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Inky1
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16 Jan 2013 16:38 |
Doreen, It’s been a pleasure to assist. It has also been educational:-
As Eringobragh1916 provided the marriage year/quarter I checked it out, expecting to find a Hannah Tailor Somebody. (Tailor being a middle name) But no, it shows Hannah Taylor.
A search through the listings for St Joseph gave the following other baptisms for this couple (there might have been more) DoB, Baptism and parents.
Joannes Josephus Kane 16Jan1872 04Feb1872 Jacobi Kane, Anna Taylor
Jacobus Kane 18Sep1874 30Sep1874 Jacobi Kane, Hannæ Taylor Kane
Marian Kane 24Nov1883 09Dec1883 Jacobi Kane, Hannae Taylor
Maria Hannah Kane 17Nov 1888 21Nov1888 Jacobi Kane, Hannah Taylor Kane
So a Catholic Church includes the mother’s maiden name. That is something I did not know. Do they all do it, I wonder?
And as Reggie states, name spellings vary. Apart from Hanæ Tailor Kane for your man, there are the above variations.
The search for siblings produced a plentiful list of Kane baptisms. It is likely your family group is related to some of them. Let me finish with what I consider to be one of the ‘best’ baptisms I have seen for quite a while(!) From the same Church.
Patritius O’Kane 02May1878 09Jun1878 Joannis O'Kane, Mariæ Annæ O'Hara O'Kane
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Doreen
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16 Jan 2013 13:26 |
Yes Thank you. Certificate ordered that will clear up a few questions.
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Eringobragh1916
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16 Jan 2013 10:19 |
Doreen... This is the parents of James T.in 1871 Census...They married March Quarter 1869 Reg. Gateshead.
name: James Kane event: Census event date: 1871 gender: Male age: 24 relationship to head of household: Self birthplace: Wakefield, Yorkshire record type: Household registration district: Gateshead sub-district: Gateshead event parish: Gateshead county: Durham Household Gender Age Birthplace self James **Kane** M 24 Wakefield, Yorkshire wife Hannah Kane F 20 Bradaford, brother John Kane M 16 Wakefield, Yorkshire lodger John Quin M 26 Ireland lodger Edward Daley M 21 Durham,
The Marriage was spelt **Cain**
Does the above birth details correspond with the family your looking for....?
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Doreen
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16 Jan 2013 09:44 |
Thank you everyone for all your helpand advice. I have ordered the birth certificate and that should tell me if I am on the right track.
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ErikaH
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16 Jan 2013 09:10 |
Doreen
People in those days did not know how their names should be written.
The person to whom they gave their name would spell it as he thought it should be.
Be flexible in your thinking.
And, as inky so rightly said, Jacobi or a variant was the Latin for James.........which would have been used in the baptism register, as they were Catholics
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KempinaPartyhat
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16 Jan 2013 08:42 |
Its very odd that the father on the baptisum is Jacobi but on the census which you think is right its James ......again as Inky1 shows peoples names did change
If you couldnt find his birth registration you could have sent for a sister or brother
I think
Member Since: February 2006
Posts: 23,232
Send Message RamblingRose Report 15 Jan 2013 12:41 Births Mar 1881 (>99%) --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
CAIN James Thomas Gateshead 10a 825
Member Since: November 2004
MrsBucketBouquet Report 15 Jan 2013 12:44 Births Mar 1881 (>99%)
CAIN James Thomas Gateshead 10a 825
That these two ladies could be right and I would sent for this certificate using 10a and entry 825 to see if this fits ...
keep us informed we may be able to help again
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Inky1
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15 Jan 2013 20:20 |
Possible alternative to spending money.
LDS microfilms that were at the LDS Centre in Kensington (in the basement of the Temple) have been held at the National Archives, Kew, since the LDS premises underwent restoration work. The following is from the LDS(Ken) listing…..
Gateshead, Durham, England - Church records Title: Church register, 1851-1930 Authors: Catholic Church. St. Joseph's (Gateshead, Durham) Film Notes: Microfilm copy of original at the Tyne and Wear Archives, Newcastle- upon-Tyne, Northumberland. Some Latin. Film Items: Microfilm 2046501 Baptisms, 1906-1918
Additional films in the series (ie that Church) that can be ordered in:-
Microfilm 2046403 Baptisms, 1851-1854, 1857-1874 (Each register includes an index.) Microfilm 2046499 Baptisms, 1874-1891 Microfilm 2046500 Baptisms, 1891-1906 Microfilm 2046502 Baptisms, 1918-1920 Baptism indexes, 1874-1883, 1915-1920 Marriages, 1860-1916 Burials, 1851-1854 Microfilm 2046503 Burials, 1857-1861, 1883, 1895-1900, 1877-1879, 1900-1925 Burials in Saltwell cemetery, 1905-1930 Microfilm 2046609 Items 14-16 Baptisms, 1920-1921 Marriages, 1916-1920 Banns, 1918-1921
NB. Ordered in. I have previously ordered at LDS(Ken) for delivery from Salt Lake City – I paid nominal sums that covered the shipping costs. And they emailed me when each had arrived. I guess that the same service is offered by their Kew personnel.
