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Looking for any info on Philip Agustus Warren. Know he had a son Albert Hall Warren born 22/12/1852 Paddington, London. On Albert's birth certificate his parents are shown as Philip Agustus Warren and Sarah Jane (formally Badnall.) The only Sarah J Badnall that I can find was born 29/6/1810 which would make her 42 at her sons birth!
Unable to trace a marrage for her and Philip or the birth of Philip.

Any info gratefully received.

Kay

she could still have been a mother at 42

Did they have other children?

42 is no age for mums then, you get them well into their late 40s.

Is this the boy? Does he not appear on any census?

Name: Albert Hall Warren
Year of Registration: 1853
Quarter of Registration: Jan-Feb-Mar
District: Kensington
County: Greater London, London, Middlesex
Volume: 1a
Page: 5

SARAH JANE BADNALL Pedigree
Female


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Event(s):
Birth: 29 JUN 1810

Christening: 20 SEP 1810 Saint Anne Soho, Westminster, London, England

Death:
Burial:


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Parents:
Father: JAMES BADNALL Family
Mother: HANNAH


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Messages:
Extracted birth or christening record for the locality listed in the record. The source records are usually arranged chronologically by the birth or christening date.

just for reference

Albert's death:

Albert Hall Warren
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1853
Year of Registration: 1899
Quarter of Registration: Jan-Feb-Mar
Age at Death: 46
District: London City
County: Greater London, London, Middlesex
Volume: 1c
Page: 7

And his marriage:

Marriages Mar 1881 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Fowler Thomas Charles St.Giles 1b 629
HEWITT Annie St.Giles 1b 629
SMITH Marvella Jane St. Giles 1b 629
WARREN Albert Hall St. Giles 1b 629

Strugging to find him on any census except 1891:

1891 England Census
about Albert Warren
Name: Albert Warren
Age: 39
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1852
Relation: Head
Spouse's Name: Mariella
Gender: Male
Where born: Kingsland, London, England

Civil parish: St Pancras
Ecclesiastical parish: St Peter
County/Island: London
Country: England

Street Address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Education:

Employment status: View image

Registration district: Pancras
Sub-registration district: Gray
ED, institution, or vessel: 8
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members: Name Age
Albert Warren 39
Mariella Warren 40
Alberto Warren 9
Charles Warren 3

There's a tree on Ancestry that has them but no more info than what you've got other than Albert died 1899, Holborn, age 47.

How about this for a mistranscription!!:

1881 England Census
about Albert Mahoen
Name: Albert Mahoen
Age: 28
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1853
Relation: Head
Spouse's Name: Marvella
Gender: Male
Where born: Paddington, Middlesex, England

Civil parish: Shoreditch
County/Island: London
Country: England

Street Address: 201 Hoxton St
Condition as to marriage: Married
Education:

Employment status: View image
Occupation: Licensed Victualler

Registration district: Shoreditch
Sub-registration district: Hoxton Old Town
ED, institution, or vessel: 6
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members: Name Age
Albert Mahoen 28
Marvella Mahoen 26
Emile Eschell 24
Wm. Dawson 33
Ellen Bull 15

I think this could be him in 1871, with a brother William H:

1871 England Census
about William H Warren
Name: William H Warren
Age: 26
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1845
Relation: Head
Spouse's Name: Sarah
Gender: Male
Where born: Bayswater
Civil parish: St Leonard Shoreditch
Ecclesiastical parish: St Paul Haggerstone
Town: London
County/Island: London
Country: England
Registration district: Shoreditch
Sub-registration district: Haggerston East
ED, institution, or vessel: 17
Household schedule number: 90
Household Members: Name Age
William H Warren 26
Sarah Warren 25
Mary Ann Warren 20
Albert Warren 18
Jennie Warren 6
Fanny Warren 1

Because this looks like William in 1861:

1861 England Census
about William Hall Warren
Name: William Hall Warren
Age: 16
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1845
Relation: Pupil
Gender: Male
Where born: Bayswater, Middlesex, England

Civil parish: Walcot
Ecclesiastical parish: St Swithin
County/Island: Somerset
Country: England

Street Address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage: View image

Registration district: Bath
Sub-registration district: Lansdown
ED, institution, or vessel: 18
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 49
Household Members: Name Age
Josephus Glim 38
Charlotte Henrlip Glim 43
George Phope Bevis 30
William Hall Warren 16

