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I'm still concerned about those words that Robert can't read on the bc - I was wrong earlier, "formerly Hughes" means her maiden name, but in front of that could be "late Something".

Has Robert emailed a scan, Christine?

Mary, they also have Maud and Rebecca in 1881

George Dean 26
Sarah Elizabeth Dean 30
Mary Elizabeth Dean 4
Maud Dean 1
Rebecca Dean

I think I got my undergarments in a twist re that Sarah Eleanor marriage.

That's interesting Mary :)

This is the only birth I can find for Elizabeth Ann. A bit late for her to be 9 but close enough?
Births Dec 1853
HUGHES Elizabeth Ann Salford 8d 51

Oh, and Ellen
Births Sep 1846 Hughes Ellen Salford 20 917

I have been looking to see if Sarah Elizabeth might have been married before. I wonder where she is in 1861, as she would only be about 10.

1851 with Sarah Elizabeth Hughes 1851 is sister Ellen Hughes born 1847

1861 Ellen hughes with parents William now with Phoebe as wife.
Address 10.West James Street Regent Road D 29 > 2
There is no Sarah Elizabeth but there is Elizabeth Ann age 9

I knew I had seen the James Street in our search and here it is below.

1881 10,West James Street Regent Road Salford D 20 > 15
George dean
Sarah Elizabeth Dean 1851 salford.
Mary Dean 1877.

1881 William Hughes dad of Ellen and Sarah Elizabeth at 62,Brighton Street Ordsall (This address also rings a bell)

Maryb

I found my way here - thank you Janey:)

Would you be kind enough to send me a scan of the birth cert please Robert? Am working on a theory - probably miles out but anythings worth a try :)

I think this is Sarah E Hughes/Dean's death:

Deaths Dec 1897
Dean Sarah Elizabeth 46 Salford 8d 102 (= dob 1851)

so while she and George Dean seem not to have been married, George might have married anybody after that.


I think George expected that his post would be seen by the people who had contributed to his deleted thread, as it turns out it has been -- Maryb had posted a thread earlier wondering where it had gone, and someone had had a PM from him explaining his mistake.

http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/boards.page/board/trying_to_find/dore/thread/1255316

I did suggest, Robert, that you contact some of the many children's homes around Manchester then. Some have records of incumbents at Manchester Library. I have other contacts who had rellies in childrens homes around then, I can dig them up (oops, dig them out) for you, might take a while, cos very old contacts. I did also ask you if they were Roman Catholics, cos that narrows things down a bit.

Yes, Janey has the John Seal bit right, I might have written it down somewhere, but still can't find out how he is connected at all. It says Father in Law, but no evidence of that - but no evidence of any relationship at all.

Now this birth of Grace, do you think there is another "maiden name" for her mother? Indicating a previous marriage? That is usually the case when a birth cert says "formerly). And you do mean "formerly" not "formally" don't you? Would you be able to scan this cert and email to me? EDIT, "formerly Hughes" is her maiden name, if previously married it would say "late somebody" a well.

You see there is this marriage, a bit late I agree:

EDIT, likely not right. EDIT AGAIN - not right. Sarah Brotherton married Charles Smith.

Marriages Sep 1894 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

***Brotherton Sarah Eleanor Chorlton 8c 1104
Dawson Elizabeth Ann Chorlton 8c 1104
***Dean George Chorlton 8c 1104
SMITH Charles Chorlton 8c 1104

But I can't find a marriage of George Dean to Sarah E Hughes.

Janey your such a star, what a memory... :))

And a Canadian to boot WOW!!

We just got to find out what happened to Cyril between his birth and him marrying Mary. Tough i know...What do you reckon? Workhouse or something. Mum says he was put in a home when as kid of around 3....

Rob xx
Birth Cert scanned and waiting....

