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Enie D N Forder

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ProfilePosted byOptionsPost Date


rootgatherer Report 24 Feb 2012 11:50

Sorry, I should have posted this too Stuart.

Deaths Dec 1917 Gordon Norman C 0 Lambeth 1d 364

That is probably why you hadn't heard about Norman.

Well done Lucy, hopefully Brooklands may have some information on S F Gordon.

I just don't know why we aren't seeing a death for him.

I posted that Alexander one in case the middle name was Forbes and he may have been known as Sandy but it really is clutching at straws - big time!


Lucy Report 22 Feb 2012 13:55

just to add to this ruby was born a year later than dudley on rubys birth certficate as dudley gordon just to add to the confusion I have e mailed brooklands musuem and attached the picture asking for any information on stewart forbes gordon aka dudley hopefully their archieves come up with something :-)


Stuart_Dudley_Gordon Report 21 Feb 2012 19:32

Thank you Maureen and Rootgatherer :-).

Before I go and clean my camera kit and then start packing, I have to say that I have absolutely no knowledge of…

Births Dec 1917 Gordon Norman C Carash Lambeth 1d 422

This certainly is a quest with so many variables!

When I return from India I will try and find an old book that I remember from my childhood, where my grandmother made some notes on places she had visited in Scotland after she was first married – from memory there were no personal names, just place names, but maybe there’s more (perhaps dates). I’ve been looking for it for nearly an hour without success, but I still have several boxes from my mother’s house clearance to look through.


rootgatherer Report 21 Feb 2012 17:13

Hope you enjoy your trip Stuart.

I doubt that we will lose interest so easily as this has been such an interesting quest!

Now just to recap (as there are so many pages on this thread), here are the Gordon / Carash births.

Births Dec 1913 Gordon Dudley B Carash Lambeth 1d 829

Births Dec 1914 GORDON Ruby G Carash Lambeth 1d 745

Births Dec 1917 Gordon Norman C Carash Lambeth 1d 422

So, I am thinking that may help to establish S F Gordon's death - unless of course he wasn't the father of Norman?

I think that we have been doing the same searches Maureen but so far, not coming up with any possiblities!! We probably need to remember though that we have been unable to track down a Gordon / Carash marriage. We also know that Ruby's family were a little difficult to track down i.e. Carash / Meiklewright senario of Ruby's father!


Deaths Jun 1918 Gordon Alexander F 39 Eastry 2a 1269

Wonder what the "F" stands for?


MaureeninNY Report 21 Feb 2012 14:16

I have to chuckle. I think rootgatherer and I were probably doing the same futile searches yesterday/today.

Stuart-it really is the inconsistency that makes this very difficult.

Do have a wonderful trip!

Kind regards,


Stuart_Dudley_Gordon Report 21 Feb 2012 12:08

Thank you very much indeed for your continued efforts in tracking down our ancestors.

My wife and I are off on a tour of Northern India starting tomorrow so I doubt I’ll have any reasonable Internet access for a couple of weeks … so please do not think I’ve lost interest, I will be back!

Over the last few days I’ve been mulling over the facts surrounding my paternal grandfather.

My understanding from conversations with my mother was that his name was Stewart Forbes Gordon (as per the family photographs).

However, on my father’s marriage certificate it is shown as Dudley Stewart Gordon (Deceased) whereas on my father’s birth certificate it is shown as Dudley Gordon.

The only consistency is the profession: Consulting Engineer.

Given the family’s habit of randomly using middle names as first names and then leaving them off certificates (writing down whatever their preferred known as name was at the time), this makes it quite difficult to even know what name to look for on the death certificate.

Then to compound matters there are three distinct possibilities for my grandfather’s date of death…

My father’s date of birth 14 Oct 1913 plus:

a. 8 to 9 months: June 1914 - as per the interval between my birth and my father’s death (as my mother always said he was about the same age when his father died)

b. 14 months: December 1914 - based on the original writing on the back of the photograph

c. 24 months: October 1915 - based on the scribbled change

By then Brooklands was in use as a recuperation centre for wounded officers – but I would not be surprised if occasional private racing events continued.

Incidentally from the time my son (Stephen James Gordon) was about 8 months old through to his second birthday I was a little more careful than normal – I did not want to tempt fate!


rootgatherer Report 21 Feb 2012 11:18

That could be interesting Rose.

Can anyone see a death registation for S F Gordon around the time that Stuart thinks he died in the accident at Brooklands? I am blowed if I can see it or am I just missing it? That would be the first step in trying to get a possible year of birth for him. I also had a look on Scotlandspeople for the possible Gretna marriage but I don't see one.

Rambling Rose

Rambling Rose Report 21 Feb 2012 10:50

This message has been added on the FB Genes page, so I'm just passing it on

"Hello there, i`ve been following a thread on Genes, on the `Find Ancestors` board, entitled `Enie D N Forder`
I noticed today in Family History Monthly magazine, there is 4 page article on Brooklands Museum.
One of the posters on the thread has been trying to trace more info on her ancestor who was a racing driver at Brooklands.
Thought it might be useful but i don`t have a current subscription. Would someone pass on the details for me? Thank you"


Stuart_Dudley_Gordon Report 18 Feb 2012 15:14

As you will have gathered by now my grandfather died when my father was a baby, and then my father died before my first birthday ... hence Gordon family knowledge is from my mother's memory and old photographs.

My mother passed away last year (96 years old) hence my having several family certificates readily to hand whilst I have been dealing with her affairs.

Then when I needed my father’s place of birth for my India Visa application I obtained a copy of his birth certificate – that was a challenge as his age was misstated on his marriage certificate by a year and in the newspaper obituary by two years (and the newspaper also stated he was born in France!). My father finished his education at art college in Paris but he was born in London. Never trust what you read in the newspapers.