It looks to be a school - possibly Lansdowne Collegiate College, Bath

I think this is Sarah and family in 1851 (transcription errors and horrible handwriting0:
1851 Ancestry
Name: William Hall Warren
Age: 6
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1845
Relation: Son
Mother's Name: Mitt
Gender: Male
Where born: Paddington, Middlesex, England
Civil parish: Paddington
Ecclesiastical parish: Trinity
County/Island: Middlesex
Country: England
Registration district: Kensington
Sub-registration district: St Mary Paddington
ED, institution, or vessel: 8

Household schedule number: 170
Household Members:
Name Age
Mitt Warrer 39
Lucy Warren 13
Fredk Aaguk Warren 11
Agnes Anna Warren 9
William Hall Warren 6
Emma Badwell 48
Hannah Cabridg 63

Source Citation: Class: HO107; Piece: 1466; Folio: 394; Page: 52

This looks like Albert with brother William:
1871 Ancestry
Name: Albert Warren
Age: 18
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1853
Relation: Brother
Gender: Male
Where born: Bayswater
Civil parish: St Leonard Shoreditch
Ecclesiastical parish: St Paul Haggerstone
Town: London
County/Island: London
Country: England
Registration district: Shoreditch
Sub-registration district: Haggerston East
ED, institution, or vessel: 17
Household schedule number: 90
Household Members:
Name Age
William H Warren 26
Sarah Warren 25
Mary Ann Warren 20
Albert Warren 18
Jennie Warren 6
Fanny Warren 1

Source Citation: Class: RG10; Piece: 472; Folio: 58; Page: 15;

Maureen

Edit: Ooops-Potty beat me to it!

What was Philip's occupation on the birth cert?

Well done Maureen - the writing really is awful on the 1851. Only thing is, "Mitt" is a widow in 1851 and Albert wasn't born until Dec 1852???

I know,Potty! Bit of a problem.
Are you able to make out the address in 1851 ???

Maureen

Ah-at least the handwriting is clear on the ED description. Pickering Place.

Maureen

Have received some PMs from Kay - mainly thanking for info but also saying that Phillip was down as a solicitor on Albert's birth cert.

Kay, rather than sending PMs, could you post your info to this thread. That way everybody can see what is said.

To find the thread, click on My threads at left of screen; click on your thread, then on the Reply button; type your message and then click on the Submit button.

No, Maureen, I can't make out the address. Only that it is 6 ????y Place. I also can't make out what Emma's relationship is. I think she is Sarah's sister. I have found a baptism on IGI for an Emma Badnall with the same parents as Sarah, in Marylebone, 1806, birth 1804.

Oh dear-here we go again:
1861 Ancestry
Household Members:
Name Age
John Reserve 61
Eliza Geo Theis 33
William Hy Le?? 23
Alfred Chas L?? 2
Laura Werren 23
Fredk Augusto Werren 21
Agnes Enna Werren 19
Mary Ann Cole Werren 9
Robert Male Werren 7
Arthur Warren 2
Emma Ladwell 52

Source Citation: Class: RG9; Piece: 162; Folio: 44; Page: 33

Also just realised that the 1841 for Paddington is missing. Odd that Philip doesn't seem to pop up on the radar at all.

Maureen

Well done, again, Maureen!!

Looking at the image, Robert Male Werren is actualy Albert Hall Warren! And Mary Ann Cole is Mary Ann Hall Warren.

I can't quite sort out the relationships, though.

Got it! The Reserves and the Werrens are two seperate households; there is no head of household given for the Werrens, first listed is Laura (Daur) age 25. Wonder if she is the Lucy from the 1851?

Only Laura is shown as unmarried - nothing against the others. So, whose daughter is Mary Ann and whose son is Arthur and where is Sarah? Emma Badnell is shown as Aunt, presumably to Laura and the others?

Yes, Emma was Sarah's sister. She also had 3 other siblings.

Also feel that Hannah Cubridge could just be her mother. She could have reverted to her maiden name on her husbands death.- I have found this before on other branches.

Ar'nt you all so clever coming up with this when I've been struggling for months!!
If the 1851 census is correct then Philip was dead when it was taken although I've yet to find a death for him.
Think I may have found a death for Sarah in 1861 at St George East.
But who is Arthur Warren aged 2 in 1861 census??