General Chat

There's also the problem of getting a temporary job.
You take the job - it ends - then you end up worse off than before!
...and the staff at the agency wonder why you took it and you are treated with suspicion!
The 'excuse' that, having not been unemployed for the past 30 years, you didn't realise you would lose money by working doesn't seem to wash!

Not to worry, Rose. The private sector is going to provide jobs for all of us. I know this because David (the delusionalist magician) Cameron says so.

sue x

The trouble is it doesn't matter how much the govt bang on about checking/limiting benefits if there are no jobs ! I was at the job centre last week... other than very specific jobs ( fork lift truck drivers/ social care needing specific qualifications etc) the majority of jobs were under 16 hours a week ( if as much as that) or temporary( now till Christmas).

But who can take those part time jobs? not the head of the family whose mortgage needs paying, or the parent with children... they are what used to be called 'pin money' jobs...the 'second income' that 'helped' not the first income that 'supported'. Without investment, without general financial recovery, without 'proper' jobs..no amount of whittling away at benefits costs is going to work long term.

"Gissa job? go on Gissit"

Of course, it's wrong for people to take advantage of a benefits system which was designed to help those in need.

But it's also wrong for people to take advantage of tax loopholes - and it's a pure mockery that one of the worse offenders has been appointed as this government's "efficiency expert"

Philip Green, known for partying with model Kate Moss and X Factor svengali Simon Cowell, as well as his business acumen, banked the biggest pay cheque in corporate history in 2005 when his Arcadia fashion business, which owns Topshop, paid a £1.2bn dividend. The record-breaking payment was paid to his wife, Tina, who lives in Monaco and is the direct owner of Arcadia. As a result, no UK income tax was due.

Sue x

The benefits system was introduced as a safety net but unfortunately has now become a way of life for some. There are those who are able to work but don't think they should and those who work but also like to top up their income with benefits. But there are some who are using the system because they have fallen on hard times.

I welcome a review of the benefit system if the reforms stop being on benefits as a career option. I would also support the notion that child benefit is only paid for the first two children.

KEM
DLA IS paid for the extra care and mobility of the disabled
they wont need it if the are in hospital

they will also be getting ICB or ESA thats for living exspences
and the carers allowance is still paid up to eight weeks

and they will still get housing benefits and community charge exemption

Sandie, I do agree with the last statement you made about those who wont work. We have at least one couple in our street.

I understand everyones anger ..

But some of the things we also dont know about benifits are :

Disability living allowance is STOPPED if you are in hospital for more than 6 weeks ???
Please do tell how someone can run a home without any money coz they dont have an income
My best friend was in and out of hospital with a very chronic disease she had a 16 year old son at school so when she was in he needed to live in the house which she was given because she had a child!!! but no money for him as her allowance should have covered him aswel..in the end he gave up school and became mental ill due to the pressure of looking after his mum .
When she died they gave him two weeks to leave the house as he wouldnt be intitled to living in a two bedroom house when it was just him??? but they wouldnt /couldnt rehouse him as he had a father and he was under 18 by 12 days .
sadly the mental illness got the better of him and he ended in hospital but was then rehoused!!!??

what a country we live in give to them that dont need or cant be bothered to work and take from them who need!!
My sister in law s has 6 children and her hubby WONT work coz they get more on benefits BUT only 3 of the children live with them so when her next one is born they are getting a bigger house!!!! who will pay???

...But, along with the new disability 'standards' - Jean and her OH may be deemed to be capable of working.
Whilst bringing up my children alone, I was accused at least three times of benefit 'cheating' - mainly because (I think) they thought me an easy tatget, as I wasn't 'mouthy'. I may have not been 'mouthy', but neither was I stupid!

The first time was when my ex had a nervous breakdown and went to deepest Western Australia. I didn't know his address, the BA didn't believe me, as I had known his address in UK!!
So that I didn't lose benefit,(according to them) they told me to sign a declaration stating that he was violent and I was frightened of him. (WHO are the benefit cheats?)
I refused, stating quite pointedly that I didn't lie!
They stopped 6 weeks benefit every year for 5 years - a damn sight more than £50 - and I was telling the truth!
Had I signed that piece of paper, it would have been on record that my ex was violent - which he had never been - he then wouldn't be able to do the very worthwhile job he does now, at Colchester Institute, part of which involves teaching special needs children.

The second time was 2 years after the event - when they had overpaid me - and expected the money there and then - I paid it back at £5 a month.

The last one was 2 years after I had left University. I was working as a temp at the time.
They summoned me into the office (that was a day's pay lost) to inform me that they had evidence that I was working at a school in October 1996,(the month I started Uni) and claiming benefit as I was a student.
Apparemtly County Treasurers had the evidence - and they were never wrong! I immediately knew what they had assumed, but was ignored. I had to prove my innocence.

I went to Uni and got copies of the registers. Went to the school I was previously at and got the relevant documents (this was all when I should have been at work, so was losing even more pay), then sat back and waited to be summonsed again - I wasn't going to make the first move.

