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ian
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16 Aug 2021 10:37 |
thanks all for the info
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ErikaH
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14 Aug 2021 13:14 |
The poster asked ONLY about Lithgow ;-) ;-) ;-) ;-)
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Maddie
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14 Aug 2021 13:13 |
om fmp
Harold Fawcett Last name Pilcher Birth year 1900 Birth date 08 Oct 1900 Birth town London Birth county Middlesex Occupation Tool maker ------------------- Attestation year 1918 Attestation date 16 Sep 1918 Attestation age 18 Service number 296118 Archive reference AIR 79/2582 Next of kin first name(s) - Next of kin last name Pilcher
1911 24 Kangley Bdge Road Lower Sydenham, Lewisham, London & Kent, England
Married Male 48 1863 Blacksmith Kent Hythe Hannah Pilcher Wife Married Female 43 1868 - Surrey Penge Walter R Pilcher Son Single Male 17 1894 Instrument maker London Sydenham William A Pilcher Son Single Male 16 1895 Boy clerk London Sydenham Frank H Pilcher Son Single Male 15 1896 Office boy London Sydenham Harold F Pilcher Son - Male 10 1901 School London Sydenham Alice M Pilcher Daughter - Female 3 1908 - London Sydenham Deborah Pilcher Mother Widow Female 80 1831 - Kent Selling Record set British Royal Air Force, Airmen's Service Records 1912-1939
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ArgyllGran
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13 Aug 2021 18:13 |
Good find, alviegal.
However, it seems they didn't marry, at least not in the UK:
Harold Fawcett Pilcher in the England & Wales, Civil Registration Death Index, 1916-2007 Name: Harold Fawcett Pilcher Death Age: 82 Birth Date: 8 Oct 1900 Registration Date: Oct 1982[Nov 1982] [Dec 1982] Registration Quarter: Oct-Nov-Dec Registration District: Hove Inferred County: East Sussex Volume: 18 Page: 1115
Harold Fawcett Pilcher in the UK, Royal Air Force Airmen Records, 1918-1940 Name: Harold Fawcett Pilcher Gender: Male Age: 18 Birth Date: 8 Oct 1900 Birth Place: Lewisham, London, London, England Service Date: 16 Sep 1918 Service Number: 296118 Father: Walter William Pilcher Next of Kin: Walter William Pilcher Relation to Airman: Father
Possibly a later actual marriage??
Harold F Pilcher in the England & Wales, Civil Registration Marriage Index, 1916-2005 Name: Harold F Pilcher Registration Date: Oct 1962[Nov 1962] [Dec 1962] Registration Quarter: Oct-Nov-Dec Registration District: Hove Inferred County: Sussex Spouse: Nora Carr Volume Number: 5h Page Number: 561
Norah Pilcher in the England & Wales, National Probate Calendar (Index of Wills and Administrations), 1858-1995 Name: Norah Pilcher [Nora Pilcher] Death Date: 25 Apr 1981 Death Place: Hove Probate Date: 27 May 1981 Probate Registry: Brighton
Nora Salew Pilcher in the England & Wales, Civil Registration Death Index, 1916-2007 Name: Nora Salew Pilcher Death Age: 80 Birth Date: 25 Jul 1900 Registration Date: Apr 1981[May 1981] [Jun 1981] Registration Quarter: Apr-May-Jun Registration District: Brighton Inferred County: East Sussex Volume: 18 Page: 0270
BUT you still need the 1957 marriage cert to find out about William Lithgow, Ian!
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alviegal
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13 Aug 2021 18:10 |
Howard Lloyd Last name Pryce Role Occupier Year 1921 Date 05 Apr 1921 House number 13 Address Spencer Road County Hampshire Country England Parish Portsea Place Portsea Island Owner's first name(s) W W Owner's last name Evans
He was a travelling Commissioner in the Gambia.
His wife in 1911. So it looks like Angela Mary was from quite a well to do family.
1911 Census For England & Wales 22 Cedars Road Clapham S W, Wandsworth Borough, London & Surrey, England
First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Sex Age Birth year Occupation Birth place Herbert Fogeltson Bartlett Head Married Male 63 1848 Civil service commisioner - inland revenue Plymouth Devon France Mary Bartlett Wife Married Female 63 1848 - Cambridge Cambridge Ethel Constance Bartlett Daughter Married Female 32 1879 - Dulwick Surrey Laura Simpson Hospital nurse Single Female 30 1881 Nurse sick Wolstanton Stafford Elizabeth Fyfe Hospital nurse Single Female 28 1883 Nurse sick Ruchevill Aberdeen Ethel Elpick Servant Single Female 23 1888 Servant Herstmonco East Surrey >>Vivienne Pryce Daughter Married Female 29 1882 - Clapham Surrey Fanny Wyeth Servant Single Female 38 1873 Servant Sunbury Surrey
and her probate index. Same address mentioned in the above post.
