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Hi, I'm in need of help please and wondered if anyone out there can assist.

I am trying to find my grandfather William John Gibbs (aka Jack). The main info I have is his marriage certificate to my nan-Ethel May Vellender. Their marriage was July 6th 1929 and it stated his age as 22, so I calculate that he must have been born between 7th July 1906 and 5th July 1907 (if his age on there was correct). I think he was born under the Warwickshire area. His father's name was John Gibbs. One of the witnesses to the marriage was Frederick George Gibbs.

I believe I may have found his birth registration in 3rd qtr 1906. I also think I may have found him and his family on the 1911 census living in Sparkhill area of Birmingham which would make sense as that’s where my nan lived.

So although we may eventually be able to trace backwards we cannot really go forwards i.e. what happened after he left my nan. We believe they divorced around 1953 ish and he may have lived in London at that time. He may have had another family since he left my nan so as my mum never met him it would be interesting to know if she has any half-family out there.

I'd be really grateful for any help please.

Thanks, Vicky

???

Ethel Vellender

England and Wales Census, 1901
birth: 1885 — Gt Bookham, Surrey
residence: Great Bookham, Surrey, England

record title: England and Wales Census, 1901
name: Ethel Vellender
event: Census
event date: 31 Mar 1901
gender: Female
age: 16
relationship to head of household: Daughter
birthplace: Gt Bookham, Surrey
record type: Household
registration district: Epsom
sub-district: Leatherhead
ecclesiastical parish: St Nicholas
civil parish: Great Bookham
county: Epsom, Leatherhead, Great Bookham, Surrey

William John Gibbs

England Births and Christenings, 1538-1975
birth: 27 Jan 1910
residence: Birmingham, Warwick, England
parents: William John Gibbs, Mary Magdalen Gibbs

record title: England Births and Christenings, 1538-1975
name: William John Gibbs
gender: Male
baptism/christening date: Feb 1910
baptism/christening place: St. Marys, Birmingham, Warwick, England
birth date: 27 Jan 1910
father's name: William John Gibbs
mother's name: Mary Magdalen Gibbs
indexing project (batch) number: C00697-0
system origin: England-EASy
source film number: 1520141

1911??

GIBBS, John Head Married M 41 1870 Labourer General Wiltshire VIEW
GIBBS, Eunice Wife Married
5 years F 31 1880 Gloucestershire Gloucester VIEW
GIBBS, John Son M 4 1907 Worcestershire Bham VIEW
GIBBS, Frederick Son M 2 1909 Worcestershire Bham VIEW
GIBBS, Gladys Daughter F 1 1910 Gloucestershire Gloucester VIEW
ROGERS, John Boarder Single M 21 1890 Labourer General Gloucestershire Gloucester VIEW
GRIFFITHS, Edward Boarder Single M 23 1888 Labourer Flintshire VIEW


Address:
96 Medina Road County:
Warwickshire

Too many William J. Gibbs to know if he re-married or not I'm afraid.

Hi, thanks for your replies.

Astra I am thinking that is the right census record. His name is actually William John Gibbs but because I think he was known as John by his family presumably it may be possible that they put that down on the census rather than his correct full name. Is this sometimes the case with census info?

Thanks, Vicky

The Frederick in 1911

GIBBS, Frederick Son 2 1909 Worcestershire Bham

might match with this birth?

Births Mar 1909
GIBBS Frederick George Solihull 6d 631

- edit - which matches also with the birth you mentioned (you didn't state the place):

Births Sep 1906
Gibbs William John Solihull 6d 651


If you get the birth certificate you think is Jack, you might be able to match the birthdate to a death after 1969 (when birthdate is included in the index, as long as the informant knew it).


(Ann o' GG, you lost me -- I wouldn't think the Ethel Vellender that Jack born after 1900 married was born c1885, in a completely different place from what Vicky said!)

Yes. Quite often they used the second name as opposed to the first. But it may not be him of course. I have been looking for a marriage to a Eunice but can't find one. They may both have been married before of course and not bothered.

GIBBS, John Head
GIBBS, Eunice Wife Married 5 years

There isn't actually such a marriage ... before or after 1906.

Oops, ditto -- I was looking in earlier censuses to try to identify Eunice ...


Name: Eunice Gibbs
Death Registration Month/Year: 1964
Age at death (estimated): 84
Registration district: Solihull
Inferred County: Warwickshire
Volume: 9c
Page: 828

Hi thanks again.

I have found a possible marriage which would tie in with being married for 5 years on the census:

Name John Gibbs
Year of Marriage 1905
Quarter of Marriage Apr-May-Jun
Registration District Aston
Registration County Warwickshire
Spouse's Surname Only available for records after 1912
Volume Number 6D
Volume Page 517

Presumably the only way to find the spouse is to get the certificate?

Thanks, Vicky

No -- you're using this idiot site.

At FreeBMD

http://freebmd.rootsweb.com/cgi/search.pl

you just click on the page number to see the two possible spouses' names. It isn't the right one, or we would have found it. ;)

That marriage

Marriages Jun 1905
Cope Alice Aston 6d 517
GIBBS John Aston 6d 517
Neighbour Ellen Aston 6d 517
Newman William Herbert Aston 6d 517

John Gibbs married one of those two women -- then the marriage certificate will say which one.

No Eunice. Although it could have been a previous marriage for the John in question.

Ahh oops sorry (hmm whats that saying? - teaching your grandmother to suck eggs!!) :)

A way to check for who married whom in that era is to look for births with the male surname and each of the female surnames. Mother's surname is in the index starting in mid-1911.

There are no Gibbs-Neighbour births at all before 1939 in the wrong place. There are Gibbs-Cope births in the right vicinity but none before 1920.

This could indicate a short-lived marriage, or the wife might have married under a first married name and any births would show her birth surname instead.

You wouldn't know whether your Jack had any siblings born after 1911 and what their names were if so? Finding their births would provide the mother's surname.

Another way to check is to search the 1911 for a John Gibbs living with an Alice or an Ellen, in this case. Or an Alice Gibbs or Ellen Gibbs without a husband present.

http://www.1911census.co.uk/search/tnaform.aspx

By the way, you notice the other info I posted ... the Frederick George Gibbs birth that seems to match up with John William's birth and with the household in the 1911 ...

If you get the John William birth certificate it will give the mother's name -- if Eunice, you'd have the right one, and her surname. It's also possible that Eunice wasn't the mother of one or more of the kids in the 1911.

You're wanting to find Jack after that obviously -- I'm just thinking it's possible, if the parents weren't married, that his birth was actually registered in the mother's surname.

Seems odd that daughter Gladys is shown as born in Gloucester when the older children were born in Solihull and that's where the family is.

I might wonder whether the older children aren't Eunice's, and Gladys is, possibly born with her surname.