General Chat

Seeing my views on whether or not prisoners should have the right to vote, you might be surprised that I would also agree with everything George says, EXCEPT that one thing.

The right to vote is just that, a right...within society. When you are removed from society, those rights are forfeited. Now I am not talking about basic human rights, I hate the idea of prison overcrowding, slopping out and general degradation. They do still have the human right to have the basic necessities to live and remain healthy and well. That is, fed, clean, and warm, with exercise. AND they have the right to education, which will possible help to give them a chance in life when they get out. (or if they probably won't get out, it can still be put to good use inside.)

But prison should also be a time to reflect on the damage you have done to others within that society, to face up to the crime, to learn that the people you committed the crime against are humans, real people.

My son works for the Prison Fellowship http://www.prisonfellowship.org.uk/ He deals regularly with inmates face to face, and helps them reconcile their actions and the effect on the victims of their crimes. I've spoken to him on this topic, and even he agrees, while serving a sentence, they should not vote in a local, council or parliamentary election. Why should a convicted murderer have a say in how society is run? A society from which he has been removed from by a court of law.

Maggie you have that right ..we are talking about about those who removed from others ... the rapist etc what rights do they deserve ..
So back to the question NO to votes in prison

I don't think we are talking about political prisoners.
We're talking about those who have removed the right of their victims to feel safe in their own homes; feel safe talking to strangers; feel safe walking down the road.
We're talking about rapists who removed the right of a woman/man/child to have a decent relationship; paedophiles who denied a child the right to an innocent childhood.
Don't forget those who have lost the right to life, a child, a husband, a brother, a sister a wife, a father, a mother, and the affect on their families.
I could go on, but you get the drift. Who's rights do we focus on first?

George if the UK held the worlds worst man in their cells, would you advocate that he had tele and a vote, or would you call for his death . Each case has it's own rights and wrongs. So there is times that you have to trust those that you put into power to be right ...or act

a good point Lady in Red, I am an expat and I no longer vote in the UK. That doean't mean I am not interested in my country of birth. Those who vote still in the UK do still live part of the year there, or at least own properties that contribute to the UK economy, same as a Dane who owns a UK property that gives them a right to vote

Does that then mean, they also give up their rights to learn, their rights to religion, their rights to humanity.
Would you also say that about political prisoners..?

In addition to convicted prisoners, those banned from voting include members of the Lords, anyone found guilty of election corruption within the past five years and people with learning disabilities or a mental illness deemed incapable of making a reasoned judgment.

George part of freedom is the right to vote ..you say they give up their freedom yes so they give up that part what makes them society the freedom to vote.

An article here, if you want to read more...

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/libertycentral/2010/feb/13/prisoners-voting-rights

What about ex-pats? They go to live abroad, no longer contribute to the British economy or society and yet can continue to vote in British elections? I saw something recently about this which I think said they are allowed to vote for up to 15 years after leaving the country. So, they can vote for the Government that will set the rules for a country they don't even live in!!

George please understand that I am not against the rights for a prisoner just I believe that they shouldn't have the right to vote

Prisoners give up their freedom, not their rights.

George I understand that but there is a lot more real prisoners there then the ones who shouldn't be. No they don't get a vote, next year they will because hopefully they will be let out due to their innocence

The right to vote in the UK should Not include prisons they gave those rights up when they committed the crimes

George...I like you :) lol

What about the elderly lady who was sent to prison for withholding her council tax.
A father who protects his family from armed burglars when he is sent to prison for injuring one of the burglars.

Or in recent cases, a mother accused of murdering one of her babies that die in a cot death, have they no rights in society.
I think everyone whatever their circumstances have rights, I'm not talking about the rights of prisoners to have TVs and play stations, but rights of humanity, and one of them is the right to vote

TW we definatey sit in the same corner here. and worry about the same things.

I don't know the answer and I doubt even the person who should know it does, I find the penal system in the UK these days a tad like a holiday camp for those who are dangerous. Your poor *** theives etc do hard time but the others live like it is a 1class hotel

and don't anybody tell me different!

I guess it would depend on how close the election result was !

Would be way too expensive to do a re run anyhow surely?.....

Next thing we'll be told is that it's against the prisoners human rights to be locked up in the first place !!! xx

i think they shouldnt vote to, xxx

But that's the argument. These days prison is not meant to be seen as punishment, but as rehabilitation.

(Obviously that doesnt' work or they wouldn't reoffend more often than not).

But...and this is what worries me...what if they won their case after the general election, and we are told it is invalid because of this ruling?

Doesn't bear thinking about really, I think there would be riots.