General Chat

Did anyone watch this last night?

If so, how many of you have looked on the database to see if you have any slave owning ancestors?

I have to admit, I have scoured the database, and found no slave owners (so far) amongst my ancestors.
However, I did find out who the slave owner was, of my grandad's best mate's ancestors.

My aunt was a BHC in 1909 aged 10 years old

That was a form of slavery

She was treated abominably. Forced to sleep in the barn and whipped by the lady of the house if she didn’t do things as she wanted.

Went barefoot all week and then wore Ill fitting boots on a Sunday and made to walk behind the horse and cart that took the family to church and hit for not keeping up

Her crime was losing her mum when she was 7 years old and her father having no one to take on 4 children was forced to put them in the workhouse and from there they were in a workhouse run children’s home

One of my rellies got a mention while I am living in a house built with the proceeds, just typical early c19 terrace. The family built social inst in Barbados and Jamaica which are still in use. The last one of us only came back in the 1960s.
I love Barbados.

I don't think it is the job of today to sit in judgement on yesterday.
Despite better ethics there are more de facto slaves than ever.

I'm really torn.

I understand the desire of various communities not to venerate certain of our ancestors.

Yet, destroying statues, removing paintings, etc etc doesn't remove what happened in the past.

It will only hide it even more.

We should be adding plaques to those statutes and art work, saying something along the lines of .......... "This guy did some horrible things in the the 18th (19th) century which include xxxxxx . But he also did some good things. We must remember him for both aspects."

That way we remember and abhor the slave trade or anti-semitism, but remember the social institutions or anti-slavery work that he/she did either alongside that or in later life.

So much of what what happened back then was what everyone or almost everyone else believed and often were also doing. Just as today everyone or almost everyone is anti-racism, anti-homophobia, pro-LGTBQ2.

You can't destroy history. You do need to bring it out into the light.

Shirley, that sounds awful.

Sylvia, It wouldn't be so bad if the truth about slavery was at least touched upon - but it isn't.
I feel that if there is a slavery museum in the area - like there is in both Bristol and Liverpool, the statues should be put in the museum and the real story told.
It would be nice to have statues that are more relevant to today.

Rollo,
Going on what you said about going to your course for speeding,and 'passing the estate of a distant rellie' I presume your extremely distant 'rellie' is Drax.

What social institutions did they build in Jamaica and Barbados that are still being used? That seems a very nice thing for them to do - but I suppose they'd made quite a bit from the trade.
Any idea when they were built?

Taking down statues, changing street names, hiding stuff in museums will simply ensure that the trans Atlantic trade - cotton was not mentioned yesterday- is forgotten. Instead the history should be part of school curriculum. Statues such as Colston should have people such as Samuel Sharpe and Bob Marley nearby.
There is also the issue that large numbers of native Brits were brutally treated spinning cotton grown in Dixie. This culminated in the 1819 Peterloo massacre in Manchester.

So some negro guy they adopted? started the 1832 slave insurrection?
Surely that's a case of biting the hand that feeds you.

By the way, the Dorset Drax are definitely related to the slaving Drax.

I always thought the Peterloo massacre was about political reform, exacerbated by a unemployment, an increase in food prices due to a bad harvest, and the Corn Laws.

There was a general strike in 1842 in Manchester among the textile workers due to pay cuts etc.

Don’t you just hate it when someone arbitrarily deletes or substantially rewrites a post.just makes them look silly when the original post is quoted somewhere else.

I have to agree, nameslessone.

I only asked who had watched the programme, and whether they'd done what I did.
I didn't ask who had slave trading ancestors.
I then receive a reply from RTR indicating that, yes, he had slave trading ancestors, but they were philanthropic slavers - they adopted slave children!
He also said his slave trading ancestors were definitely not the Drax family, despite his indicating to great length, in an (admittedly much) earlier post that he was related to them!

Hmm, it appears someone's hoisted himself by his own petard.

Absolutely nothing to do with you - but you altered your post.

However, you must be proud of those slaver ancestors who built institutions.
I'm amazed you don't appear to know which ones they are.

maggie ................

I think we are all supposed to be aged silly women with very short term memories ;-)

Wouldn't you just know he would have a relation who had three legs?

so one of your relations was a stag with five legs, Polo!

Why did you mention it if it isn't relevant?
Normally, you write a short essay on the greatness of your 'ancestors' whether it's relevant to the post or not.
If, as you initially stated, your ancestor built some institutions that are still there, why are you so coy about saying what they are? Surely that's a good thing?

As for Nathaniel Wells, he didn't need to be adopted, the slaver was his father:
" After his British wife died, William began fathering children by his slave women – at least six, all by different women. Although rape was a well-known practice, Wells looked after both the children and their mothers, giving them their freedom and sums of money to live on—including Nathaniel's mother, Juggy, and leaving the bulk of his estate to Nathaniel'

Nathaniel happened to be the only son among his illegitimate offspring.
You can read what the site says here: https://www.ucl.ac.uk/lbs/person/view/25474

I'm not sure who 'Ay' is, but I'm afraid the registers of claimants, and names of the slaves is on line, as I mentioned in the opening post.
https://www.ucl.ac.uk/lbs/search/

I think you'll find, as is evident from slave 'hubs' in the UK, that the slave trade certainly was important to the UK economy.
Cotton and coal kept the economy going, slavery was the icing on the cake.

As for the East India Company (or 'John Company' as you call it), Yes, it too was a rather disgusting episode in Britain's history, and the truth should be told, but you're deflecting.

maggie ................

I think Rollo is using a more-or-less rarely used abbreviation for Ancestry.

It's used mainly by people who want to confuse others, or believer wrongly that GR will delete the full word if it is used.

I wonder if Rolf Harris' song about the man with the extra leg is still under any kind of protection from people such as Rollo?

It's alright ,Sylvia.

He didn't put 'diddle-iddle-iddle um' .

:-D :-D

I had thought that Richard Drax hid his extra very well when he reported on local TV, but then it turns out that the stag with five legs is on the gate to the family estate.

Oh diddle!