Genealogy Chat

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Pegeen Mair
Birth Date: abt 1912
Age: 16
Port of Departure: New York, New York, United States
Arrival Date: 6 Apr 1928
Port of Arrival: London, England
Ports of Voyage: Halifax, Plymouth
Ship Name: Aurania
Search Ship Database: View the 'Aurania' in the 'Passenger Ships and Images' database
Shipping Line: Cunard Line
Official Number: 147277

Address given 39 Egerton Road Chelsea. Country of last permanent residence is England.
Dies in Brighton 1991


Could it be Vail?? A Laurence Vail married Margeritte Guggenhiem (spelling) and they had a daughter Pegeen Vail. Dates are wrong unfortunately. Pegeen was born in 1925 which would make her 8 when Doris married. Unless there was another relative called Pegeen. Worth a thought.

England & Wales, Marriage Index: 1916-2005
about Marguerite Deutschbein
Name: Marguerite Deutschbein
Spouse Surname: Waldman
Date of Registration: Jul-Aug-Sep 1934
Registration district: Eton
Registration county (inferred): Buckinghamshire
Volume Number: 3a
Page Number: 3861
Find Spouse: Find Spouse

Rose

Guggeishein is probably Guggenheim as in the museum.

Rose

No, a Hammerman is more likely to be a blacksmith.

Alan, I have searched like fury for a Doris with a father John who is some sort of Engineer, and come up with nothing, whether in Wales or not.

Surprisingly, the name Pegeen is not as rare as I imagined. It is definitely not an "old" name, but there are several more recent births with that name. I can't find a Pegeen Nail. There are other Pegeens that could fit - Mair, Mole, etc. but not Nail. I can find no Guggesheins or Deutschibeins in England - ever!

Now begs the question, how is Doris Marie related to your wife/Isaac John Cooper?

How about a theory? She WAS the daughter of Isaac John, but not by his wife. On her (good) marriage, she did not want to name Isaac John in case anyone found out, so she went half way, called him John and said he was dead.

These letters/cards you have from Doris - where were they posted?

A letter to A.B. Heasman is the only likely link now.

Alan, I do hope you have written to A.B Heasman, that is probably still your best bet to find Patricia.

Just to reassure you, I have written two such letters to possible relatives in recent times. With one, I had three possible addresses, so I wrote to all three, enclosing an sae for ease, and saying that if they were the wrong person I apoligsed for bothering them, and the same if they just did not want to reply or be involved. In both cases, someone wrote back to me, and I now have two new relatives to add to the Christmas Card list. It is always worth a try.

I have been even more devious. My youngest cousin has been elusive for more than 30 years, and does not want anyone to contact her, and has taken great steps to ensure that no-one from her family knows where she is. But I know where she is. I have her husband, children, address, occupation and even her hobbies. Just a little matter of a couple of letters, and it works. I am now wondering what to do with my information, I am not sure. I am sitting on it for now. It is amazing what a few letters can reveal.

So let me have a picture of this wedding, and I will see what I can do.

Best wishes

Margaret

Does anyone know if a Hammerman Labourer is s person who becomes a Mechanical Engineer?

Oh Heck. I have been waiting for this, hoping it would be full of good information. What a problem we have now.

So Doris's father is John, a mechanical engineer, deceased.

Not Isaac John. Interesting. And Isaac John is still alive. So she is not the daughter of Isaac John.

The witnesses could be vital, especially the one that looks like Pegeen, which is most unusual.

I am going to PM you and ask if you can email me this marriage cert to scrutinise, Alan. I don't know if it will do any good, but we have to try.

Bye for now, back later.

Margaret

Just received Doris and John's marriage cert. details, 17th.Dec. 1933.
Doris Marie Cooper 28yrs. spinster, father John Cooper [ deceased ] mechanical engineer.
John Hannah Stevenson Stewart 28yrs. Chief Officer Merchantile Marine, father William Stewart, Innkeeper [ retired ]
With Doris's father shown as deceased, Isaac John Cooper who married Pricilla was still alive in 1933.
I have found a John Cooper ,25yrs, Engineer, in Bedwellty, Wales, single, 1911 census, but no Doris Marie Cooper
The witnesses are difficult to read it looks like a Pegeen Nail, Margarerite Guggeishein, Margarerite Deutschibein and another ? Nail.
In letters/cards from Doris before she married there is a Pegeen mentioned we think thats were Patricia gets one of her names.

