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Hi, My great great grandfather is William Bailey (born 1870), who is the illegitemate son of Emma Bailey (born 1844). He went on to marry Elizabeth Caroline Bawden and the Bailey name carried on. Obviously things would be quite different if the father had came forward (i.e I would'nt be called Rebekha Bailey for starters!)

I have read on this forum that it was rumoured that Emma got pregnant by the lord of the manor that she was working at.However, I have know idea which lord or which manor this was. Emma did'nt stay at the manor, she always lived at home. So census records are no good.There was also another son born in 1874. However, he died at 6 weeks. Therefore was buried with no name or funeral rites.

If anybody could help at all. I will be SO SO gratefull.

Rebekha

Suggest you do a google search to find which manor. I did.

What did you google, Patricia??

And Rebekha, can you give a link to the thread where you read this, on this forum? Just so we can see what info there is there.


1871 census for info

William Baily 58
Honnor Baily 60
Emma Baily 29
William Baily 22
William Baily 1

Civil parish: Phillack
County/Island: Cornwall
Registration district: Redruth


It can help to know how names are spelled in records.

Ancestry has transcribed him as a son of William and Honnor, which is how the census reads, given the order of the names. Given Honnor's age, it obviously ain't so. ;)

It does have William born in Redruth, not Phillack. Is it possible that he was born where Emma was working?

(I know the problem. I have a great-aunt who was born just before the 1891 census, whose "father", we were told, was the son of the household where her mother was working in a different part of Nottinghamshire ...)

You could try contacting the online parish clerk -
http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~phillack/

In 1871 they're at Trevassack Rd, and in 1881 & 1891 they're living in High Lanes which intersects with Trevassack Hill. If the story is true, and most family legends have to be taken with a grain of salt, then Trevassack Manor seems to be the place.

I agree with Joy in that the parish record may have a little bit more information on it than the birth cert.

Ozi

Referring to the birth and death of 6 week old child, I think that is rather a long time not to be named and possibly baptised. Also there would definitely have to be a death cert.

Even if a child only lived hours there was a death cert.

Ozi

Previous threads at GR (by different poster) - is that what you're referring to, Rebekha? Both on Records Office board.


http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/boards.asp?wci=thread&tk=910659

Jan 18th February 2004 19:49
hi looking for BAILEY family Phillack cornwall,Ihave got WILLIAM BAILEY MARRIED ELIZABETH CAROLINE BOWDEN 1892 Looking now for there PARENTS AND BIRTHS
Thanks Jan


http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/boards.asp?wci=thread&tk=910606

Jan 19th February 2004 18:24
bailey family phillack hayle cornwall possilby highlanes address,all census for phillack seem to be either on cd held at records office, can't find any online
thanks Jan


You can try contacting that GR member by clicking her name in one of those threads -- here's the direct link to contact her (copy this into the white address line at the top of your monitor and hit Enter):

http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/messages.page/new?ck=681127

and that name does sound familiar, but I don't know whether she's still around the site these days.

The only child born and died about that time is

Births Dec 1873
Bailey Samuel Redruth 5c 237
Deaths Dec 1873
Bailey Samuel 0 Redruth 5c 167

But there are other Bailey families in Phillack.

Ozi

http://pilot.familysearch.org/recordsearch/start.html

on a search for any Bailey event in Cornwall 1869 to 1876, mother Emma; "U" would mean "unknown", I think.

Name: U Bailey
Gender: Male
Death Date: 22 Nov 1873
Death Place: Phillack, Cornwall, England
Age: 0
Birth Date: 1873
Mother's Name: Emma Bailey
Indexing Project (Batch) Number: I03831-2
System Origin: England-EASy
Source Film Number: 1596142
Reference Number: 81
Collection: England Deaths and Burials, 1538-1991


-- edit -- looks like possibly that Samuel!

Yes, Janey, I saw that, and agree. Are those pilot search records ALWAYS from parish records? That has all the tell-tale marks of a submitted entry to me.

