Genealogy Chat

OK- I'm now doubtful the Elizabeth on the 1939 register is Elizabeth Anderson.

As we know Alice was already in Glasow nurse training.

Elizabeth could also have been in Glasgow.

In 1936 & 1937 her brother Robert (who registered her death), is living at 2 Vinicombe Street, Glasgow. It is a shared household with several different names living there- but on the list is Elizabeth Porteous and Sophia R Anderson.

(Elizabeth had a sister Sophia Robertson Anderson who died in 1937)
-----------------------

In 1939 and 1940 Robert is still at the same address- Sophia, of course isn't listed as she had died, but Mrs Elizabeth Porteous is also still at the same address- so it doesn't look likely she was on the 1939 register.

That makes more sense AustinQ. I think you are correct and the area is right. Both Vinicombe Street and Havelock Street are in Hillhead area and that would make the Western Infirmary an obvious choice for Alice to do her nursing training as it is walking distance of both those streets.

Different names at 2 Vinicombe Street also makes sense as, from memory, these buildings were typical Glasgow tenements. There could be eight or even twelve different flats at that address each of which would be a separate household.

Thanks RG- I know nothing of the area.

A James Johnston Porteous is on the London electoral register (with an Elizabeth Porteous) from 1934- 1939. But it now appears the Elizabeth Anderson that married a James Porteous in 1913 was living in Glasgow.

The children, Jean & William are living with James sister- which is odd if their mother was in Scotland. Perhaps the original Elizabeth Anderson who married in 1913 is not the mother of Jean and William?? Again- I think they at least need Jean's birth certificate.

I think it likely that they were Elizabeth Robertson Anderson's children. Named for her parents? William and Jane (Jane and Jean are interchangeable in Scotland).

That 1951 marriage looks as though Celcilia was a spinster. Not sure when Scotlandspeople started indexing marriages using married and maiden surnames but they certainly did by 1955 (just checked my Aunt's second marriage).

To summarise. We know that there are 3 possible children for James.

Alice b. 1917 although no birth found. Named for paternal grandmother Alice / Alison
Jean Margaret. Named for maternal grandmother.
William. Named for maternal grandfather.

I would have thought if they were using the usual naming pattern, that there would have been a son named Robert for James's father?

I wondered about the children being with James's sister but in 1939 I think there may have been concerns about their safety living in Glasgow or London. Or perhaps Elizabeth had to work to support herself and was unable to look after the children.

Without doubt, I think that some certificates are needed here to be sure. :-) :-)

Oh yes, of course- I hadn't thought about the naming patterns.

And yes- it makes sense that the children would have been made safe with the onset of war. I did wonder if Elizabeth returned to Scotland to nurse her sister?

It is always possible that was her reason AustinQ.

The Cecilia married to James in 1951 has to be the one that was found on page 1. There only seems to be one Malaune family around. Almost certainly a corruption of Maloney as they probably didn't want to sound Irish. Not uncommon at that time. The only thing is the date of birth on the 1939 register doesn't match either Cecilia or Elizabeth Robertson Anderson's DOB.

Just such a pity the Scottish 1939 register isn't available online.

The idea of Elizabeth nursing Sophia is highly likely.

I had a look at Sophia's death cert, and she died of carcinoma of the ovaries, secondary metastases.
Brother Robert was the informant.

She was a retired school teacher.
Father: William Anderson, master tailor, deceased.
Mother: Jane Anderson, ms Andrew, deceased.


I still rather like the 1917 birth of Alice Anderson.

You might be right about the birth.

I'm just trying to go through the sisters to see what happened to them.

Sophia Robertson Anderson born 1885 died in 1937- never married

Jeanie (Jane Cameron) born 1887 died in 1918 Alves

I suspect Jessie W is Janet Wight Anderson born 1884- she died 1908 Alves

Williamina Anderson born 1890- not sure what happened to her. She's living with sister, Elizabeth, in Alves in 1911.

Williamina's birth:

ANDERSON
WILLIAMINA
F
1890
125/ 21
Alves


She's still in Alves with her family in 1911.

I don't see a Morayshire marriage or death for her.



In 1911, the family consists of:
William, 81
Ann, 76
William, 59
George, 35
Elizabeth, 24
Sophia, 26
Williamina, 20
Janet, 4
Annie, 6

All are Anderson. I imagine Janet and Annie are George's children.

With the same ref number, there's also
Charlie McArthur, 29
Allan Grant, 18
Maggie Borthwick, 17
David Cameron, 17
Jane Burr, 15
John Stewart, 16
Amy Searle, 24

Probably all lodgers or servants.

Sorry AG- I added to my post. I can't see a death or marriage either.

Oh- think she went to Canada- hold on, I'll post details.

Passenger Lists leaving UK 1890-1960

First name(s) Williamina
Last name Anderson
Gender Female
Age 30
Birth year 1891
Occupation DOM
Departure year 1921
Departure day 18
Departure month 6
Departure port Glasgow
Destination port Montreal
Destination MONTREAL
Country Canada
Destination country Canada
Ship name Cassandra
Ship official number 124130

Last Address in UK. Gateside, Alves, Forres,
Profession: Domestic
Intended future residence: Canada

So, in theory, either Sophia, Jeanie/Janet, or Williamina could be Alice Anderson's mother.

Lol- yes. We're not getting very far fast on this one!

And I don't think we will get any further with Alice, unless Florence's friend is willing to take a punt on the 1917 birth cert. (As well as all the other certs mentioned before!)

Of course, Alice Anderson may not have anything to do with this family!

But if not, it's odd that there's no record of an Alice Porteous's birth.

Just to add- I wasn't sure who the George was on the 1911 census. He wasn't a child of William- he was the husband of Jessie Wight Anderson.

George and Jessie married in 1904- so yes, I think the younger children on the census are George and Jessie's children.

Oh, and after Jessie Wight Anderson's death in 1908, George Anderson then marries again to Jessie's sister, Jane Cameron Anderson in 1913. Jane then dies in 1918. Now wondering if Alice was child of George and Jane?

Could be.
But as young Janet and Annie were both born in Alves, and their stepmother Jane died in Alves, why would Alice be born in Glasgow?
Not impossible, of course.

And why would she be called Porteous later? (If she's the same Alice.)

If Alice Porteous and Alice Anderson are one and the same, it must be because she had been adopted by James & Elizabeth, or had at least taken their name


So frustrating! It's all conjecture.

George appears to have gone on to marry a third Anderson (though not another sister.)

ANDERSON
GEORGE
ANDERSON
HANNAH FORSYTH
1925
135/ 13
Elgin

I'm assuming this is the correct marriage because the same private tree as showed James & Elizabeth's divorce also has this marriage cert on it.

Hannah's parents were Alexander Anderson and Jane Reid, so not a sister of his previous two wives.

Just to let you know,i have had to order jean porteous's birth certificate. At least then I/we shall know exactly who her parents were etc...

I will let you know as soon as I get it.

many thanks for your continued efforts
Much appreciated
Florence
in the hebrides :-)