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As that marriage has not yet been transcribed onto freebmd and I do not have access to ancestry I don't even know if that was her 1st marriage or not. If you are looking for a Greenwood birth with mmn = Greenwood I suspect it may be impossible to tell if they were children of Margaret without trawling parish registers

hi ann
could you help me find out if margaret greenwood had any children
i see she married james maughan in 1946 so she would have been about 48 at the time, so am guessing if she had children it would have been befor the the marriage.
kind regards
mel.x

sorry - I think that is an impossible task on the internet. There are just too many of them when the time scale is not known. The marriage certificate would be the best bet.

thanks ann
can you find a D.O.B. for william haworth at all i have looked on family search but cant find one.
kind regards
melody.x

from lancashirebmd.org.uk

Lancashire Marriage indexes for the years: 1924
GREENWOOD Annie
HAWORTH William
Burnley Register Office or Registrar Attended (I would hazard a guess that that is St Mary's again)

and there are these 2 possible births on freebmd (there may be more untranscribed & I do not have access to ancestry)

Births Jun 1925 (>99%)
Haworth Constance Greenwood Burnley 8e 281 Scan available - click to view
Births Mar 1927 (>99%)
Haworth Richard Greenwood Haslingden 8e 136 Scan available - click to view

Hi Ann
i was wondering if you would be able to help me again?
i have found the first marriage of Annie greenwood it was in the june qtr 1924 in burnley,
she married unknown haworth am trying to find out his first name and D.O.B and also if they had any children.
As we know she married again in 1954 to joseph patrick kelly am assuming if she had children it would have been in her first marriage as she would have been almost 50 at the time of her second marriage,
any help would be greatly appreciated
kind regards
melody.x

this death would fit as Rochale covers Spotland which is where they were in 1881 and the age is right

Deaths Dec 1888 (>99%)
GREENWOOD Joseph 51 Rochdale 8e 75

It is not unusual for a father not to be described as 'deceased' on a marriage certificate - I think it depends on the registrar/vicar

hi ann
no i cant find joseph the last census i have for him is 1881 i think i found his wife in 1891 living on her own means with her 2 daughters leah and mary jane, says she is a widow?
regards
melody.x

I wondered that too as it must be right (or v similar) going by the marriage witness name which presumably with the certificate you have now confirmed

Cannot find a corresponding birth or a marriage for Joseph with a Mary Ann Staffonds

have you found Joseph in 1901/1911?

hi ann
yes that is the right family, am guessing joseph was still alive when william got married in 1896 as it does not say deceased on the marriage cert,
also i wonder why edwin has a different surname to the rest of the family
regards
melody.x

where is the latest ref you have to Joseph to give some idea of what to look for? Have you found him after 1881

incidentally I think those baptisms prove that the 1881 cenus (and 1871) on p1 are the right William.

also sister Leah is with him in 1901

1881
Joseph GREENWOOD Head M Male 44 Todmorden, York, England Cotton Spinner
Mary Ann GREENWOOD Wife M Female 44 Bakewell, Derby, England
Edwin STAFFONDS Son U Male 18 Bacup, Lancashire, England Spinner **************
William Thomas GREENWOOD Son U Male 16 Bacup, Lancashire, England Spinner
Susan GREENWOOD Daughter U Female 13 Bacup, Lancashire, England Weaver Cotton
Leah GREENWOOD Daughter U Female 8 Stacksteads, Lancashire, England Scholar
Mary Jane GREENWOOD Daughter U Female 5 Stacksteads, Lancashire, England Scholar

Source Information:
Dwelling Hemp Street No 7
Census Place Spotland, Lancashire, England
Family History Library Film 1341986
Public Records Office Reference RG11
Piece / Folio 4121 / 82
Page Number 8

Edwin Staffonds was named as the witness on William & Ann's marriage

hi ann
i got a copy of the marriage cert for william thomas greenwood and mary ann bridge, williams father was joseph greenwood occupation cotton mule spinner,
am trying to find the death now for joseph any help would be much appreciated
kind regards
melody.x

thank you ann that was very kind of you and much appriciated
kind regards
melody.x

records at St Mary of the Assumption Burnley

26 Dec 1896
William Thomas s of Joseph Greenwood married
Mary Ann Bridge d of Margaret Bridge
witnesses Edwin ??? (poss __ffon) & Margaret Helen Hurst

baptisms
6 Feb 1898 Margaret born 11 Jan 1898
d of William Thomas Greenwood & Mary Ann (nee Bridge) of 20 Brunswick St
sponsors Thomas Kenny, Clara Kenny
note at bottom of baptism:- married James Maughan 7-9-1946

6 Jan 1901 Mary born 18 Dec 1900
d of William Thomas Greenwood & Mary Ann (nee Briggs - guess the priest misheard) of 72 Hurst St
sponsor Sabina Fitzpatrick

20 Jan 1905 Annie born 1 jan 1905
d of William Thomas Greenwood & Mary Ann (nee Bridge) of 42 Milton St
sponsor Mary Pollitt
note at bottom of baptism:- married Patrick Kelly in Eccles 2-3 1954

according to Lancsbmd Annie had probably been married before as she is also reg as Howarth

Lancashire Marriage indexes for the years: 1954
Surname Forename(s) Surname Forename(s) Church / Register Office Registers At Reference
KELLY * Patrick Joseph GREENWOOD Annie Burnley Register Office or Registrar Attended Preston BRM/22/149
KELLY * Patrick Joseph HAWORTH Annie Burnley Register Office or Registrar Attended

thankyou ann that would be greatly appreciated.x

Ok Melody. So what you really need is proof of William Thomas's father which you could get from the marriage certificate.
I would guess as you have prayer cards and the marriage on lancs bmd indicates registrar attended that the marriage took place in an RC church in Burnley. Do you have any idea which one?
The only RC church in Burnley which has records in the Lancs Record Office is St Mary of the Assumption. If you think it would be worth while I can have a look next time I am there.

i have the 1911 census and also the prayer cards for william thomas greenwood death he died 25/12/1932 and also have a copy of mary ann greenwood prayer card she died 02/07/1926

Melody

Have you got certificates to prove William Thomas & Mary Ann were Mary's parents? THere are rather a lot of mary Greenwoods in the area.

Also the marraige certificate for father's names

Jsut trying to stop you wasting your time going down the wrong route

eg there are 6 Joseph Greenwoods born in Todmorden in a possible time scale.

if you do end up researching in the Todmorden area this is a good site to use
http://todmordenandwalsden.co.uk/

thanks catherine, i wonder where josephs father is?
how did you enjoy your holiday what part of england did you go to?

Sorry for the delay, just back from a week in England!

Possible 1851 ?
Name: Joseph Greenwood
Age: 14
Estimated birth year: abt 1837
Relation: Son
Mother's Name: Hannah
Gender: Male
Where born: Todmorden, Lancashire, England

Civil parish: Todmorden and Walsden
Town: Todmorden
County/Island: Yorkshire
Country: England

Street Address: Smith Hill

Occupation: Rope Makers Apprentice

Registration district: Todmorden
Sub-registration district: Todmorden
ED, institution, or vessel: 3b
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 17
Household Members:
Name Age
Hannah Greenwood 28 born: Stansfield, Yorkshire (age looks more like 38)
Joseph Greenwood 14
James Greenwood 9
Elizabeth Greenwood 7
William Greenwood 2
James Ingham 27