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Just realized I added Peter's death at the top of this page when I meant to add Geoffrey's. Have corrected it now.

Rose

Looks like I'm not going to be able to sort out this muddle.

Maybe its not a bad thing that I can't tie in Geoffrey, my dad was in the police and recognised his uncle Geoffrey in the police gazette wanted for murder, He claimed it was self defence - his wife fell on his knife 12 times - that was in the 60s!!

Thanks for all your help Rose 'll have to leave it for just now housework calling.

Thanks
Rachel

Another odd thing....

The only birth that fits for Geoffrey is this:

Births Mar 1926
Bedford Geoffrey Woodhouse Brentford 3a 257

Can't find another Bedford/Woodhouse child or a a marriage for the parents. Perhaps Fieldhouse was incorrectly typed as Woodhouse?

I know there are some awful mistakes for my parents' and grandparents' births and marriages.

Rose

yes

edit oops pressed submit.
I don't have enough info to look for Peter's and Geoffrey's but I think I'll try that death for Peter you found.

Is that the one to a Cooper?

Rose

Not sure what to think.


There are 2 Walter Bedfords in the Leeds area. One born 1888 and the other 1892. The one born 1888 died the same year and quarter as Emma.

Rose

A death for Elsie

Deaths Sep 1930 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Bedford Elsie M 42 Loughbro' 7a 131

maybe you're right and she just pretended to be the wife.

Could be that part of the family story is right and she started out as the housekeeper had Rowland but had to give him away, Elsie had the children but died in 1930 when kenneth was born and Emma just took over the position of wife!

Pure speculation of course but the best I've got so far.

Think I'll have to wait for Pauline's marriage cert and see what it has on there.

Thanks for the help

Rachel

I'm not sure about deaths, my dad's contact/knowledge of the Bedfords was more through his cousins from my grans true sister Barbara, when they died we lost touch.

Just had the post - no marriage cert yet!

Maybe she was the housekeeper for that family and Walter got fringe benefits.

There are only 2 Bedford/Fieldhouse births and those are the names and dates that fit with your story.

Was Emma trying to pretend to be his wife Elsie?

Rose

That's just thrown a spanner in the works.

Has to be a different family? Would he have a wife and a mistress living together?
Emma was still a Duncan in 1923 when Rowland was born but Kenneth's birth cert does say Elsie but mothers maiden name Haigh Would she have raised someone elses children as her own but give her own away!

On the flip side the places of birth for the children doesn't fit with everything else I have. Emma stayed around leeds her whole life

Now you can see why I'm confused.

Rachel

Geoffrey had to be born c1926 to fit between the others and be old enough to be the informant.

There's this death:

England & Wales, Death Index: 1916-2005
about Geoffrey Bedford
Name: Geoffrey Bedford
Birth Date: 12 Jan 1926
Death Registration Month/Year: Jul 1986
Age at death (estimated): 60
Registration district: Leeds
Inferred County: Yorkshire
Volume: 5
Page: 765


Rose

England & Wales, Death Index: 1916-2005
about Peter Bedford
Name: Peter Bedford
Birth Date: 29 Sep 1924
Death Registration Month/Year: Oct 1996
Age at death (estimated): 72
Registration district: Leeds
Inferred County: Yorkshire
Register number: K10C
District and Subdistrict: 0921K
Entry number: 217

Rose

Oh wow! What do you think of this.....

Was just looking at Walter Bedford marriages in Leeds to see if the reason he never married Pauline was because he was already married and found the following:

Marriages Jun 1919
Bedford Walter Fieldhouse Leeds 9b 1192
Fieldhouse Elsie Bedford Leeds 9b 1192


And children....

Births Dec 1924
Bedford Peter Fieldhouse Tynemouth 10b 486


Births Sep 1928
Bedford Pauline Fieldhouse Hammersmith 1a 267



Rose

Geoffrey Bedford her son.

Who was the informant on Emma's death cert?

Rose

Hi Rose,

Thats the problem I know nothing about Walter.

My dad had 3 uncles and an aunt from the second marriage who he met with the surname Bedford.

My first contact with the name Walter came from the illegitimate child born to Emma, he contacted the family in 1984 and I still have his letter to my gran. His birth name was Rowland Walter Bedford Duncan and that was also when the spelling of Hague changed to Haigh. You can see it on FreeBMD.

The other children to Emma and 'Walter' were Peter, Geoffrey, Pauline and Kenneth. My dad remembered that kenneth died in a car crash around Christmas time so I was able to trace a death cert for him 27/12/61 it had his age as 31 and I looked for a birth to match which gave me a birth in Sept 1930 with the father Walter Bedford and Elsie Bedford nee Haigh. Walter is listed as a clerk in the ministry of health.

I also know that Emma died of cancer in 1946 and I was able to get a death cert which showed her as the widow of Walter Bedford, clerk ministry of health. it also has her residence the same as Kenneth's when he died.

I think Walter must have died around 1937 because Emma tried to find Rowland at this point and the people who raised him formally adopted him so she couldn't take him back.

Other than having Walter's name on a lot of certificates I know nothing about him, I've tried going through all the Walter Bedfords around Leeds on the 1911 census looking for a clerk but found nothing but as he isnt mentioned until 1923 that isn't surprising.

I've recently applied for Pauline's marriage cert to see if that gives me any different info, just waiting for that to arrive.

I am considering applying for all the death certs for Walter between 1930 and 1937!!!!!

If you have any suggestions on what to try next I would be grateful.

Thanks
Rachel

Hi Rachel,

Saw your thread about directories and searched for this one.

What do you know about Walter? When did he die?

Rose

Hi Sylvia

My family believe the 'Dr' story was just to make it seem 'nicer' that she abandoned her children. Going to be the housekeper of a Dr sounds better than leaving her children to be the 'bide-y-in' of a clerk. She was clearly doing more than dusting when she had Rowland shortly after.

I know I have the right death cert for Kenneth which has the same address as the death cert of Emma. Emma death cert has Walter Bedford as a clerk and that was the first we knew of him not being a Dr.

The birth for Rowland Walter Bedford Duncan, the illigitimate child, has Haigh as the mothers maiden name. When I originally started looing for Emma I was looking for a Haig and it was only through census records that I realised it started out as Hague.

This is why it gets confusing, I have the information upto 1920 and that from 1930 but the marriage and births in between are missing. Did they ever get married? Why was only the last birth registered?

Now the basic question I would ask is


are we dealing with two completely unrelated families.


Michael found children born to a couple Bedford / Hague .................... which is what you said was the surname of your gt grandmother


But you say they are not the children that you are looking for


Now you are saying that the children are Bedford mmn Haigh


I expect to see such differences in spelling on censuses in the 19th century, but most certainly NOT on bmds in the 1920s and 1930s.



I am also puzzled by the statement that she went to work for a Dr .................. but you then describe Walter Bedford as a clerk in the Ministry of Health

I'm sorry, but I am practically certain that a Doctor would not be a mere clerk!



there's too many imponderables in this story!





sylvia

Thanks for your help Michael but I said in my original post thet she was married to Edward Duncan in 1914. I have that information already.

It is her second marriage that I am trying to find information on.

I don't know why she would use the name Elsie - possibly a knickname.

I know I have the right death for her son Kenneth Gordon Bedford in 61 age 31.

I have a death cert for Emma Bedford in 46 at the same address as the son's death in 61 with details of her husband Walter Bedford a clerk in the ministry of health.

I have a birth cert for Kenneth Gordon Bedford in 1930 father Walter Bedford, clerk ministry of health and mother Elsie Bedford formerly Haigh.

Rachel