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Derbyshire Parish Records

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ProfilePosted byOptionsPost Date

jerseylily

jerseylily Report 2 Dec 2009 00:29

Hi Derek

Good to see that the thread's going as strongly as ever.

Any progress on the Wombles of Wellow?

Pam

Simon

Simon Report 2 Dec 2009 10:16

Derek
That is brilliant news... I have come across William and Hannah before now, maybe in the lineage of Joseph B and Jane Johnson, who, you may remember were given me wrongly, at one point as Thomas' parents.... need to trawl thru some old notes which will maybe take a day or 2 before I can come back with anything... About Denby I'm not sure, will look into it, is that anywhere near Heanor, that seems to have cropped up in the outer reaches, as it were

Will be in touch

And thanks again, so much

Simon

Simon

Simon Report 2 Dec 2009 12:22

Hi Derek
Me again- any idea on where William was born or where he married Hannah.... Had a quick look around and got a lead, which I need to follow up for Denby and 1733, but I Need to check this out properly....
Also what about the Francis I found on IGI, listed as a female christening.... Are we right here?? I only wonder because it was from his/ her christening that I got to Charles B and Martha Jones....if IGI IS right then we must be looking at the wrong Francis....or maybe they were into cross dressing in Derby in the 1790's!!!!
Hope I'm not muddying waters....
Simon

Derek

Derek Report 2 Dec 2009 14:03

Hello Simon.........the two Francis (female) entries are submitted entries..therefore suspect.........and show Charles and Martha as parents....BUT..

there is another EXTRACTED entry for 15.5.1785 showing the birth of Francis (male) at St.Werbergh's Derby..parent Francis and Hannah Brentnall.haven't found their marriage yet..but will!!

Extractes entries on IGI tend to be more reliable becasue they are extracted from parish records, whereas submitted are always suspect, sometimes wrong, and quite often totally false....
EDIT 14.06.........JEEZ!! have now come up with an IGI entry for FRANCIS BRENTALL (MALE!!!) baptise 13.11.1757 son of William and hannah..buried 11.12.1803..married ANN GAWTHORNE 03.07.1792........
Derek


Simon

Simon Report 2 Dec 2009 16:51

WOW Derek this is crazy!! How many Francis Brentnall's can there have been Derby at more or less the same time and of both sexes!!!
It's getting a bit confusing.... Looking at Thomas B's wedding cert, given that he was 25 on the day of his marriage June 5th 1860, then he was obviously born between June 6th and Dec 31st of 1835. Looking at the 1841 census the only Thom. B I can find who fits the frame and is son of Francis places his father DoB firmly in 1795. Then going back to 1795 we both hit the dubious Francis entries, but your new Francis seems to be by my reckoning 10 years ahead of his namesake.....
But Francis married Ann Gawthorne in 1792, son of Francis born 1757, grandson of William and Hannah. Gaw blimey!! If this is right then we've struck gold.... What do you think?? It seems almost to good to be true!!
I await your thoughts with bated breath!!
Mean while will busy myself with Francis and Ann G I know I've seen them somewhere before..
Simon

Simon

Simon Report 2 Dec 2009 17:26

Found them (Francis and Ann Gawthorne)in Pallot, he has him down as a Publican, which ties in somehow as the family was in the brewing trade thru out the 19th C.... Now we just drink the stuff....

Derek

Derek Report 2 Dec 2009 19:30

Hi Simon..I think you can forget the Female Francis entries..except as incidentals.......William and hannah had at least FOUR children one of whom WILIIAM died in infancy..this direct from Parish records
CHARLES 06.02.1754
FRANCIS born 1755 baptised 1757
WILLIAM born and died 1756


I think FRANCES and HANNAH are in fact FRANCES and ANN Gawthorne..becasue there is no other marraiage for hiom and because Ann and Hannah were very much interchangeable in the 18th century..which has caused me umpteen problems in my own family research.

I also think that they has children befroe they married in 1792:

Children of Francis and Hannah:
LYDIA 28.07.1787
FRANCIS 15.05.1785

The BROTHER of Francis ie.CHARLES 1754 married MARTHA JONES 05.09.1784 and had the following children:

CHARLES 15.05.1785
James 1786
THOMAS 24.12.1789

The births are fact.the premarital behaviour of Francis and Hannah(Ann?) are "enlightened suggestion" !!!!!!!!!!

I have found most of the Brentnalls who ever breathed..from Stockport to Ilkeston Heanor and Burton on Trent!!..with any luck i have them back to 1608..........
But that is for another day!!!

Derek

Simon

Simon Report 3 Dec 2009 21:50

Hi Derek
Thanks you so much for all of that.... There is a lot to think about.... I did find the following out that William B was born 10 March 1733 (poignant that is my birth date....) as we know in Denby, his Hannah was called Longdon and they married at Duffield on the 2nd of Feb. 1761.... I came across a very detailed listing of the Brentnalls in the late 16th century, to the mid 18th- dates places of birth, marriage death children etc, who ever did it obviously did their home work...
So now it's down to cross referencing and seeing what ties in where..... Quite a lot to do
In the meantime do keep me posted with any tid bits on the Brentnalls that you might have...
Simon

Derek

Derek Report 3 Dec 2009 22:18

Hi Simon.........was going to tell you about William brentnall 1733 Duffield.married Hannah Longden...........this is yor link back to 1608...........but William married Hannah 1762.........ooops..

Simon

Simon Report 4 Dec 2009 07:28

Hi Derek...............Yes that is a big oops......... William B marr Hannah L in Duffield 1761/2, Francis B son of William B and Hannah B born 1757......where on earth does that leave us????? More illegitimacy in the family??
Am clueless Simon

jerseylily

jerseylily Report 4 Dec 2009 10:35

Hi Derek

Do you remember me congratulating myself on noting down all the information you'd sent me before your thread disappeared? Well - I missed a bit :-(

You had found the first wife and parents of Anthony Hinds born c1810 Markeaton, Derby. Is there any chance that you still have the information handy? I'll be really grateful if you can re-send it.

