General Chat

Sorry, lilybids. They did ask me but I am married and a Protestant :-( :-( And, at only 66, not yet experienced enough.

Sheila. You are right. Marriages were largely arranged when they were children then. And the actual marriage took place in 3 stages that normally started when the girl was 12 (twelve) and the boy not much older. Betrothal (engagement) was normally a year. And marriage was culminated (naughty things happened) usually very soon after girl's 13th birthday.

It seems to me that boys were singled out at a very young age to train for the priesthood and not get married and have children (not dissimilar to some Irish families today).

I think you mean the Council of Nicaea

Perhaps 'no sign' of wives because Roman and Jewish societies were run by men, women were wives, mothers, daughters but had no political or religious voice. Doesn't mean they didn't exist. From a purely social view of the time, I would think it was more usual for a man of Jesus' age to be married, rather than not :-D.

Jude wrote: Of course they should and agree with AnnC and Tigre....John your always the opposite to everyone, boring:))

My belief is that Roman Catholic priests and nuns should be allowed to get married. I think Mr O'Brien is right and quite brave to state that in the OP.

Where have AnnC and El Jimbob disgreed with me? Perhaps Jude and I both need to read the thread again :-S :-S

Do you know john I think you should be in the running for the new pope :-D

lilybids and Errol

Sure there will be a lot of people better than me to answer those questions.

lilybids. Main place is in New Testament where apostles are called out from whatever they are doing. Leave wives, families, possessions and follow me. Catholic Church (which was what everyone attended more or less in UK a few centuries ago) decided that priests should be called out in same way and be celibate. Also they established monastic orders where they did not even need to meet anybody from the "horrid" world outside.

Errol. Sorry if challenge was too strong. How about prod or poke? Anyway, we don't know. But I tend to exclude anything that purports to be Christian but was thrown out by the Council of Nicene when they did a spring clean of Christian writings in 4th century.

I do believe a lot of Jewish history at the time, but take that with a pinch of salt because writers then would not have been that different to Express and Mail journos today. But no sign of wives in Jewish history for Jesus, John the Baptist or Paul.

I am following Errol on this one..........

I wasn't aware I had made a challege. Just pointed out some facts.
I certainly did not say he was married to Mary (I assume you are referring to Magdalene).
However to say that the idea of them being married is fanciful is no more or less fanciful than the notion that they were not.
Highly respected scholars believe the Coptic papyrus is in fact genuine.
As far as agape is concerned, it is a Greek word appropriated by the christian church.
I would be genuinely interested to know what you are actually basing your comments upon.
Some things can be proven because they are fact. The church is based upon faith - belief in something that cannot be proven.

Can anyone tell me who decided that man or woman should be married to God
and live shut up in a monastery,where does it say in the Bible
very interested

Of course they should and agree with AnnC and Tigre....John your always the opposite to everyone, boring:))

Errol. Thanks for your challenge. You are right, but I stand by that group as being central to Christianity. And I stand by my belief they were all single men. Yes, Jesus and the Cross was at the centre.

Mary was the closest woman to Jesus in his short 3 year ministry (even closer that mother Mary imho). But idea they were married or loved each other in that way is just fanciful stuff. It sells books, but they were both in love with God morning, noon and night. Selfless love (agape). And they had no time for or inclination towards any physical love.

But we all believe what we believe. And no way of being 100% certain, I suppose.

May I go off topic for a minute and remind John that the rugby's on.

Italy 6 - Wales 16, just in case you missed it :-D

if it means less kids getting messed about with
i am all for it :-( :-(

"a poster" - me i fact - and I stand by it - priests are well know for abusing children, as are others who are supposed to have a caring role when working with children, but the scandal of abuse by mainly catholic priests is well known and there's no point in denying it - the post of catholic priest is obviously quite attractive to those who wish to carry out such heinous acts

I have to continue watching the rugby for a while but I'll be back

Yes they should if they wish, why should Priests and Nuns be married to a myithical figure,,,,,get a human being......

John your first post went right off the scale of off topic,,,,,,,a yes or no would have surficed instead of bible lessons.......again.

If priests want to marry , then i say let them :-D :-D

Can I just point that the topic went astray when a poster said that marriage would perhaps stop priests from abusing minors (about 6 posts in).

I then pointed out that priests are no different to rest of population. I was trying to bring us away from this constant discussion of sexual abuse

I find the point being made in first para to be pretty disgusting, to be honest. Marriage surely does not make a paedophile into a person with normal sexual desires. And poster knows that. But I may have misread her post :-S

John
You refer to Jesus as a "key figure amongst God's people, including Elijah, John the Baptist".
I would say he was pretty vital and not just a key figure. Without him christianity would not exist.

Also, there is absolutely no evidence to say he was or was not married.
Theologians have often debated claims he was married - based in part on the Gnostic gospels.
In fact, only last autumn it was revealed that a scrap of papyrus dating from the 4th century with Coptic writing referred to Jesus' wife being his disciple had been discovered.
Some scholars believe it may be genuine.

Priest to marry ..

YES ...YES ...YES...YES...YES.

And I am a practising Catholic.....

Pardon me John, but who went off the OP by mentioning about original sin?