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Hi

I will write as much I as know that is true and then a few thoughts of my own out loud as it were.

I have been searching for this family line for so long now and am at a loss. The definite information I have on this Samuel Johnson is that he was born in 1838 in Chesterton, Staffordshire, England. and married a Letitia (often misspelt as Lettice, Leticia) Thomas of Mrthyr Tydvil, Wales in 1860 at St Marks Church Shelton Stoke On Trent.

I have found Samuel in the censuses 1861 - living at 163 Wood Street, Hanley East. 1871 aged 34 living christchurch Alsager. and so on.

This is where is gets muddy.

But when I look further back in the census information of 1851 the only Samuel that is a possible I find is a Samuel Johnson aged 14 living at 32 Love Lane, Nantwich, Cheshire possibly born out of wedlock with a household of surname Shenton.

Thomas Shenton aged34 head
Hannah Shenton aged34 wife
Alfed Shenton aged 5 son
Eliza SHenton aged 6 daug
John Shenton aged 3 son
Marg Shenton aged 1 daug
Samuel Johnson aged 14 son?

I did also find a Samuel Johnson whose father was a George Johnson b1806 who married a Hannah ? at St Mary and Alsaints Church, Checkley in 1839. I think that this is my Samuels parents but wondered if anyone can clarify and also what Samuels mothers name was.

As going back to the census record where Samuel was 14 years old. the Thomas and Hannah mentioned were married in 1843 (so after Samuels birth) at St Mary and St Nicholas CHurch, Nantwich. there names on the marriage cert I believe are Thomas Shenton aged 26 and Hannah Johnson.

This is me just thinking now... did Hannah marry George and have Samuel and then something happened to George so four years later she married Thomas. or is this the wrong George? or wrong Hannah Shenton person? Was Samuel born out of wedlock but still took on fathers name. or was Samuels mother's maiden name Johnson after all and Samuel was born out of wedlock therefore taking his mothers name and if so who are his mothers parents.

Hopw someone can make sense of it all as I seem to be going in circles.
Thanks in advance
Amanda

This is possibly Thomas & Hannah's marriage

Marriages Sep 1843 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

BOFFEY John Nantwich 19 130
CLARKE Catharine Nantwich 19 130
DAVIES William Nantwich 19 130
HADFIELD Sarah Darlington Nantwich 19 130
HARDING James Nantwich 19 130
>>>JOHNSON Hannah Nantwich 19 130
>>>>SHENTON Thomas Nantwich 19 130
TIMMIS Martha Nantwich 19 130

You could get the M/C to cross ref info

It might say late Johnson formerly ???

If this is the marriage you have George Johnson married Hannah Crossley...

www.bmsgh.org/staffsbmd/index.html

Linda

Marriages Sep 1839 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

>>>>CROSSLEY Hannah Cheadle 17 47
>>>JOHNSON George Cheadle 17 47
LINN Ann Cheadle 17 47
Perry Mary Cheadle 17 47
Platt William Cheadle 17 47
Shemilt David Cheadle 17 47
_______________________

This might be George's daeth

Deaths Mar 1842 (>99%)
JOHNSON George Cheadle 17 25

Thanks for the replies I did have a Hannah Crossley down as a possible for George's wife but was unsure. Would I have to get the death cert for George to find how he died and also how could I find If it was Hannah Crossley who married George and then went on to marry Shenton?

So confussing.

Thanks again

To be a 100% of anything you'll need the certs

Personally I would buy Samuel's marriage cert to identify his father's name and occupation.

Linda

Im sure my aunty has this marriage cert. I will check now.

Thanks again

HI

Just rang my aunty who also has been researching this line for some time, and she does have Samuel and Lettitia's marriage cert. although not on her at the moment.

She is certian though that Samuels father is confirmed as George Johnson and thinks he is a stated as a bricklayer or possibly potter. She will check this evening and let me know if different.

Lettitia's father is confirmed as a James Thomas and she thinks he was an Ironmonger/steel worker. again she will reconfirm with me if any different.

Hope this helps somehow. thanks again

Hi Amanda..

Checking the 1851 census I am 99% certain that you have the correct Samuel there are too many similarities...

Samuel is "step-son" to Thomas Shenton...he was b c1837 in Chesterton and his occupation a tailor as in the 1861 census with Letitia.

Have you found Samuel in 1841 ?

I agree with Julie you need to buy the marriage cert between Hannah and Thomas.

Linda

Hi Linda,
The only Samuel I have traced in 1841 census is.

Chesterton Village
Moses Johnson Aged 30 Iron Stone Miner
John Johnson aged 18 Iron Stone Miner
Hannah Johnson aged 20
Mary Johnson aged 20 Potter
Elizabeth Johnson aged 15
Benjamin Johnson aged 13 Brick M?
Samuel Johnson aged 4
Elijah Johnson aged 9 mths
Eliza Johnson aged 7 mths

I think that Elijah was the son of Mary born out of wedlock.