Vivienne Last name Pryce Death year 1956 Death date 26 Mar 1956 Probate year 1956 Probate date 08 Jun 1956 Residence town The Towans (Tiranoque) Registry London County Cornwall Linked persons Frank Archibald Stanley Gibson Country England Record set England & Wales Government Probate Death Index 1858-2019
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alviegal
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13 Aug 2021 17:57 |
Births Jun 1936 (>99%) Lambert Michael C Millard Portsmouth 2b 799 Norris Sheila Pearce Portsmouth 2b 799 >>PILCHER Richard F Lloyd-Pryce Portsmouth 2b 799 TAYLOR Margaret P Betts Portsmouth 2b 799 WATSON Beryl E Castleton Portsmouth 2b 799
Births Sep 1913 Pryce Angela M Bartlett Havant 2b 701
Marriages Sep 1904 (>99%) Bartlett Vivienne Wandsworth 1d 1205 Pryce Howard Lloyd Wandsworth 1d 1205
Name: Harold Fawcett Pilcher Gender: Male Departure Age: 47 Birth Date: abt 1901 Departure Date: 17 Feb 1948 Departure Port: England Ship Name: Empire Windrush Shipping Line: P& O New Zealand Shipping Co Ltd Destination Port: Aden, Yemen
Travelling with 34 year old wife, Mary Angela Pilcher. Last address in UK was Tiranoque, Towans, Hayle, Cornwall.
Name: Master Richard Fawcett Pilcher Arrival Age: 2 Birth Date: abt 1936 Port of Departure: Kingston, Jamaica Arrival Date: 29 Aug 1938 Port of Arrival: Bristol, England Ports of Voyage: Kingston and Bermuda Ship Name: Carare Shipping Line: Messrs Elders and Fyffes Ltd Official Number: 147345
Travelling with 25 year old Mrs Angela Mary Pilcher to 13 Spencer Rd, Southsea, Hants.
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ErikaH
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13 Aug 2021 16:12 |
The man born 1934 is LIVING and has had two wives, neither of whom was Pilcher
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Shirley~I,m getting the hang of it
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13 Aug 2021 15:39 |
The only way to identify him is to get the marriage cert to Mary Pilcher
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ArgyllGran
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13 Aug 2021 15:33 |
On the other hand, William 1934 was educated at Winchester College.
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Kucinta
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13 Aug 2021 15:26 |
I agree, William 1934 is unlikely to be Angela Mary's husband, presumably she was being facetious in the events recorded by the news article, especially as by that time William had already succeeded to the title, but felt it warranted a little investigation.
Marriage cert required!
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ArgyllGran
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13 Aug 2021 15:15 |
Although the marriage to Valerie Scott was registered in 1st qr 1963, I think they married in late 1963.
Valerie died in Glasgow in August 1964.
"GLASGOW, Scotland, Aug. 7 (AP)—Lady Lithgow, the wife of Sir William Lithgow, the millionaire shipbuilder, died last night in a hospital. Her age was 28. She was stricken a week ago with encephalitis, a virus infection of the brain. Sir William, who is 29, is himself confined to bed with mumps. They had been married a year." https://www.nytimes.com/1964/08/08/archives/lady-lithgow.html
William 1934 and second wife still live in Argyll.
I would be very surprised if William 1934 is the man who married Angela - but Alviegal's newspaper clipping is interesting - maybe Mary Angela was drunkenly joking??
Can only repeat - you need the 1957 marriage cert.
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Kucinta
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13 Aug 2021 14:26 |
Re alviegal's news item. Lord Lithgow did have a son, still living now, William J. He was born in 1934, and succeeded to the title.
Just google for more info.
He is the chap who married Mary C Hill in 1967.
EDIT, the titled William J Lithgow had been married before, to a Valerie H Scott in Mar 1964 Tonbridge 5b 2113.
No mention of a marriage to cougar Mary Angela
http://www.thepeerage.com/p41867.htm
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alviegal
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13 Aug 2021 14:20 |
Alternative 1939 for Angela. This has her year of birth as 1873 but it does read 1913. Name is Angela M Pilcher.
