General Chat

We are having more snow as I type.... our local Authority has used up 12 month's supply of salt and grit in the last week. Lots of local Authorities ordered their supplies in readiness for a typical British winter, and why shouldn't they?

We are told that it is 30 odd years since a freeze of this length, in one go.. so this is an unusual event. No-one could have anticipated this, countrywide and for so long... in fact, it is widespread across the whole of the Northern Hemisphere, lots of other countries, apart from those whose climate actually needs to be geared for it year after year.... have been caught short.

The salt mine workers in Cheshire have been working 24 hours a day for the last week or so, but the media hype has implied that they and local authorities have left it all to the last minute. Not so.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/topics/weather/6939659/Snow-UK-salt-mine-staff-work-round-the-clock.html

I expect it'll be Gordon Brown's fault, or the weathermen or maybe even Santa Claus' fault... it is a quirk of nature, an act of God fgs.

If the Authorities stocked up on the grit... then something in their budget would have to give...... now let's see, what would that be?

Right.... meals on wheels, Home Care support, specialist classroom assistants for children with disabilities... then we would all be screaming!!

Ah, but if it is stocked up.... and it isn't used up... it will still be there for next year, won't it?

Wrong!! Good old British public... who don't consider driving too fast, with a mobile being used, parking on double yellows, or in Disabled bays when they are not disabled as a problem, or making phone calls from work, conducting all their domestic business on line when at work... taking home pens, paper,etc etc as theft... or nicking the grit and the salt out of the bins at the roadside...Nooooooo it's a perk of the job!! It's just laying there asking to be taken and used elsewhere....

Then, when we need it.... when we are caught out... we cry foul... blame the government, blame the media, blame Authority... but let's not take any responsibility cos it ain't our fault and we must have someone to blame!!

Act of God sums up the unusual weather we are having... there are some daft decisions being made as a result of the Great British Public and their burdgeoning compensation culture... not always a bad thing, I hasten to add... but the H & S Executive has to make some absolutely stupid decisions... to protect us from the stupid people who scream compensation... who point the finger of blame because they must have someone to point it at!! And get a few quid into the bargain.

Don't get me started on No Claims firms, lolol!!

Right, thank you for listening to my rant... I feel so much better now!

Love

Daff xxx

That was a good rant Daff lol We seem to be thawing here,although my son down in Kent can't get home.It was his Birthday yesterday and didn't get a thing Ahhh!.

Thank God I'm not the only rational human being in the country!

I'm fed up with people bleating on about "why aren't the council prepared?" "why haven't they got more snow ploughs?"

Now lets see, I'm guessing a snow plough costs 250K+ so would everyone appreciate their Council tax rising by an extra £50 a year for a snow plough to sit and rot in a council depot for 20 years? Thought not.

Hi Daff, I agree with everything that you say,the present conditions ar the reason why we sacrificed living in a quiet Derbyshire village,to come and live in town.
We knew that we would need to be near shops,Doctors surgery,reliable bus service ect.
Despite the fact that I detest town living,I have been grateful for it now.
One point I would like to make,how do the folk who really can't get to work,manage for money? Not everyone has enough savings to tide them through.

Yours from my snug,warm living room,Nina from cold,wet,freezing Sheffield.

Janet, I feel so much better for getting that off my chest, lolol!!

Jane, that is a shame... about your son... I was once snowed into the school I worked in... that was ok, it was a residential school, but not all the children lived in... and I'd already done 24 hours there, with one of the children up all night cos of D & V, lol.... we had a whale of a time, well, for most of it, I remember it with pleasure, actually... we all just chipped in and did bits of this and bits of that... the school closed the next day... not because of the snow, but because the D & V was, erm, caught, by most staff and children, bit by bit through the night... me, one girl and one other staff member were fine!

That is another story...... ;¬)) I do hope your son manages to get home today, to a belated birthday celebration.

Love

Daff xxxx

Surely if the grit is stocked up in a warehouse it is unlikely to be stolen?
We have one grit bin on an estate of over 1000 people. When a colleague phoned up to tell them it was empty, she was told 'That's because someone used it last February' - implying it was stolen!
Well - it was used, yes - we had snow last February!
Surely buying emergency supplies will cost more than say, slowly stocking up each year?

I had a rant earlier about the way the motorway below me is constantly gritted - as it should be - but it's pathetically empty because no-one can get off the road they live in to get on it!
The park & ride, half a mile from me is running - but there are no buses around where I live as the roads haven't been gritted - and I live in a very hilly part of Winchester. A lorry came & gritted the corner where I live - on the crest of a hill. Shame the cars can't get up the hill to reach the one bit of grit !

