Genealogy Chat

I have been going through Parish Registers looking for rellies. I came across the baptism of the youngest child of my great grandparents in 1897, this being the only baptism registered for the family. Parents names were given as surname of father maiden name of mother. All other entries in the register were listed as married couple or single woman. I have been unable to find any record of marriage for this couple, would this denote that they were never married? I also cannot find my great grandmothers death, could her death have been registered under her maiden name? Hope someone has the answer. Many thanks. Dorothy, Sydney

Hi Dorothy It sounds quite likely that they were not married. Usually, as you say, you do not get mother's maiden name. Do you find them as a family on a census? If they were living as a family unit, in a town, she may well have taken her husband's surname. In a community where her circumstances were known to everyone, she would be unlikely to be granted the curtesy title of wife.

Hi Brenda Many thanks for your reply. Yes I have them on census from 1881-1901 as a family unit. I had a suspicion they did not marry but thought she would automatically take on the surname of my ggrandfather. So would that mean she would be known by her maiden name? Dorothy I forgot to mention it would have been a small community in which they lived.

The parish register entry might mean that they weren't married - she could well have been known by her 'husband's surname in ordinary life but the vicar knew the truth and registered then as such BUT they could have been married. I have come across couples listed like this in baptism register when I know they were married - could it be that a visiting vicar, used to a different system baptised this child or maybe the vicar used wife's maiden name to differentiate between two couples with same christian names.

Sounds as it they passed themselves off as married as often as they could (what is on the childrens birth certs?), but sometimes this wasn't possible! Anyone can call themselves whatever they like in this country as long as it isn't for a deceptive purpose, so she would have been within her rights to go by his surname, but the vicar probably had a different opinion, if they were not married in the eyes of God... If you cannot find the death reg in the ''married'' name, it would certainly be worth looking under the maiden surname too. Was there a reason they didn't marry? (maybe another spouse still in existance somewhere?). How hard have you looked for a marriage??!! Sarah

Hi Judith and Sarah Thanks for your reply. You have probably gathered I am only learning this family history. The birth certificate of my grandfather listed his father's name and the mothers name as Elizabeth Jane Fisher formerly Mitchenson. I have really searched the GRO indexes for a marriage and eventually gave up. I have not searched the parish records so far as have been unable to do so, due to being in Sydney, and not being able to get a look up. I just thought when a saw the baptism register 'ah maybe they were not married after all'. Thank you for your advice. Dorothy Off now will be back in the morning. Take care.

I wonder why only one child is baptised? This may be a sop to religion. On the other hand, the other children may have been baptised as methodists, congregationalists etc. These records may still be with the church or chapel. It is possible that the vicar is highlighting strangers, but it does seem odd that he is singling out this treatment just for your ancestors.

One person in my tree was baptised and it showed the name of the parents as Mary Hill and Richard Hough. At this point they had been married for 4 years! On another child of the couple the vicar 'forgot' to fill in the box with the parents names. Perhaps he was busy that day? Pippa

Dorothy - Where was the baptism registered - in which parish?

Here again. Thank you all for your information. The 1881-1901 censuses show that they lived in the parish of Mickley, Northumberland, for many years. The baptised child was the last of the family, and she was named after an earlier child, Sarah Jane, who had died at 8 years and is buried in the same church grounds. Maybe this was why she was baptised. I really do appreciate your comments. Dorothy

Dorothy - I think I may have found the marriage of your couple. On Free BMD there are transcriptions of parish registers and in June 1876 it shows an entry which included the names Thomas Fisher and Elizabeth Jane Mitchieson. The marriage would have taken place in Newcastle T (Newcastle upon Tyne). The variation in the spelling of Elizabeth's surname may be down to a mistake in transcription somewhere. I hope this helps.

Hi Linda Back again. Sorry have not been on the computer very much over the past days have had a touch of flu. Thank you so much for the info. My ggrandfather was called Fisher Fisher (strange name). However I do think this marriage on FreeBMD might be the one. As I don't think there would be many Elizabeth Jane Mitchiesons, and 1876 does fit in with the birth of the first child. It is quite strange, as he is listed as Thomas on my grandfathers marriage, and all other paperwork shows Fisher Fisher, including his own baptism on the Norfolk parish registers. Many many thanks for your help, I will order the certificate. Regards Dorothy

Linda - just so you know, the entries on FreeBMD are from the GRO indexes, not from parish registers. There is a sister site to FreeBMD called FreeREG which is for parish register transcriptions, but it is not up and running yet. Kate.

On my grandfather's birth certificate on 1888 the mother is shown as Sherwood, formerly Cowley. They did not marry until 1893.

Hi just seen this thread On one set of parish records I have looked at there was not only mothers maiden name but her parents names inlcuding the fathers occupations and the fathers parents and his fathers occupation. On one it gave mother and father married name then mothers maiden name next child for same parents gave mothers maiden name , but both had childs G-parents details on . I don't know if this is any help to you at all. Have also had mothers name and fathers name with comment illegitimate child of the father written in next to child name. Jan

My thanks to everyone for their help and comments - I really do appreciate your input. Take care Regards, Dorothy