are unticking Auto Renew, how many new relatives are being added to trees each week compared to, say, June.

But I am sure I have also noticed a huge reduction in posts to the various threads on Community even in last 4 weeks. May be holidays, but some quite interesting threads have had no contribution for several days - even the Welsh and Australian chat threads fall off the front page occasionally, and they tend to kiss each other before they go to bed.

Porkie_Pie

Porkie_Pie Report 26 Aug 2012 14:23

Scozz, The stats come from the Free web site report's site.

http://www.freewebsitereport.org/

John, I doubt GR would bring back the old tree but i do agree that yet again GR got it wrong, the beta testing was not done as it should have been and the new version does still have some way to go,

Had GR done the testing (correctly) and listed to and acted on all the feedback I'm sure we would not have has the "unhappy members" postings on these boards

GR you cannot beta test a new site for only one week and expect to gain enough feedback to then analyze and make the changes required and even the changes would require further testing, marks out of 10 for that effort in my book would be 1 out of 10



Roy