I have also found another entry for Moses aged 30 on 1841 census with two others one male aged 45 and one female aged 3 both with Johnson surname but I cannot make out first names

Now when Hannah married Thomas Shenton, John Johnson was a witness and Moses was down as father but this census shows Moses as being 30 and Hannah being 20 years of age. So therefore I am thinking that Moses is not father.


There is family hearsay that way back there was a relative who was a tailor and was on a ship as he was ophaned....although I doubt this would have been Samuel as when he is missing in 1841 he would have been aged 3 or so. up until he was 10.

I have found the transcript of the marriage between Thomas Shenton andHannah Johnson Nantwich parish. 13th Aug 1843 at Nantwich. Hannah was a household servant aged 25. It states that Hannah's father was a Moses Johnson occupation -miner.

So this has now confussed me as if this is the Hannah that married George Johnson ie Hannah Crossley when George died would she have kept his surname Johnson and took on his parents for the marriage of Thomas Shenton.

So confused Thanks again

Hi Amanda...

I did a door to door search of Chesterton on the 1841 census last night and the only Sarah and Samuel I found was the entry that you found with Moses...probably her brother>

As you have the details of Hannah's marriage to Thomas Shenton..this is somewhat making sense...

Hannah's maiden name is Johnson...her father is a Moses Johnson therefore Samuel is illegitimate and you can certainly rule out a marriage to George Johnson.

I have found a baptism for Moses b c1810 and 2 other siblings....father Moses Johnson and Maria. Chesterton comes under Wolstanton...

Birth/Christening, Stafford, England, British Isles
Father: Moses Johnson, Mother: Maria
Exact Spelling: Off
Batch Number: P010031
[refine search] [Print]
Prepare selected records for download

International Genealogical Index / British Isles - 6
Select records to download - (50 maximum)
1. MOSES JOHNSON - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Birth: 20 AUG 1809

2. MOSES JOHNSON - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Christening: 25 FEB 1810 Wolstanton, Stafford, England

3. SAMUEL JOHNSON - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Birth: 07 OCT 1811

4. SAMUEL JOHNSON - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Christening: 03 NOV 1811 Wolstanton, Stafford, England

5. THOMAS JOHNSON - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Birth: 20 AUG 1809

6. THOMAS JOHNSON - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Christening: 25 FEB 1810 Wolstanton, Stafford, England

These are all extracted from parish records.

I have found a baptism for a John Johnson dated 17/11/1822 at Alsagersbank, Audley, Staffs but sadly it is only a submitted entry ??

I have also found a baptism for a Hannah Johnson again only a submitted entry...05/01/1817 Alsagersbank, Audlem, Staffs...parents Moses and Maria Johnson ??

I hope this helps somewhat...

Linda

Hi LInda,

Thank you for all your help in searching. Can I run something else by you please:

I know that samuel was born out of wedlock in 1838 but on his marriage cert to Letitia it definitly shows a George Johnson as his father. DO you think that this is wrong and could be a different relative? who was put down because he was ilegitimate?

Thanks again

It is not uncommon for an illegitimate child to add a father's name on a marriage cert to cover up the fact that he/she were illegitimate.

Have you the birth cert for Samuel...does it name a George Johnson as the father...usually tthe father's name is is left unknown in the case of illegitimacy.

The only other way I can see is that Hannah Johnson married a George Johnson...but on the marriage cert to Thomas Shenton it would read Hannah formally Johnson late Johnson.

Linda

This the 1841 census for the other Moses Johnson...

Name: Moses Johnson
Age: 30
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1811
Gender: Male
Where born: Staffordshire, England

Civil Parish: Wolstanton
Hundred: North Pirehill
County/Island: Staffordshire
Country: England

Street address:

Occupation: View Image

Registration district: Wolstanton
Sub registration district: Wolstanton
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members: Name Age
Moses Johnson 30
Thos Johnson 45
Maria Johnson 3
John Cork 40

And 1851...

Name: Moses Johnson
Age: 41
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1810
Relation: Son-in-law
Gender: Male
Where born: Wolstanton, Staffordshire, England

Civil Parish: Chesterton
County/Island: Staffordshire
Country: England

Street address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Disability: View Image

Registration district: Wolstanton
Sub registration district: Wolstanton
ED, institution, or vessel: 1b
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 154
Household Members: Name Age
Hannah Owen 61
Moses Johnson 41 >>>widower
Maria Johnson 13

Interesting that this Moses's daughter has the name Marie...perhaps this is the Moses I found on IGI ??

All very confusing lol.

Linda

confusing it is indeed. Im not too sure of the birth cert. although on his marriage cert. if deffinitly has a George Johnson as his father.

Don't know where to turn next.

Thanks again