Find Ancestors

Hi all –hope someone can help me.
I was just going back through the census records with James Owen C1822 –Montgomeryshire Powys. When I got to 1851 I thought I was nearing the end of the line –when suddenly his brother David Owen C1835 pops up –a whole new line to look at. Except I can’t find any trace of him anywhere else –and neither of them are in the 1841 census.
Any suggestions please?
Terry

Where were James & David born other than Montgomeryshire?

For info

1851 England Census

Name: Dovid Owen
Age: 16
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1835
Relation: Brother
Gender: M (Male)
Where born: Llanbathlin, Montgomeryshire, Wales

Civil parish: Walsall Foreign
Ecclesiastical parish: Bloxwich
County/Island: Staffordshire

Registration district: Walsall
Sub-registration district: Darlaston

James Owen 29 Where born: Elonhiethliw, Montgomeryshire, Wales
Sarah Owen 24
Morris Owen 5
Jane Owen 3
Ann Owen 1
Dovid Owen 16
Thomas Roberts 30
Sussanah Roberts 28
John Roberts 11
Ann Roberts 5
Margaret Roberts 2

That's all I can get out of the census' -1951 throws in Elonhiethliw Montgomeryshire -but as that doesn't exist it's not much help.

Terry

Re above - both born 'LLanbuthlin', or similar!! It's a major mis-transcription for James.
Jan

Thanks Jan

T

Do you know who James' parents were?
Jan

Not sure if it helps - we English are having trouble with those Welsh place-names!:

1871 England Census
Name: James Owen
Age: 49
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1822
Relation: Head
Spouse's Name: Sarah Owen
Gender: Male
Where born: Wales Llanseypoyd, Montgomeryshire, Wales
Civil parish: Walsall
Ecclesiastical parish: Bloxwich
Town: Bloxwich
County/Island: Staffordshire
Country: England
Registration district: Walsall
Sub-registration district: Bloxwich

James Owen 49
Sarah Owen 48
James Owen 19
Edward Owen 17
David Owen 13
Harriett Owen 15
Hannah Owen 16
Elizabeth Owen 7
Mary Owen 3
Ann Owen 4

Sorry don't know his parents.
I've traced James right through from 1851 up until his death in 1877.

Unfortunately David only has that 'walk on part' in 1851 and doesn't show up anywhere else.
Without finding him and James together and without a parents name it's going to be hellish trying to ID a David Jones' in a Welsh Census.

I was working on the possibility that Susanna Roberts from the 1851 'may' be a sister to James ??

1851 census transcription details for: Turnpike Road, Walsall
Print Close

National Archive Reference:
RG number: HO107
Piece: 2022
Folio: 392
Page: 19
Reg. District: Walsall
Sub District: Bloxwich
Parish:
Enum. District: 2A
Ecclesiastical District: Bloxwich
City/Municipal Borough: Walsall
Address: Turnpike Road, Walsall
County: Staffordshire
Name Relation Condition Sex Age Birth Year Occupation , Disability Where Born
OWEN, James Head Married M 29 1822 Mine Labourer
Llanbuthlin, Montgomeryshire
OWEN, Sarah Wife Married F 24 1827
Bilston, Staffordshire
OWEN, Morris Son M 5 1846 Scholar
Bilston, Staffordshire
OWEN, Jane Daughter F 3 1848
Bilston, Staffordshire
OWEN, Ann Daughter F 1 1850
Bloxwich, Staffordshire
OWEN, David Brother Unmarried M 16 1835 Mine Labourer
Llanbuthlin, Montgomeryshire
ROBERTS, Thomas Lodger Married M 30 1821 Ironstone Miner
Landrinia, Salop
ROBERTS, Susannah Married F 28 1823
Llanbuthlin, Montgomeryshire
ROBERTS, John M 11 1840 Mine Labourer
Bilston, Staffordshire
ROBERTS, Ann F 5 1846 Scholar
Bilston, Staffordshire
ROBERTS, Margaret F 2 1849
Bilston, Staffordshire


This looks like the 'Roberts' family on 1841:
1841 census transcription details for: Stafford Street, Wolverhampton, Bilston
Print Close

National Archive Reference:
RG number: HO107
Piece: 1001
Book/Folio: 7/47
Page: 18
Reg. District: Wolverhampton & Seisdon
Sub District: Bilston
Parish: Wolverhampton
Enum. District:
Ecclesiastical District:
City/Municipal Borough: Wolverhampton
Address: Stafford Street, Wolverhampton, Bilston
County: Staffordshire
Name Relation Sex Age Birth Year Occupation Where Born
ROBERTS, Thomas M 20 1821
ROBERTS, Susan F 20 1821
ROBERTS, John M 5 1836 Staffordshire

(Thomas is an Ironstone Miner)

**Next door is:

1841 census transcription details for: Stafford Street, Wolverhampton, Bilston
Print Close

National Archive Reference:
RG number: HO107
Piece: 1001
Book/Folio: 7/46
Page: 17
Reg. District: Wolverhampton & Seisdon
Sub District: Bilston
Parish: Wolverhampton
Enum. District:
Ecclesiastical District:
City/Municipal Borough: Wolverhampton
Address: Stafford Street, Wolverhampton, Bilston
County: Staffordshire
Name Relation Sex Age Birth Year Occupation Where Born
OWENS, David M 50 1791
OWENS, Susan F 45 1796
OWENS, John M 25 1816
OWENS, Jane F 25 1816
OWENS, Thomas M 20 1821
OWENS, Edward M 15 1826
OWENS, David M 5 1836
OWENS, Jane F 4 1837 Staffordshire
OWENS, Ann F 12 1829

(All 'working' males are Labourers)


This looks like the same family on 1851 - Susan has died and John is living with son John + family??