I pay as much council tax as anyone else, don't drive, but my Council Tax is still used towards gritting, so I resent the fact that the council has decided that people who dont drive are 'second class' and can like it or lump it and risk broken bones by trying to walk on the ungritted pavements

On this estate, there is sheltered housing, houses with adults with learning difficulties, and many elderly people. Most of these people don't drive, can't walk on the pavements and we have no bus.
I would accept the situation if I lived in a small hamlet in the middle of nowhere, but I live in one of the richest cities in the country, there are more than 2000 people living on this estate - as there are on the other 3 estates on the outskirts of Winchester - all of which have had more gritting than this estate.
I remember, about 10 years ago, they DID grit the pavements,
Even pavements in the centre of town are ice rinks - bloody dangerous when cars are driving fast on the gritted roads - one slip and a pedestrian could be under the wheels.
What's the betting the roads the councillors live in have been gritted.

I don't know, Nina... that is a good point... hubby will be paid, but he had taken a couple of days of it off anyway as Annual Leave... the thing is, I am talking off the top of my head here... but firms are closing, people are not struggling into work as we would have done in days gone by for two main reasons

1. Firms and schools are closing down not because of the snow per se, but because if someone is injured trying to get to work... who will pay the compensation out? As a result... everything grinds to a halt... but we still expect our police, emergency services, nurses, doctors and carers/home helps to struggle on, because, well (tongue in cheek) they have to, don't they? They are paid to, it's their job!! (yeh, but who is going to look after their children for them while the schools are closed???) I mean... we all sit cosy in our homes... but expect the men who grit to be out there gritting... what if they can't get into work? Oh and some take their gritting lorries home.. and get hassle from neighbours cos they are lowering the tone, and they are not supposed to park work vehicles on their drives etc!!

2. Many people now commute large distances.....my own hubby works 55 miles away from where we live..... the weather conditions may be fine in one place, dreadful in another.... plus... well, those poor gritters again.... and your point about the snowploughs is spot on Janet.

Love

Daff xxxx

Maggie, I understand what you are saying... we are the same here... the Motorway is about a mile away from me, and is fairly clear, but the estate I live in hasn't been gritted... not the roads, or the pavements... and we are being told that if we were to do it ourselves, then we could be open to claims for compensation... so hubby couldn't get out of our drive and through the estate onto the main road leading to the Motorway..

When I lived in Germany, the law was simple, and basic... and worked!! You were responsible for clearing your path, and the pavement/ sidewalk bordering your home.. if you didn't, and someone was injured, you were liable... you paid the wage of the person as though he or she was working for as long as they were off etc etc... If there was evidence that you had cleared, gritted/salted, and that the area had frozen/snowed heavily while you out about your daily business... then you were not liable.

But because the country expected heavy snowfalls...... they had the equipment to clear it and keep it clear... they had to budget for it.

My point is that in this country, we can't justify the expenditure from our local authority budget for something that might not happen again for another 30 years... other services would have to go as a result.. once this cold snap actually started, in a normal year the smaller roads and pavements might have been gritted... because the spell only lasts a couple of days and not all over the country... but this has been different... it is almost 2 weeks now, and widespread....and it has needed to be rationed, otherwise we would have run out in the first couple of days.

I also take your point about the assumption that the grit has been stolen when it wasn't, it was used up in the cold snap last February, that wouldn't have been nice I agree... well I know that grit here is often nicked in the summer months... people doing their gardens etc etc... I've seen them!!

My neighbour has bragged that he built his garden on it over a couple of years! And I have seen it elsewhere in the country as well.... there was this nasty hill in East Midlands, and the grit was always being nicked from it... and I know when I was on the community in the Cotswolds, the same thing there.... and in the Malvern and Forest of Dean area.... so it is not unusual.

If it is a compound... well, I don't know... but lots of things get nicked from all sorts of places.... and presumably these compounds must be open a fair bit to allow access for other vehicles and workers? I don't know... just hypothesising here.

I don't know about other councillors, lol... but we have one living around the corner.... he is snowed in, well he was, but someone with a 4x4 took him in to work, lol I shall look at him a little differently from now onwards... he has cleared his area, it would seem, and be damned to litigators (that is hearsay, don't know if it is fact)

Love

Daff xxx

Edit... I do take your point about people who are unable to drive being trapped in their homes... especially vulnerable people... it might well be that the Authorities will have to re-look at their budgets when the compensation claims start rolling in.... there have been a lot of people, thankfully not as many elderly as expected, who have had broken bones and other injuries... people going to work on foot, younger people, trying to get on with normal life.... and because the authorities haven't the resources to grit everywhere over an extended period, and because H & S have clearly and categorically stated that householders and businesses will be liable to pay compensation if they clear and there is an accident... then that has to be looked at as part of a future *emergency contingency gritting plan* I think..