I recall my mother saying that Dorothy’s first husband was quite a few years older than Dorothy, but no exact number was ever mentioned … my guess based on the fact they ran away to get married, when she was still in her mid teens, would be 5 to 10 years older.

I have never known his place of birth.


MaureeninNY Report 18 Feb 2012 14:26

That was rootgatherer who posted the census,I think? I posted the death which looks like the same fellow so I don't think he's correct.



Quoy Report 18 Feb 2012 14:16

George Cosmo Gordon
Birth 1848 in Westminster St Georges
Death 27 Apr 1919 in Gillingham, Kent, England

and his spouse

Elizabeth Susannah Glennie
Birth 13 Dec 1846 in Cabrach, Banff, Scotland

tthis family goes with the census you posted above


MaureeninNY Report 18 Feb 2012 14:12

Thanks,Lucy! Something to go on...

Quoy-sorry I use Ancestry Library Edition and it doesn't let you look at trees. I could try through Mundia if you give me a name to look for.



Lucy Report 18 Feb 2012 13:58


I have the picture Stuart sent me, this states S.F Gordon at the wheel of number 9 winner of the flying 3 miles july 7th 1909 if this helps

I am also digging to



Quoy Report 18 Feb 2012 13:56

Hello Maureen

have a look at this tree on Anc


MaureeninNY Report 18 Feb 2012 13:44

SFG is driving me crazy!

I don't think he's the Gillingham fellow as this looks like his death:
England & Wales, Death Index: 1916-2005 about Stewart F G Gordon
Name: Stewart F G Gordon
Birth Date: abt 1888
Date of Registration: Oct-Nov-Dec 1962
Age at Death: 74
Registration district: Shrewsbury
Inferred County: Shropshire
Volume: 9a
Page: 168
I don't quite know what to make of this in relation to how SFG was supposed to have died:

"In 1914 the start of the First World War brought a temporary end to the use of Brooklands as a motor racing circuit and the entire facility was handed over to the War Office. It became a centre for recuperating wounded officers who quickly set up their own motorcycle race meetings purely for the military."

Back to the kitchen for more coffee!

Maureen :-)


Lucy Report 18 Feb 2012 13:42

My great auntie Norma will be giving you an e-mail tomorrow she has lots of questions she would like to ask, she finds this all overwelming and is so pleased to find a first cousin, the story of her dad johns garage made her laugh!!
Your nan had sent little presents over the years to norma.

Do you know a rough date your grandad was born so i can try and search for him and an area that he was from or lived in?

It would be a great help so i can start finding out about the gordon side

We have traced back your nans side to candada as you can see from the thread but drew a blank with your grandad

Was your grandad a racing driver for a long time, i cant find anything on brooklands, surrey history about him, what sort of racing was it?

This will just help in trying to find his birth certificate so i can eliminate other people

Many Thanks


Stuart_Dudley_Gordon Report 18 Feb 2012 13:31

Hi Lucy,

I would really appreciate a copy of Dorothy’s birth certificate and I’ll find you some photographs of Dorothy and Hans … may not be for a few weeks though as I’m in the office catching up with work this weekend, getting ready for our trip to India next week.

The photos span quite a few years; my first visit was by train when I was 19/20 years old. Then there was a gap of a few years when I lived in Botswana, visiting with Angela on our overland trip back to the UK. Then I worked in Liberia and used to call in on them most trips (as I flew with Swiss Air via Geneva once or twice a year).

In 1980 a few weeks after the coup d'état in Liberia, I visited them along with my wife Angela and children – so they did meet their great grandson Stephen James Gordon.

Whilst I was living in Botswana (early/mid 1970s) my mother and her sister visited Dorothy and Hans … I think that was the one and only time they had seen one another in person since Dorothy and Hans moved to New York!

Incidentally when they moved to New York they had to work to earn a living – Dorothy was the ladies fashion buyer at Saks on Fifth Avenue and Hans worked at a Diamond Merchants. They retired to Switzerland on their USA pensions, of course over time the US Dollar weakened against the Swiss Franc so that must have impacted them. Hans had some amazing family/friend connections, he became the accountant at the Luzern Transport Museum … this was very beneficial in terms of keeping active, top up income and free transportation tickets – trains, funiculars, cable cars – I think we have been up and down every mountain in the Luzern area.

Please feel free to ask any questions, I’ll do my very best to help.


Quoy Report 18 Feb 2012 13:29

Cosmo's marriage to Dora

LDS Microfilm #1795037
Natal Marriages

Entry #1314
Husband: Cosmo Charles Glennie GORDON
Wife: Dora Margaret SMITH
Date: 12/6/1902


Quoy Report 18 Feb 2012 13:20

Hello Lucy

yes same family but with another son
Cosmo, what a fab name ,or to give him his full title

Cosmo Charles Glennie Gordon

Cosmo Charles G Gordon
Oct 1872 - Alverstoke, Hampshire

and here he is in 1911 following in his fathers footsteps

Cosmo Cherles Glennie Gordon
Age in 1911: 38
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1873
Relation to Head: Head
Gender: Male
Birth Place: Gosforth, Hants Alverstoke on the image
Civil parish: Warwick St Mary
County/Island: Warwickshire
Country: England
Street Address: 37 Victoria Street Warwick
Marital Status: Married
Occupation: Marter Master Serjeant Royal Enginers
Cosmo Cherles Glennie Gordon 38
Dora Margaret Gordon 33

married 8 years no children

and his death in 1950
Cosmo C G Gordon
abt 1873
Jun 1950 - Chatham, Kent, England


Lucy Report 18 Feb 2012 13:13

hi quoy

Is this related to Sturart F Gordon as above?

Many Thanks