I must assume that film 2046499 has been viewed by the Ancestry member in USA.
The records from that film are online in Familysearch:- • parentJacobi Kane, Hanæ Tailor Kane • nameJacobus Thomas Kane • genderMale • baptism/christening date02 Feb 1881 • baptism/christening placeSt Joseph, Gateshead, Durham, England • birth date17 Dec 1880 • father's nameJacobi Kane • mother's nameHanæ Tailor Kane • indexing project (batch) numberC04207-3 • system originEngland-EASy • source film number2046499
Catholic Churches tended to use Latin forms. Jacobus (or Iacobus) became James in common English.
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Doreen
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15 Jan 2013 17:22 |
thanks for all your help. I need to know the reference numbers for the page and volume the birth was recorded in. I need these to order certificates.There seems to have been a name change from Kane to Cairn on the 1881 census and then back to Kane on the 1891.
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ErikaH
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15 Jan 2013 16:52 |
Doreen
For BMD's between 1837 and abt 1955 use freebmd................it has a phonetic surname search option.
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KempinaPartyhat
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15 Jan 2013 16:45 |
Doreen theres a lady (details above ) doing that very tree
It seems that a spelling was changed on the Kane cairn kyne name This will make it very difficult to find a birth certificate for your man
What details would you like from his birth certificate?
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Inky1
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15 Jan 2013 16:05 |
The alternate name in that 1881 census was an Ancestry member suggestion:-
Family surname was Kane from other census records and from chirstening records of St. Joseph's Gateshead church - Catholic. Father of family is listed as Jacobi Kane on chirstening records. Submitted by DougnRuthsDaughter on 14/11/2009
Profile:- DougnRuthsDaughter Boise, Idaho Last log in: Today
Seems you have a distant rellie in USA?
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Doreen
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15 Jan 2013 14:12 |
Thank you Kempina. This is my Grandfather. I am looking for the index numbers as I want to order his birth certificate
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KempinaPartyhat
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15 Jan 2013 12:48 |
The 1881 census has been corrected and a date of birth added as you can see but this MAY NOT be the right person DO you know his parents names ??
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Rambling
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15 Jan 2013 12:46 |
and probably
Births Mar 1872 (>99%)
KYNE John Joseph Gateshead 10a 778
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Rambling
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15 Jan 2013 12:45 |
They seem to have used various spellings as this is Sarah
Births Sep 1878 (>99%) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Kane Sarah Ann Gateshead 10a 876
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MargaretM
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15 Jan 2013 12:45 |
Possible?
Births Mar 1881 (>99%) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- CAIN James Thomas Gateshead 10a 825
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MrsBucketBouquet
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15 Jan 2013 12:44 |
Births Mar 1881 (>99%) CAIN James Thomas Gateshead 10a 825
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Rambling
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15 Jan 2013 12:41 |
Births Mar 1881 (>99%) -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- CAIN James Thomas Gateshead 10a 825
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KempinaPartyhat
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15 Jan 2013 12:39 |
1881 England Census about James Thos. Cairn Name: James Thos. Cairn [James Thos. Kane] Estimated Birth Year: 17 Dec 1880 Relation: Son Father's Name: James Cairn Mother's Name: Hannah Cairn Gender: Male Where born: Gateshead, Durham, England Civil parish: Gateshead County/Island: Durham Country: England Street Address: 7 William St Education:
Employment status: View image Registration district: Gateshead Sub-registration district: Gateshead ED, institution, or vessel: 22 Neighbors: View others on page Piece: 5035 Folio: 158 Page Number: 65 Household Members: Name Age James Cairn 34 Hannah Cairn 30 John J. Cain 9 Sarah Ann Cairn 2 James Thos. Cairn 2months
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KempinaPartyhat
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15 Jan 2013 12:35 |
1891 England Census about James T Kane Name: James T Kane Age: 10 Estimated Birth Year: abt 1881 Relation: Son Mother's Name: Hannah Kane Gender: Male Where born: Gateshead, Durham, England Civil parish: Gateshead Ecclesiastical parish: St Mary County/Island: Durham Country: England Street Address:
Occupation:
Condition as to marriage:
Education:
Employment status: View image Registration district: Gateshead Sub-registration district: Gateshead ED, institution, or vessel: 28 Neighbors: View others on page Piece: 4180 Folio: 40 Page Number: 27 Household Members: Name Age Hannah Kane 40 John J Kane 19 Sarah Kane 12 James T Kane 10 Maria Kane 7 Mary H Kane 2 Margaret Kane 1 Is this him?
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