So if the Sarah Elizabeth Hughes birth 1851 Salford I added above is her, as I think it is, this is her family in 1851 in Salford:

William Hughes 36 - Butcher's Knife & Steel Maker
Mary Hughes 43
Mary Hughes 6
Ellen Hughes 4
Sarah E Hughes 2/12
Hannah Bailley 22 - stepdaughter (of William)

Name: Sarah E Hughes
Age: 2/12
Estimated birth year: abt 1851
Relation: Daughter
Father's name: William Hughes
Mother's name: Mary Hughes


The census page is badly damaged and birth birthplaces don't show.


It's 8 pm here in very cold and snowy (for a change, this year!) central Canada. ;)

Hey Sylvialn......lots of my family were from Canada, Vancouver would you believe. Port Alberni.... woop woop!!

Robxx

No need to apologise to me, I was just an observer :)

These things happen, I was just worried that you'd lost the lot.

No Squirrel the lot died a death I'm afraid......puts head on chopping block!!

Sooorrrryyyy

Rob

hey Rob


it's late afternoon where I am


we're not all "stop-ups"




sylvia

what are you all doing up at this hour of the night??? TUT ! TUT!

I love you all xxx

Rob

Thanks Jax :))

Ok here is a bit of back ground all.

My grandaddy Cyril Dore ( 1904-1964) born Salford
My gandmother Mary Gannon ( 1908-1931) born Prescott
Cyril remarries to Ethel Stafford (1911-1978 ) born Salford
Cyril s father George Reginald ( Ricotte ) Dore (1876-1947) born Alfretton,Derbyshire. Died Blackpool.

Cyril s mother Grace Dean ( 1882-1965)born Salford. died Salford.
They had other siblings..John, George, William Dore
Grace then shacked up with a Baxter fella and had more kids Joseph,Thomas and Graham Baxter Dore.

Grace's father was called George Deane (1854-?) born Salford. died ?
graces mother was called Sarah Elizabeth Dean Nee Hughes (1851-?) born Salford. died ?

George Dore's father was called Luke Doar ( 1837-1905 ) born Sandiachre, Derbyshire. Died Belper Derbyshire.

Georges Mother was called Sarah Poyzer ( 1846-1881 ) born worksworth, Derbyshire. Died Basford Derbyshire.

they had four other kids called John, Annie , Joseph and Mary Doar ( Dore )

Lukes father was called George Doar ( 1813-1893 ) born Sandiachre , Derbyshire.Died Basford, Derbyshire.

Luke mother was called Sarah Oldenshaw ( 1814-1865 ) born Sandiachre Derbyshire. died Same.

Phew!! anything else you need let me know

Rob xx

I've still got enough of this in my own head too that I know this is exactly what we wanted to see on Grace's birth cert -- father George Dean and mother Sarah Elizabeth, as in the 1891 census I had found (pat pat):

Name: Grace Deane
Age: 8
Estimated birth year: abt 1883
Relation: Daughter
Father's name: George Deane
Mother's name: Sarah E Deane
Where born: Salford, Lancashire, England

Civil Parish: Salford

George Deane 37
Sarah E Deane 39
Mary E Deane 14
Maud Deane 12
Grace Deane 8
Florance Deane 6
Charles E Deane 8/12


The question was the John Seal in some census shown as Father-in-law ... here we are, 1901

George Dore 24
Grace Dore 20 (Grace Dean)
George Dore 4 Months
John Seal 88

-- because obviously he wasn't Grace's father, and there was no Grace with his household in any previous census.

Have I got it right so far then?


Sarah in 1891:

Name: Sarah E Deane
Age: 39
Estimated birth year: abt 1852
Relation: Wife
Spouse's name: George Deane
Gender: Female
Where born: Salford, Lancashire, England


Births Mar 1851
HUGHES Sarah Elizabeth Salford 20 1008

I think.

Robert did you lose all the information or have you copied any of it?

Thanks Jax, well directed, i found my way here :)

I know I hadn't posted on here but I've been following Roberts' thread with interest and amusement, I find his posts refreshing. :)

Rob

Thank you for letting us know that you got the birth certificate

.... and for the apology for accidentally deleting the original thread


well done, you! (for the apology I mean!)



sylvia

Dont know if any of the others are are around Rob but if they dont see this I shall direct them this way

jax