Genealogy Chat

i am wondering if anyone can help me with tracing records of a divorce between Alfred Adams 1901-?1978 and his wife Cicely Hedden 1898-1800. They married in 1921 and had 2 children, Lesley Alfred 1922-2003 and Marjorie 1923-2011. They allegedly divorced some time after 1929 in London or close areas. Thankyou in advance.

How wealthy were they? At that time divorce was almost impossible for the normal working person.

My father-in-law was married in 1926 and the marriage broke up whilst he was away in the army. They could not divorce but both went on to live as a "married couple" with other partners. My mother-in-law was his second partner and I spent years looking for their marriage only to find out a couple of years ago that she had changed her name by deed poll so that she could register my hubby and his brother's births as if they were married. We found the deed poll record in the London Gazette.

Kath. x

I doubt if they had a lot of money but her brother was a clerk in a solicitors office and we were always told that he facilitated the divorce but perhaps it was too expensive and they just told everyone that was what happened. Guess I'll never know. Thanks Kath x

Very few divorce records survive so it's unlikely you will find any

Did he remarry ?? His marital status may give a clue on the new marriage cert

Marriages Sep 1921
Adams Alfred Hedden Wandsworth 1d 1453
Hedden Cicely Adams Wandsworth 1d 1453

Ratcliffe (Adams) Household (4 People)

16 Acre Lane , Lambeth, London, England.

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FIRST NAME(S) LAST NAME(S) DOB OCCUPATION
Cicely Ratcliffe (Adams) 14 Oct 1898 Receiving Office Manageress
**Leslie A Adams 16 Feb 1922 Seeking Wo**k
Frederick T Williams 02 Feb 1887 Foreman Cook
Albert S Hedder (image reads HEDDEN 10 Nov 1896 Assistant Manager,,,,,,a brother?

Cicely in 1939...she at some point used the surname of Ratcliffe.

national archives doesnt show any records for either Alfred or Cicley for divorce but not all show a paper trail.

There are records of various Alfred Adams marriages but without sending for th marriage certificates one wouldn't know if one of them is him and that could prove expensive.

Hello Kay
I am really confused now. I know that during the war she lived with someone called Freddie so I assume that was Frederick Williams. At some point he died and she later moved to Streatham [31 Streatham Place] where from when I was about 5 in 1948 she was living with a Charles Ratcliffe who she was with for many years but how she came to be calling herself Ratcliffe in 1939 I don't understand. She was my grandmother and right until she died in 1980 my mother thought she was married to Charles Ratcliffe from some time in the 50's or 60's but papers left proved that they never actually married. Very mysterious and there is no one left now that I can ask.
Wendy

katqueen ...............


she wasn't calling herself Ratcliffe in 1939 ....................


the 1939 Register was used as the basis for the NHS when that came into force in 1947, and the Register was then constantly updated by the NHS until about (correction) 1991........... deaths and female marriages were the main updates.

The LATER married name is always shown first, and any previous surnames used between 1939 and the newest are shown in brackets ........... that's ebcause the latest name is the one that a woman would have been using in the NHS


So .................. Cicely was Adams in 1939, and living with her son Leslie, Frederick Williams and Alfred Hedden

Some time after 1947, the NHS corrected her name to Ratcliffe and that became the name in use.


Edited ca 1:10 pm ............... correct wrong date to 1991

Out of interest ............... there is a notation in the margin that Cicely's name change was noted 10-9-48

so it looks as though she either married or became common-law and changed her name earlier than your mother thought

Thankyou so much Sylvia. I thought I was going potty but your dates match with what I was told and my memories. I know that she never remarried but still don't know if she actually divorced Alfred Adams or what happened to him after they parted company.

From the National Archives....

The survival rate of divorce case files is:

1858-1927: almost 100%
1928-1937: 80%
After 1937: less than 0.2%

I have 2 KNOWN divorces that took place between 1946-1952 but NO records have survived!

You could request a search of the Decree Nisi which would be available IF a divorce took place!!
I understand it would cost around £65 if you don't have any details.

Joan.

EDIT to add.....I am told there are no nitty gritty details shown on the Decree Nisi!

If it happened I would say it was between 1928 and 1937. How does one access those records in the National Archives please?

www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
.................
.................What records can I see online?
Divorce case files (1858-1916)
Search and download divorce case files for England and Wales (J 77/1/A1 – J 77/1063/2238) at Ancestry.co.uk (£).
........................................................

........What records can I find at The National Archives at Kew?
Divorce case files (1858-1937)............

Search Discovery, our catalogue, by name of petitioner, respondent or corespondent for divorce suits in England and Wales, both successful and unsuccessful, in J 77.

Narrow your search by using double quotation marks to find a person’s full name, such as “John Williams”.

Joan.

Thankyou for that will have a search tomorrow and post the results.

If she lived with Charles Ratcliffe for many years but didn't marry him then I would say that would suggest that she never actually divorced Alfred. If she had been divorced there would have been no reason not to marry Charles (unless he too was also married to someone else). In those years between the wars it was more common than you would expect.

Kath. x

sorry Kathleen for the late response but I have had a visitor for a few days and have been unable to get on the net. I do know that Charles Ratcliffe was definitely a widower as his wife died in the flu epidemic which I think was somewhere around 1918. I do know that my mother thought they were married but when my grandmother went to live with hr and she was sorting papers out it was mentioned that they had a date set at the registry office but something happened which caused them to cancel it and for some reason they never bothered again. It looks as if it will remain shrouded in mystery but thanks for every ones input. Would love to have known what happened to my grandfather Alfred Adams but I think I will have to give up!
Regards Wendy

Perhaps she hadn't told Charles Ratcliffe that she was married and when things progressed to him setting a date at the registry office she had to tell him. All speculation I know. It's a shame your grandfather has such a common name otherwise he would be easier to trace.

I have the same problem with my maternal great-grandfather. His name is so common and I don't know enough about him to get back any further on his line.

Kath. x

Thought exactly the same myself and I know my Nan would never have committed
bigamy!
Annoying isn't it when you come to a dead end.
Wendy x