Hi Daff,
They didn't grit our roads in February either - and that only lasted a few days. Apparently this was 'in case it lasted longer'.
We are deemed a 'secondary' estate - implying there are 'Premiere' estates - I'd like to know where these estates are!

The last few days there are tractors and lorries taking the snow away.
I would have thought if a plough had gone down the streets weeks ago when it started it would have been a lot easier.

It's started to thaw here +5 today :))

I was in hospital last Feb, so was all snug and cosy, and half dead, lolol so can't remember.... we were supposed to have a bad winter last year, as I recall? And a good summer!

We are clearly not a high priority area, either.. I would point out that our local authority has gritted and salted the large complex of sheltered housing and the residential home just across the way, which is excellent... and the estate next to it? well, I won't go into that, but most don't work so don't pay council taxes. But it has been gritted.

But the *new* estates, where people actually work and pay mortgages, and some of whom are struggling to hang onto their jobs to pay their taxes and council rates.... well theirs isn't gritted it's like they don't matter, so I do understand how you feel.... but I still think that they are damned if they do, and damned if they don't (Authorities, at the moment)... and I reckon they will have learnt some very valuable lessons..

Lets just hope they put them into practice for next year. And I hope that those people who would rush to get a few thousand from some householder who cleared and gritted their path will be laughed out of court... and that the H & S will then be able to say *please do your little bit, we will not support litigation against you if you do....* instead if the bunkum they are giving out right now! Then maybe more people will be able to actually get to their work next time!

Love

Daff xxxx

Oh twiddle.... and here I was, going to blame you, lolol ;¬))

Love

Daff xxxx

I do agree with all that you say Daff. But have to say one slightly annoying thing for us in Gloucestershire is that the County did stock up well on salt/grit, having been caught out last February when they ran out and ended up using table salt. Unfortunately, they would have been fine if they could have continued having just their normal deliveries of grit. But because some councils didn't stock up and we are deemed to have enough for the moment we have to go to the back of the queue for our next delivery so we will probably run out now. So despite getting their housekeeping right they still lose.

lmao at you daff
you going for it there girl,
you sounds mega piddled off,

i get mad when im in work one of our staff all she goes on about it , omg what am i gona do, i darent walk home, (she only live across the road andup a bit of hill,its not even hill,
and she gets taxi all time,
starts saying what if i break my arm or leg, whose gona look afgter me,
arggggggggh no one cos she never gives a blinking fig about anyone else,
however she seems to make people feel guilty and sorry for jher,

do you know what friday she flagged a 4x4 down coming down road, and asked was he going her way he said no, she said would you give me lift anyway, just down to work, !!!!!!!!!!!!!! he could of been a murderer, or anyone, well he was anyone, but how mad,

I am at a loss with all this complaining. I read somewhere that government advice was to carry enough grit for five days - we've had a sight more than that. Hindsight is easy.
As i see it, local authorities have done a splendid job by and large. In such extreme conditions i don't see it as their duty to grit every side road (I have been marooned inside for over a week).
Indeed why should there be cases of compensation. It's a lit bit like caveat emptor, the walker should beware if he or she takes a risk. Bad luck if you have to get to work and fall, but that's life and always has been.
May i add that my 71 year old sister broke her wrist yesterday when bringing essentials to this marooned oldie.

Happy days - and good luck to all.

awe what a lovely sister you got harry

my dad 75 i told him not to go out in this weather
he said no i wont i got plenty in love dont worry,
i offered to take or hubby to take him stuff up,

then daughter tells me she popped in to see him friday cos she was going stir crazy in house, and he had been into town wednesday for a wander,
naughty man he is,
i sure he thinks hes same age as his grandsons,
xx
stay safe everyone

A friend of mine (Aged 75) lives in a sheltered housing complex. When we had the snow before Xmas the council didn't grit outside the complex so she got together with a friend (aged 83) and gritted the path themselves. The warden had told them that providing they didn't tell her what they were doing it would be fine. Now, I'm sorry but shouldn't the warden have thought to herself "all these residents have been stuck indoors for a week, hang the consequences, I'll grit the path so they can get to the clear High Street for their shopping"

I have fallen on my backside twice. The first time Wednesday evening after walking the three miles from work as the bus company had decided to give their drivers the rest of the day off. (Well, it is hazardous driving on gritted roads after all) The second time on thursday morning on my way to the bus station. I live at the top of a steep hill which had compacted snow on it, I got to the bottom then went a*** over t**!

Oh my God Daffers l so agree with you....tell you waht you should be writing the tabloids and be in parliament.......go girl:o)))

jude :o) x