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Charles Edwards aged 40yrs on 1911 census, 31yrs on 1901 and 36 yrs on marriage certificate March 1909 both census show correct family only it is thought his age was adjusted throughout .Surname change is not proven but a gut feeling and matches Speakman by place and precise date except year . Bible entry is my grandfathers handwriting

Charles senior age on his death certificate shown 68 years in June 1931 as declared by his son, making his birth year 1863.

Jeff

Jeff

Is that 1911 census that Viv gave you correct. If so it does not match a marriage in 1909. There are several possible Charles Edwards/Louisa marriages. Do you have confirmation of Louisa's maiden name from a birth cert (or the family bible)

One further thing which may be accidental. My father was registered Charles Edwards but christened Charles Edward Edwards.

The big question how do I prove his previous existence is connected to me

Jeff

I cant help to prove that you are right ,but I certainly cant find anything to disprove it either.

As you say,the only thing that does not add up properly is the fathers name of Charles versus William.

And he did marry as soon as Betsy died.
Does that make him look guilty of a name change and it being the same person.
In my opinion,for what its worth,yes...

1901 England Census
about Betsy Speakman
Name: Betsy Speakman<<<<married
[Betsy Yates]
Age: 39
Estimated birth year: abt 1862
Relation: Head
Mother's Name: Ann
Gender: Female
Where born: Burslem, Staffordshire, England

Civil parish: Burslem
Ecclesiastical parish: St John
County/Island: Staffordshire
Country: England

1911
EDWARDS, Charles Head Married M 40 1871 Bricklayers Labourer Chesterfield Derbyshire
EDWARDS, Louisa Wife Married
12 years F 30 1881 Hanley Staffshire
EDWARDS, Charlie Son Single M 11 1900 School Lancs Manchester
EDWARDS, Nellie Daughter Single F 8 1903 School Lancs Manchester
EDWARDS, Wilfred Son Single M 6 1905 School Lancs Manchester
EDWARDS, Harold Son Single M 1 1910 Lancs Manchester

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Registration District:
Prestwich


Address:
40 Clara St Miles Platting Manchester

Message

From Jeff

Thanks for your reply
This Charles son of William still in Derbyshire in 1901 when my grandfather in Manchester

Jeff...
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I am sorry but your message doesnt really make sense to me,please could you clarify it.
viv

Where did you come from Evelyn?????

Have you applied for this birth cert?

Name: Charles Edwards
Year of Registration: 1869
Quarter of Registration: Jan-Feb-Mar
District: Chesterfield
County: Derbyshire
Volume: 7b
Page: 578

I see that he still says he was born Chesterfield on 1911.
But fibbing about how long he has been married??

Father died when he was young and mother remarried so he could be on earlier census but not showing as Edwards

I have searched for my grandfather prior to1901 for the past 11 years without success but with a little help and a fresh pair of eyes who knows what could be revealed.

He is shown in the 1901 census aged 31 born Chesterfield , Derbyshire with Louisa and son Charles living at Fildes St, Broughton , Lancs. His marriage cert March 1st 1909 shows his father to be Charles occupation labourer, g.f. is aged 36 ( birth year 1873 ).

A family bible shows his birth date January 14th 1871 Chesterfield although he is thought by his children to be older than declared

In my searches I have run up many blind alleys but in thinking outside the box have searched for Charles Edward ??? in both Chesterfield Derbyshire and Staffordshire. Recently finding Charles Edward Speakman registered March quarter 1863 who was born Chesterfield Staffs January 14th 1863. In 1891 Charles Speakman lived with wife Betsy in Burslem, whilst approximately half a mile away Louisa lived with her parents. 1901 Charles Speakman is no where to be found but Charles Edwards pops up in Fildes St , Broughton Lancs living with Louisa. Betsy Speakman dies in December quarter 1908 and Louisa and Charles Edwards marry March 1st 1909.

Can anybody help or provide any information which may prove Speakman becomes Edwards . If my theory is correct he was 19 years older than Louisa, no wonder they fled to Lancashire. Charles Speakmans father was named William which does not correspond to his sons marriage cert .

Jeff