NOTE: The family is now called OWEN (without the 's' )

1851 census transcription details for: Union Street, Bilston, Wolverhampton
Print Close

National Archive Reference:
RG number: HO107
Piece: 2021
Folio: 713
Page: 36
Reg. District: Wolverhampton
Sub District: Bilston
Parish: Bilston
Enum. District: 3
Ecclesiastical District: St Leonards
City/Municipal Borough: Wolverhampton
Address: Union Street, Bilston, Wolverhampton
County: Staffordshire
Name Relation Condition Sex Age Birth Year Occupation , Disability Where Born
OWEN, John Head Married M 42 1809 Furnace Labourer
Llanroyd, Derbyshire
OWEN, Jane Wife Married F 34 1817
Llanroyd, Derbyshire
OWEN, Jane Daughter F 15 1836 Servant (House)
Bilston, Staffordshire
OWEN, Sarah Daughter F 4 1847
Bilston, Staffordshire
OWEN, Susan Daughter F 3 1848
Bilston, Staffordshire
OWEN, Edward Son M 0 (4 MOS) 1851
Bilston, Staffordshire
OWEN, David Father Widower M 64 1787 Colliery Labourer
Wales


James, Susannah and David 'could' be from this family?? It also looks like Thomas c21 and Edward c26 (from the 1841 census) would also be their siblings?

I will have to leave it now until later but it needs work work to find proof with such common names.

Perhaps someone else might like to have a go at this?

I will return to it later.

Dea x

Did James marry? If so, have you got his marriage cert to confirm his father's name?

County Staffordshire
Place Wolverhampton
Church St Peters
RegisterNumber 270265
MarriageDate 12 Aug 1839
GroomForename Thomas
GroomSurname ROBERTS
GroomAge 23
GroomParish
GroomCondition Bachelor
GroomOccupation Miner
GroomAbode Bilston
BrideForename Susanna
BrideSurname OWEN
BrideAge 19
BrideParish
BrideCondition Spinster
BrideOccupation
BrideAbode Bilston
GroomFatherForename John
GroomFatherSurname ROBERTS
GroomFatherOccupation Labourer
BrideFatherForename David
BrideFatherSurname OWEN
BrideFatherOccupation Labourer
WitnessOneForename I
WitnessOneSurname PERKINS
WitnessTwoForename John
WitnessTwoSurname BIDDULPH
Notes Banns; Recorded by J BOYLE

(if any good, from below link)


http://www.freereg.org.uk/cgi/Search.pl

Chris :)

Baptism
County Staffordshire
Place Bilston
Church St Leonard
RegisterNumber 3245
DateOfBirth
BaptismDate 07 Jun 1840
Forename John
Sex M
FatherForename Thomas
MotherForename Susannah
FatherSurname ROBERTS
MotherSurname
Abode Wood Street
FatherOccupation Miner

County Staffordshire
Place Bilston
Church High Street Primitive
RegisterNumber
DateOfBirth
BaptismDate 29 Aug 1848
Forename Margaret
Sex F
FatherForename Thomas
MotherForename Susannah
FatherSurname ROBERTS
MotherSurname
Abode Farthing Row
FatherOccupation Miner

Just got back to computer.

Thanks so much to you all for your help.
I'll trawl through all the information -but it looks like I've got some pretty good leads here.

Thanks again,

Terry

Only back for a minute but this 'could' be James + Sarah's marriage:

County Staffordshire
Place Wolverhampton
Church St Peters
RegisterNumber 340229
MarriageDate 24 Aug 1845
GroomForename James
GroomSurname OWEN
GroomAge
GroomParish
GroomCondition Bachelor
GroomOccupation Labourer
GroomAbode Wolverhampton
BrideForename Sarah
BrideSurname OWEN
BrideAge
BrideParish
BrideCondition Spinster
BrideOccupation
BrideAbode Wolverhampton
GroomFatherForename D
GroomFatherSurname OWEN
GroomFatherOccupation Labourer
BrideFatherForename J
BrideFatherSurname OWEN
BrideFatherOccupation Miner
WitnessOneForename T
WitnessOneSurname HOLDING
WitnessTwoForename J Jr
WitnessTwoSurname BIDDULPH
Notes Banns; Groom of Full Age; Bride of Full Age; Recorded by Geo COTTOM
FileNumber 27200

The Father fits too!

Dea x

P.S. Thanks for reminding me of the Freereg site Chris <3

Dea x

Dea -you are an angel

Terry

?????
name: David Owenes
gender: Male
baptism/christening date: 02 Nov 1834
baptism/christening place: THE TABERNACLE WESLEYAN METHODIST, LLANFYLLIN, MONTGOMERY, WALES - could this be Llanbuthlin
father's name: David Owenes
mother's name: Susan

indexing project (batch) number: C10443-1

John Owen in 1851 with wife, Jane is actually born in Denbighshire, not Derbyshire.

Thanks Ozibird

T

Wales, Denbighshire, Parish Registers, 1538-1912
name: John Owen
event: Baptism
event date: 24 Jan 1808
event place: Llanyfydd, Denbighshire, Wales [This looks hopeful - the 1851 looks like Llanroyd.]
digital folder number: 004631525

Unfortunately no parents named.