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thanks everyone. very helpful this info x

thanks for the info on Richards death ann , would not have known it was a catholic burial. thanks

Death: 19 Apr 1861 Brownedge St Mary, Bamber Bridge, Lancashire, England
Richardus Fowler -
Burial: 21 Apr 1861
Age: 77
Abode: Moon's Mill
Sacraments Administered: Yes

edit
ie RC burial
1861 census date 7th April so before his death

it fits the time frame - alive at census date and died before marriage of John in october

The marriage age shown as 33 I thik is a mistranscription from lan-opc. Ancestry has it transcribed as 23

Name: John Fowler
Gender: Male
Marital Status: Single
Age: 23
Birth Date: 1838
Marriage Date: 19 Oct 1861
Marriage Place: St. John'S, Preston, Lancashire, England
Father: Richard Fowler
Spouse: Mary Birtwistle

I think there is a very good chance that the death in 1861 is him - it was certainly registered in the correct area of Preston - i.e. Walton le Dale:

Lancashire Death indexes for the years: 1861
Surname Forename(s) Age or Date of Birth Sub-District Registers At Reference
FOWLER Richard 77 Walton-le-Dale Preston WLD/9/55

Dea x

Richard is on 1861 census and not 1871 so his death is in between those years.


Maryb.

ah, just reaised. I think I missed seeing the 1851. Not as confusing as I thought. So thankyou very much. so the Richard fowler marrying ann ashton in 1810 is not the correct one . I had my doubts anyway. Can we find the death of Richard fowler then, would have had to be between 1851 and 1861 .
Do you think that the death aged 77 of a Richard fowler in 1861 could be him ? :-S

im confused now completely. So is Richard the husband of nancy hinton ? Called ann hinton ? And do you think then that this Richard is the father of the above john born in 1837 ? or does this rule him out as father of the above john fowler ? Because on his wedding to mary birtwistle it does not say anything to do with farming for his father Richards profession. I know they can change profession. yes, well done mary for spotting that wedding. great detective work.

So we know that nancy fowler is ann hinton , my friend was thinking that Richard had been married twice . or that Richard anyway.
I'm still no nearer knowing which Richard is the father of john fowler born 1837 ish but at least I can rule that one out , cant I ?
:-S :-S :-S :-S

Well done Mary on finding a marriage.

Marriage: 9 Feb 1824 St John, Preston, Lancashire, England
Richard Fowler - (X), this Parish
Ann Hinton - (X), this Parish
Witness: John Tipping, (X); Sarah Hinton, (X)
Married by Banns by: Thos. Raven
Register: Marriages 1821 - 1825, Page 180, Entry 21
Source: LDS Film 94014

1881 Nancy is down as Alice Fowler mum in law born Kendal
She is with Richard and Jane Turner nee Fowler.

Maryb.

FOWLER, ALICE HINTON Order
GRO Reference: 1844 M Quarter in THE PRESTON UNION Volume 21 Page 698

Both Alice's died young.

FOWLER, ALICE 3 Order
GRO Reference: 1843 M Quarter in THE PRESTON UNION Volume 21 Page 484 Order
FOWLER, ALICE 0 Order
GRO Reference: 1844 S Quarter in THE PRESTON UNION Volume 21 Page 374

FOWLER, JANE HINTON Order
GRO Reference: 1846 J Quarter in THE PRESTON UNION Volume 21 Page 771

FOWLER, ALICE HILTON Order
GRO Reference: 1839 M Quarter in THE PRESTON UNION Volume 21 Page 626

These appear to be the births of 2 of the children. Mother's name Hinton or Hilton.

Richard married 9/2/1824 to Ann Hinton.Married at St Johns Preston.

Ann Hinton born 1804 in Kendal to Samuel and Agnes Hinton.

Alice Fowler born 1839 says mum Hilton but I think it should be Hinton.
Jane fowler 1847 V21 P771 mum nee Hinton.

Maryb.

