General Chat

Is it just me or does something seem fishy about this rescue or NON rescue, they say there's a gas pocket but i think there's a more underlying reason & were being kept in the dark.

Such as?

Sue

No I don't think there is anything other than the fear that rescuers will be at risk,

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1331990/New-Zealand-explosion-29-trapped-miners-survived.html

"One of two workers who escaped from the mine described the explosion as 'a shotgun blast, but much, much louder and more powerful'.

Daniel Rockhouse, 24, was smashed into the mine wall before collapsing amid the smoky, swirling gas and dust.

When he came to, he dragged himself upright and staggered to a nearby compressed air line to breathe in fresh air and gain some strength.

'I got up and there was thick white smoke everywhere - worse than a fire. I knew straight away that it was carbon monoxide,' Mr Rockhouse, whose brother Ben remains underground, told the New Zealand Herald newspaper.

'I couldn't see anything, and it was dead quiet,' he said. 'I yelled "Help, somebody help me!" But no-one came. There was no-one there.'

He eventually stumbled across the unconscious body of Russell Smith, and dragged him until he awoke. "

I don't know Sue, just got a feeling in me water.

The safety of potential rescuers must be considered surely?
The cocktail of lethal / explosive gases means that everything must be planned for a successful outcome without endangering still more people.
Naturally relatives want a rescue, but not at the cost of other lives.

Why do you think it strange to have caution?

Gwyn

McB , do you think it is just perhaps because over here we like the 'gung ho' kind of attitude to this kind of disaster...rather than the more carefully thought out response?

Not saying that either is right or wrong...just wondering if it is a 'British' thing... admiring heroes rushing in regardless of risk so to speak?

You couldn't drill if there is a possibility of gas because of sparks. That's why it took so long before the Chilean rescue effort commenced.

I have wondered at the lack of urgency but I don't think there's anything underhand is going on.

Sue

I've just watched the latest news and it would appear that they've hit hard rock and that is slowing the drilling. Also the robot that was to be sent down has malfunctioned because of water in the tunnel. A live press conference will be on soon. I can't even begin to imagine how the families are feeling. The NZ prime minister has conceded that there are probably some fatalities.

Sue

It must be awful for the families of those trapped to be waiting and not seeing any action but safety is paramount and what would be the point of risking further explosions at this point. I hope if the men are alive they are in good spirits and if not, then hopefully they all died quickly and with no pain and suffering.

Too many accidents in mines over the last year, the Chile rescue was a special situation but it's a dangerous job.

Lizx

Hi All,

I have just watched our latest broadcast on the evening news. From what I can gather, there is no delay caused by negligence. The officials have to be extremely cautious in their efforts not to put the Rescuers at risk also.

Everyone involved is desperate to get into the chambers to 'rescue' all 29 men. Realistically the longer time goes by the sadder outcome appears to be.

One driller was injured today and taken to Hospital. There is about 10m to drill still, gas readings can then be taken continuosly to establish readings. We have another robot on standby, there is talk of drilling more holes.

I for one believe anything and everything that could be done is being done.

We saw footage of the actual blast taken at the mine entrance by real time cameras. It was one hell of a forceful blast.

We have to hope for the best and offer support to those families affected.

Susan NZ

It's a sad day for the Greymouth community. There was another bigger explosion at 2.37 pm (NZ time) here today which it is very unlikely that anyone survived this second blast.

Michelle

So sad.

I heard someone on the radio also say they thought there was a cover up of some sort.
Really sad whatever happened.


Marion

I dont understand all this talk of cover ups. Is there some foreign agency trying to wreck our economy or some such thing? It is being wrecked anyway by the debt system of finance. And that is a world wide thing.

Huia.

There was no delay or cover up. to go into the mine would have been dangerous for rescuers. I am so sorry to hear about the latest explosion and the probably loss of all those me, may they rest in peace. My thoughts to their families.

RIP

There is nothing worse than going to work just to earn a wage and not coming home
I feel for all those men and their family's

Deb

Edit I dont know if there was any wrong doing, Looking by what I have seen I think they made the right choice not to go in and rescue BUT that does not make anything good. those poor men just trying to earn a living I feel so sad to think those men died just doing a day's work.

My thoughts are with their families and friends.

A third explosion rocked the mine this afternoon minutes before a special memoriam service was due to be held.
To those who seem to think there is some kind of cover up, are simply rumor mongering.
Coal mines produce Methane Gas and this Mine and most of the Mines on the West coast are known to be quite gassy. there have only been 2 other mining disasters in New Zealand's History and they were along this same Coal Stream.
Mining has always been a dangerous occupation and even with todays sophisticated technology there is always the possibility of something happening.

Due to the fires now burning in the mine and the deadly gases it could be months before men will be able to enter the mine and search for any bodies.

NZ Mining Disasters:
1879 Kaitangata - South Otago (34 dead) gas explosion
1896 Brunner - near Greymouth (65 dead) the pit ponies balked at going in - the miners walked past them and about 90 minutes later the gas exploded.
1914 Huntly - North Island (43 dead) explosion.
1967 Strongman Mine near Greymouth (19 dead) again a methane gas explosion.

Is there any wonder that they could not just go in there to search for bodies dead or alive - and lose even more lives.

We have had other mine deaths 1926 - Dobson near Greymouth 9 dead
1939 - Glen Afton near Huntly 11 dead, 1949 Kaye and Party mine near Greymouth 5 dead, 1958 Westhaven near Collingwood (Sth Island) 4 dead, 1985 Boatman's mine near Reefton 4 dead, and 1998 Mt Davey Mine near Greymouth 3 dead.

It is not a very pleasant roll call - we mine at a terrible human cost.

People have all been having their comments here (NZ) as to what should or should not have been done and I thought our cartoonist in the NZ herald summed it up well (he was not being funny)
Under the heading
Destructive gas starting to disperse
Was a picture of four houses in silhouette and above house 1 the words
"They should have..." house 2 - "They could have...." house 3 " They ought to have..." and house 4 "I would have ...." above the four quotes loomed the words uninformed comment.

It must've been so difficult for both Peter Whittle who has done a marvellous job and Police Superintendent Gary Knowles who has done a stirling job under criticism etc. I have nothing but praise and admiration for both of them. I also admire the mining community they are a wonderful bunch of people and very resilient, coal mining is an occupation where they know they face the risk of death.

We are all hoping for the retrieval of the bodies before Christmas to give families closure and enable them to move on.

Aroha nui

Persey

McB, the rescuers had good reason for not trying an actual rescue earlier.

It had already been established that there had been a large explosion.
It had also been established that there was gas in the mine.
Any spark caused by digging or moving rockfall, would have caused another explosion.
This could have killed anyone in the mine - rescures and any miner who had survived the initial explosion.
Waiting or going very carefully was the only way to give the trapped miners a chance of survival.

Tess