Ozi

No, they aren't always extracted, very true. I've run across one for a birth or marriage, I forget, that was definitely submitted, as confirmed by the submitted entry found in the IGI, e.g.

I suspect you're right about that one. The Samuel death matches the dates, so it would be worth checking that death cert -- the parent(s) of a child who died in infancy are recorded on the death certificate, in my experience.


... Hmm, interestingly, I searched for records with that film number, 1596142, in the IGI, and there's no Bailey in the list. Or Samuel.

Manors
•The Manorial Documents Register (MDR), maintained by the Historical Documents Commission notes that, so far as can be established, the parish of Phillack contained only the manor of Connerton, which was also associated with the parish of Gwithian.
•The MDR contains the following information for this manor:
◦Accounts with other manors 1387-1797 (non consecutive), court rolls 1488-90, 1524, 1570-75, 1742, court rolls (copies) 1588-89, court rolls with other manors 1451, 1557-65, 1572-73, court books with other manors 1670-75, 1733-37, 1792-96, rentals with other manors 1460-65, 1499, 1571, 1578, 1586-1603, 1618, c1627, 1662-1799, list of freehold tenants 1715, accounts, bills and expenses rel to court dinner 1712-42, court expenses 1704, presentments with other manors 1732-72, presentments (extracts and copies 1695-1759 rel to right of wreck), papers rel to right of wreck c1750, court proceedings 1755, notes and extracts (incl from court roll 1594 and from audit book 1582-1668) rel to right of wreck made 1755 and survey 1673 in Cornwall Record Office, Old County Hall, Truro TR1 3AY (ref: AR/2/92-98, 740, 749-51, 755-6, 768, 778-9, 782-816, 818, 885-12151337, 1340-79; AR/3/88-96; AR/15/48-9, 68, 101, 117-18, 138).
◦Account roll with other manors 1575-76 in the Cornwall Record Office (ref: DDX 609).
•Further information on Manor Houses in Phillack parish can be found online.

But , actually, I was also 'fishing' to see if Rebekha would get back . She has not.

An Index to the Historical Place Names of Cornwall website has Trevassack as a "parcel of the manor of Conartoun" (later spelling is Connerton.) In 1844 this was "Several tenements, including one, 21 acres, 3 roods and 8 perches, occupied by the Cornish Copper Co."

On the Cornish Copper Company webpage of rootsweb a "PASCOE, ERASMUS (1654-1723) of >>>>> Trevassack Manor <<<<< in Phillack; Sheriff of Cornwall in 1720 and reputedly Manager of the Angarrack Tin Smelting Company from 1704. He was the lessor of that part of Ventonleage which the CCC acquired in 1756 from his son John's Executor. His tombstone is still to be seen in Phillack Churchyard."

I'm sure the locals would call this "the manor".

Ozi

I was hoping Rebekha might return ... same time, next day, maybe ...

Hello!. Don't worry, you don't have to start a 'trying to find' thread for 'Rebekha Bailey' just yet!. I wasn't expecting such a response in less than 24 hours. Thankyou everyone for all your work.

Hi, Janey. Yes it was Jan Bailey who posted this. However it was back in 2004. Ive emailed her. But had no response.

Ozibird, thankyou so much. That is the 6 week old child that I found on the genuki site. I now know his name! :-D. It makes sense as Samuel was also Emma's brother's name.

Ive looked at Connerton manor and the possible 'Lord' who was resided there at the relevant time was a gentleman called: Richard Oke Millet. Who was quite an intersting character by the looks of things!. The Millett family was also heavily involved with the Cornish Copper Company.So that is one possibility.

Im very fascinated by this Trevassack manor. Well spotted Ozibird!. I never noticed this on the census before. I shall go investigate this and get back.

Thanks

Please remember the online parish clerk -
http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~phillack/

Online parish clerks sometimes choose the area on which to focus their voluntary work because they know the area.

Ok thankyou :-)