1851 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
Cross Cottage, Cuerdale, Preston, Lancashire, England


First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Sex Age Birth year Occupation Birth place
Richard Fowler Head Married Male 65 1786 Farmer Servant Ribbleton, Lancashire, England
Transcription
Nancy Fowler Wife Married Female 49 1802 - Kendal, Cumberland, England
Transcription
James Fowler Son Unmarried Male 20 1831 Farmer Servant Ribbleton, Lancashire, England
Transcription
Agnes Fowler Daughter Unmarried Female 18 1833 Power Loom Weaver Ribbleton, Lancashire, England
Transcription
John Towler Son Unmarried Male 16 1835 Power Loom Weaver Preston, Lancashire, England
Transcription
Lane Towler Daughter - Female 4 1847 Scholar Lancashire, England



1861 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
Potter Lane, Walton Le Dale, Preston, Lancashire, England

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Household Members
First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Sex Age Birth year Occupation Birth place
Richard Fowler Head Married Male 75 1786 Agricultural Labourer Preston, Lancashire, England
Transcription
Nancy Fowler Wife Married Female 56 1805 - Kendal, Westmorland, England
Transcription
James Fowler Son Unmarried Male 30 1831 Agricultural Labourer Preston, Lancashire, England
Transcription
Agnes Fowler Daughter Unmarried Female 28 1833 Cotton Power Loom Weaver Preston, Lancashire, England
Transcription
Jane Fowler Daughter Unmarried Female 14 1847 Cotton Power Loom Weaver Lancashire, England



1871 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
Brook Street, Walton-Le-Dale, Preston, Lancashire, England

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Household Members
First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Sex Age Birth year Occupation Birth place
Nancy Fowler Head - Female 67 1804 - Westmorland, England
Transcription
James Fowler Son - Male 36 1835 - Lancashire, England
Transcription
Richard Fowler Son - Male 25 1846 - Lancashire, England
Transcription
Jane Turner Boarder - Female 24 1847 - Lancashire, England
Transcription
Alice Fowler Boarder - Female 5 1866 - Lancashire, England

Richard's died between 1861 and 1871 which would fit in with the fact on the MC. I am struggling to find a marriage as well.

looks like the new set of children mean that nancy and Richard started having children in 1830/31 so I have been looking for a marriage around then, unless ann and nancy are one and the same person, but then I don't think that is possible as nancy is too young to have married in 1810. Think the one married to ann ashton was a farmer anyway, so maybe not the same person >?
:-) :-S
Shirley

we found that census but unsure if nancy was his wife as we found a Richard fowler marrying an ann ashton in preston in 1810 I think. I know ann is connected to nancy but not sure if Richard was previously married to ann ashton and then either married or lived with nancy ?
thanks for all your help so far. <3 :-)

think that 33 must be an error, but am unable to find a john fowler born to Richard fowler born 1837 in preston area . :-S

Possible for John. Richard is a labourer and I wonder if John's age has been mistranscribed on the MC, a 3 written instead of a 2?


1841 England, Wales & Scotland Census Transcription
Walton Village Green, Blackburn, Preston, Lancashire, England

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Household Members
First name(s) Last name Sex Age Birth year Birth place
Richard Fowler Male 50 1791 Lancashire, England
Transcription
Nancy Fowler Female 36 1805 -
Transcription
James Fowler Male 10 1831 Lancashire, England
Transcription
Agness Fowler Female 8 1833 Lancashire, England
Transcription
John Fowler Male 6 1835 Lancashire, England
Transcription
Alice Fowler Female 2 1839 Lancashire, England
Transcription
Dinanah Stricklandson Female 50 1791 Lancashire, England

Marriage for our reference.

Marriage: 19 Oct 1861 St John, Preston, Lancashire, England
John Fowler - (X), 33, Weaver, Bachelor, Westmorland Street
Mary Birtwistle - (X), 23, Weaver, Spinster, Elizabeth Street
Groom's Father: late Richard Fowler, Laborer
Bride's Father: James Birtwistle, Joiner
Witness: Thomas Parkinson; Alice Edleston, (X)
Married by Banns by: J Owen Parr Vicar
Register: Marriages 1861 - 1862, Page 30, Entry 59
Source: LDS Film 93997

death of Mary?

Surname First name(s) Age District Vol Page
Deaths Jun 1899 (>99%)
Fowler Mary 61 Blackburn 8e 242

Andy