When I got the letter stating that they were going to take me to court as i hadn't 'come up with the goods' to prove my innocence I phoned them up and asked if they were sure. I had my evidence, but couldn't afford to take another day off work - I didn't mind going to court, as, when proven innocent I would get reinbursed.
They arranged a Saturday appointment!
Of course the stupid planks had just looked at a comuter screen. Yes I had been paid in October - for work I did in SEPTEMBER - somebody hadn't realised that the Council pays a month in arrears!
Nevertheless, I lost 3 days pay thanks to them, and never got an apology - just told 'not to do it again' . Have to admit I wrote back and suggested they check their 'evidence' before accusing innocent people again.

Jean,

You and you OH are one of the peeps I meant who don't cheat:))

You are genuine and like to keep your garden tidy, I'm pleased you can do it.

That is quite a difference from someone on incapacity benefits who will work all day in their garden and also other peoples..for money obviously !

Hubby works 9 to 5 and keeps our large garde very tidy, at the back we grow veg and fruit, and one side is lawned and have a flower bed outside the kitchen , the front is a lawn bordered with flowers.
He has mega probs with both knees, one is swollen like a balloon !

There are peeps much fitter than he is who do not or do not want to work.

Sandie.x

Jgee,
Thanks :))

Sandie.xx

im not shooting you down sandie ..i agree with you ..

jgee..

Just a small point. I have had a bad back for years, my OH was invalided out of the army at 19 with a back injury. He has been told by a neurologist that his back will get worse as he gets older and ther is no way they can help. yet he worked until he was 47, then was made redundant and was told to go home and take the money, but he became self-employed and earned just enough money to keep us going, while my part time wages paid for extras. My point that I want to make, we now recieie benefits, and we keep a tidy garden by dint of doing a small area at a time, and judicious planting that doesnt need much attention. Just because you manage doesnt always mean you cheat. I normally walk outdoors with two sticks and when I fork over our front border with a hand fork I use one, and lean on the waist high wall we have there. I am not saying there are NO cheats, but circumstances MUST be taken into consideration.

I agree that the forms can be difficult to complete.
Also that telephoning them is a nightmare which has changed over the last 6 yrs. You could phone and speak to someone actually dealing with your claim then :)
But people can have help to complete forms from many sources,Friends with a bit of common sense and time to help, CAB. It's not rocket science !

I have worked in what was the Social Security and for my sins the Job centre. I'm am ex civil servant partly because of the above.
Customer Service has gone out of the window !!

Yes the DWP make errors.,which should be corrected.

But a benefit cheat is just that !!!!!!!!!!!! Do you need it spelt out !!

Someone who is making a claim for Job Seekers Allowance, who is working on the side or has not intention of working .

Someone who is claiming an Incapacity benefit ,there are loads of them benefits I mean.. oh yes and the cheats, who can keep a garden perfect they dig it every day... with a bad back !
Someone who claims the can't walk 50 yds without pain yet can referee a football match or run the line.
Someone who claims to have a skin complaint , and puts their hands in Domestos before being seen by a Dr to aggreviate their so called condition,
These people are also working on the side !!
I.e, they are capable of work and should not be claiming benefits full stop.
I could go on and on .but won't bore you any more.

I really feel for the genuine unemployed who WANT to work, and the incapacitated people who are genuine.
Aneurin Bevan would be turning in his grave at these cheats.

What incentive is there for women or a couple claiming benefit producing children, who the taxpayers have to pay for when they can receive more on benefits rather than if they were working.
My husband and I ( gosh I sound like the Queen,lol don't mean to) have worked all our lives and have 2 children, couldn't afford to have any more... end of !

Those and the cheats make MY blood boil, PP..!!

I expect to be shot down in flames from some quarters,
but I have seen it from both sides:)

Fully agree, PP. these forms were 'simplified' - tick-box answers, but if you vary from their pigeon-holing - woe betide you!
It would also help if the peple in the Office knew what they were talking about!
My friend (aged 59) has been unemployed for a year. he has t have a car - he lives in the middle of nowhere, and beng a carpenter,(when he has a job) needs to carry his tools.
He managed to get a months work but things were a bit desperate - car needed servicing, overdraft reaching limit etc, so he asked the BA how cashing in one of his pensions to pay off these bills would affect his allowance when the job finished, 'No problem' he was told.
He went ahead, (losing a lot of the pension in 'administrative fees' in the process) paid off card, overdraft etc, and was left with £50.
He's back on jobseekers now - and has been told, as he had this lump sum, he will lose £25 off his allowance for the next year - giving him £41 a week to live on!
He's going to appeal - but has been told he CAN'T win.

"Benefit cheats will be banned from making claims for three years and face automatic £50 fines under a crackdown tomorrow.

An extra 200 investigators will join an elite squad to hunt benefit and tax cheats A mobile force will probe "each and every claim" in areas where fraud is rife.

A "three strikes and out" rule will see cheats with multiple convictions banned from claiming for three years. They could also lose cars and even houses bought with the proceeds of fraud.

Minor offenders will face instant fines of £50 or more under a plan to free up the courts to deal with the worst cheats.

Fraud and error costs the Government and the taxpayer £5billion a year. This is unfair and unacceptable."

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The salient point in this article is in the last sentence - Fraud and ERROR costs £5 billion.
This is errors on the part of the Benefit Agency!

So, when is a benefit cheat a 'cheat' and when is it Benefit Agency error?

Full article:
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/2010/10/17/benefit-cheats-to-be-banned-from-making-claims-for-three-years-and-face-automatic-50-fines-115875-22640901/