On 23rd November you said you had sent for Doris's marriage certificate. Has it not arrived yet? Two weeks is a bit long for the GRO at the moment.

Please let us have the details as soon as it arrives.

Ooh Alan, I hope you do. Please let us know what happens.

We are sharing this with you.

Margaret

Margaret, Intend to write will keep you informed.

Alan, what did you think about writing a letter to A.B. Heasman? Could be Patricia's only cousin. Worth a try? What do you think?

Margaret

Still not received John's and Doris's marriage cert. guess I am in the hands of the post office which could mean anytime, lets hope they don't go on strike again. Sent e-mail to India National Archives for info on marriages in India, it was them who put me on to the Mumbia Port Trust who help me with info on Capt John Stewart, awaiting reply.

There is an Anthony B Heasman, age 65+, living in West Sussex (Worthing) on the electoral roll 2002-2009, with Christine E Heasman also 65+. There is a marriage of Anthony D Heasman to Christine E Hutchings in Sept 1963. The "D" is how it has been transcribed, but the original is not clear.

This could be his phone number/address.

A.B Heasman
Tel: (01903) 234056 - Text Number
35 Bulkington Av, Worthing, BN14 7HH - Map

Worth writing a letter Alan?

No death for George R Hundley. Could be still alive.

Food for thought........

England & Wales, Death Index: 1984-2005
about Phyllis Eileen D Hundley
Name: Phyllis Eileen D Hundley
Birth Date: 20 Feb 1909
Death Registration Month/Year: Jan 1990
Age at death (estimated): 80
Registration district: Brighton
Inferred County: Sussex
Volume: 18
Page: 13

England & Wales, Death Index: 1984-2005
about Philip Braham Heasman
Name: Philip Braham Heasman
Birth Date: 29 Aug 1906
Death Registration Month/Year: Jul 1986
Age at death (estimated): 79
Registration district: Worthing
Inferred County: West Sussex
Volume: 18
Page: 2041

Wonder if he is buried somewhere, with a headstone (wishful thinking), but with other family members. Worth contacting the local cemetery.

England & Wales, Death Index: 1984-2005
about Gwynneth May Heasman
Name: Gwynneth May Heasman
Birth Date: 10 Mar 1910
Death Registration Month/Year: Nov 1986
Age at death (estimated): 76
Registration district: Worthing
Inferred County: West Sussex
Volume: 18
Page: 2351

Margaret

Well done Choccy.

So Phyllis Cameron and Phillip Braham Heasman divorced we guess. He married Gwynneth M Morley in Dec 1951 and she married George R Hundley in Sep 1851.

No apparent children from either of these marriages.

Only child found is to Phillip Heasman and Phyllis Cameron, Anthony B Heasman b Sep 1939, Hove, Sussex.

So looked for a nice easy marriage of Anthony B Heasman. Several possibles, none of Anthony B. Pity, cos he would be the cousin of Alan's Patricia.

Phew. Alan, we are trying to get there.

Margaret

looks like there was a child of the first marriage of Phillip Heasman and Phyllis Cameron

England & Wales, Birth Index: 1916-2005
Name: Anthony B Heasman
Mother's Maiden Surname: Cameron
Date of Registration: Jul Aug Sep 1939
Registration district: Hove
Registration county: Sussex, Isle of Wight
Volume Number: 2b
Page Number: 503

Looks like Phillip Heasman (possible brother of Leslie Heasman) and Phyllis divorced.

Here is Phyllis' second marriage -

England & Wales, Marriage Index: 1916-2005
Name: Phyllis E De La G Heasman
Spouse Surname: Hundley
Date of Registration: Jul-Aug-Sep 1951
Registration district: Hove
Registration county (inferred): Sussex
Volume Number: 5h
Page Number: 735
Find Spouse: George R Hundley