1939 Register White Waltham Grove, White Waltham, Cookham R.D., Berkshire, England
Household members (7 people) First name(s) Last name(s) DOB Sex Occupation Marital status Schedule Schedule Sub Number Ronald K Inman 05 Mar 1881 Male Surveyor & Valuer Ret Married 227 1 Ida B Inman 27 Sep 1884 Female Unpaid Domestic Dut Married 227 2 Diana K Inman 20 Nov 1920 Female Womens Single 227 3 Guthrie M Inman 26 Feb 1912 Male Solicitors Practitioners Single 227 4 >>Angela Lithgow (Pitcher) 13 Apr 1873 Female Unpaid Domestic Married 227 5 Suzanne Woods 20 May 1917 Female Unpaid Domestic Dut Married 227 6 Francis Wainwright 07 Sep 1892 Female State Certified Edwife & District Single 227 7
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ErikaH
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13 Aug 2021 14:08 |
That would mean there had been a divorce…………
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Shirley~I,m getting the hang of it
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13 Aug 2021 14:03 |
Did he maybe remarry
Name: William J Lithgow Registration Date: Jul 1967 [Aug 1967] [Sep 1967] Registration Quarter: Jul-Aug-Sep Registration District: Mere Inferred County: Wiltshire Spouse: Mary C Hill Volume Number: 7c Page Number: 2063
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alviegal
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13 Aug 2021 13:57 |
???
WOMAN DRIVER ON DRINK CHARGE Asked for her identity by a doctor, a woman replied "Lord Lithgow's daughter." Later she amended this to "Lord Lithgow's daughter in law." This was stated at Havant Magistrate's Court yesterday when Mary Angela Lithgow (45) a housewife and television audience interviewer of The White Cottage, Castle Road, Rowlands castle .....
10 December 1958 - Portsmouth Evening News - Portsmouth, Hampshire, England
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Shirley~I,m getting the hang of it
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13 Aug 2021 13:39 |
Get the marriage cert for its info Marriages Sep 1957 LITHGOW William J PILCHER Penzance 7a 243 PILCHER Mary A LITHGOW Penzance 7a 243
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ArgyllGran
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13 Aug 2021 12:24 |
No help with William -
In the 1939 Register, Angela/Mary is listed as married.
Possible first marriages:
Marriages Mar 1936 (>99%) Pilcher Philip C Robineault Hampstead 1a 1141 Robincault Angela Pilcher Hampstead 1a 1141
Marriages Sep 1929 (>99%) Aumonier Mary A Pilcher Hampstead 1a 1947 PILCHER Charlie D Aumonier Hampstead 1a 1947
Marriages Sep 1933 (>99%) Pilcher Alfred F Simpson Paddington 1a 181 Simpson Mary A Pilcher Paddington 1a 181
EDIT: Not the 1929 couple - that woman's middle name was Allison, born 1907, per a tree on Ancestry.
Not the 1936 couple - that woman's name was Angelina, born 21 March 1912, died 1979 in Bristol.
Not the 1933 couple either! Her middle name was Ann, and they are together in London in 1939.
Ah, well!
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ArgyllGran
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13 Aug 2021 12:05 |
Assuming William was (very) roughly about Angela Mary's age, and assuming his middle name was given, there are two possible deaths:
LITHGOW, WILLIAM JOHN 1927 GRO Reference: DOR Q1/2010 in BEDFORD (3161B) Reg 1B009 Entry Number 502898466
Deaths Dec 1959 (>99%) LITHGOW William J 41 Chesterfield 3a 171
But that's assuming a lot!
You definitely need the marriage cert.
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Maddie
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13 Aug 2021 12:02 |
not that it helps
1939
Nethercliffe West Waltham, Woolley Green, Cookham R.D., Berkshire, England 1939 register badge View original record Transcript of Angela M's record First name(s) Angela M Last name(s) Lithgow (Pelcher) DOB 13 Apr 1913 Birth day 13 Birth month 4 Birth year 1913 Sex Female Occupation Unpaid Domestic Duties Marital status Married Place Cookham R.D. Schedule 227 Schedule Sub Number 5 Address Nethercliffe West Waltham, Woolley Green E. D. letter code DUFH Borough / District Cookham R.D. County Berkshire County Berkshire Country England Piece number 2072E Item number 20 Line number 19
Name: Angela Mary Lithgow Death Date: 10 May 1988 Death Place: Winchester Hants Probate Date: 9 Jun 1988 Probate Registry: Winchester
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