His 2nd marriage was to Emma Ballington, 28/6/1841 at St Alkmund and his father was Anthony Hinds, pensioner, deceased.

Sorry about this

Pam

Julia

Julia Report 4 Dec 2009 13:44

Derek, so sorry to read your original thread has disappeared, but you seem to have come back as big as ever. It is a shame, because of all the informtion you managed to find for people, to say nothing about all those trips up to Matlock. A bit cold for that now eh. But it won't stop you and your good works. Keep it up
Simon- for the record, Denby is about 4/5 miles from Heanor, but Heanor comes under the Basford, Nottingham registration district.

Seasons Greetings To All
Julia in Derbyshire

Simon

Simon Report 4 Dec 2009 15:02

Thanks for that Julia, every little bit helps as they say.... It looks like I am going to spend my "ski holidays" (yes they actually do have them here, though I don't ski much myself... ;-) ) in Derbyshire records office chasing up loosish ends, like those nuisance Francis's..... Can anyone (Derek....) advise on how to start?? Another family to chase up too as my mothers younger sister would like to know more about her mothers side of the family.... Now Church Gresley used to be in Derbyshire didn't it??.... Oh blimey here we go again!!!
Greetings all
Simon

Derek

Derek Report 4 Dec 2009 15:55

Hi Simon..Church Greasley IS in Derbyshire.and i have the Parish records!!......and matlock is a nightmare..The records office i mean..I go there quite often, so let me do your donkey work.....
..and Julia..Hello...Re Basford District...this is a continuous thorn in my flesh. It appeasrs in the earlier Census Records as such....it almost ALWAYS means the Ilkeston area...in Derbyshire.and yes Heanor and Loscoe and Ripley.....whether these places were at one time in Notts i don't know....but as a general rule Basford District means Ilkeston.........unless of course the entry is for somewhere that is clealry in Nottingham area..........like BASFORD lol which is exactly where i live!! Hoho!!

Derek

Derek

Derek Report 4 Dec 2009 15:58

Hello Pam..guess what!!!! you'll have to send me the enquiry all over again, because everything i found for you was on the lost Thread.

sorry

Derek

Julia

Julia Report 4 Dec 2009 16:15

Derek, I am Heanor, and registered at Basford. However, many certificates can be obtained from the Ilkeston Registry Office. I and OH needed some copies for pension purposes a couple or so years ago, and got them from Ilkeston. By the way, you may also like to know that Langley Mill, although it has had a Nottinghamshire post code for as long as anyone alive can remember, is actually in Derbyshire. Info. may help you in the future.
Seasons Greetings
Julia in Derbyshire

Derek

Derek Report 4 Dec 2009 16:30

Hi Julia....I did know becasue I have the parish records..and yet Eastwood just across the A610 is in Notts......boundaries are i suppose there to be moved..a bit like goal-posts!!...Nice to hear from you,,,,,and Season's greetings to you too.

Derek

Julia

Julia Report 4 Dec 2009 16:41

Derek, as I have stood here, doing my food prep. for tomorrows mammoth cook-in. I have been giving these things abit of thought.
Heanor used to have it's own town hall, still does, but in a non fuctioning sort of way. It used to hear some minor court cases, but above all, it was a Registry Office, being a sub-division of Ilkeston, hence my being registered there, but coming under Basford, if that makes some sense. At the same time as my father was registereing me, a distant relly, was also registering his child, and they lived in Loscoe. So they were covered by Basford also.
But, I am not sure about beyond Loscoe to say Codnor and Ripley. I have a feeling a similar situation may have been in existence in Ripley, and people may have been registered under Belper. I think those around some of the Alfreton area also came under Belper, and I know of someone in the 1970's, from the Shirland area who was married there There certainly was a Registry Office there, but not sure if that has now come under Matlock.
I suppose at the time, the poweres that be knew what they were doing, but it sure as hell gives us genealogists a head ache these days.
If ever you want to ask me anything, please contact me.
Julia in Derbyshire

Derek

Derek Report 5 Dec 2009 19:13

Hi Gooner......better result today!!

I've been thinking......are we looking for a Gilbert that never existed???

Have found a Gilbert Measham b 1788 St.Werbergh Derby..married Sarah Cotton Derby 19.04.1813..and another that married at Manchester Cathedral 1831......no evidence that either of these were ever near Repton..

We are looking for a Widower who married Wodow parker 13.09.1831.

only two candidates at repton..well one really....Gilbert measham 1776..who married mary Meakin 05.10.1801.........do we know when she died?????????

His father Gilbert who married Elizabeth Stanley 1772 is surely too old to remarry in 1831???? or maybe not.so when did Elizabeth die????

and Gilbert 1814 certainlt ain't going to be a widower at age 17!!


Looking for a Widow Parker who might qualify is one Ann Hodgkinson who married Robert Partker 13.04.1794.........but only if she was mary Ann Hodgkinson........

I can see a trip to matlock coming up to look at some deaths!!!..

My feeling is that the mysterious Gilbert is staring us in the face........unless he came from Derby!!!!

Derek

Derek

Derek Report 5 Dec 2009 23:27

Hi LA...unfortunately Mary Meakin didn't die till 1860.......but there is a family tree on Ancestry which shows Gilbert Measham aged 17 marrying the gay widow Parker...........and having a nursery full of kids......trouble is that Gilbert in shown as a widow in the Repton marriages.at 17????? not on your bleedin' life!!
Another visit to Matlock appears inevitable.........OH S..T !!!!l lol

Derek