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William Holyome 1880/1890 - 1962?

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ProfilePosted byOptionsPost Date

Flick

Flick Report 31 Dec 2011 18:19

Not sure why he used Henry as a second name on his wedding day..................especially as he actually signed the register

val1963

val1963 Report 31 Dec 2011 18:22

Gavin


Happy New Year


Val

Gavin

Gavin Report 31 Dec 2011 18:23

hmmmm, different age and different middle name...... is it the right person??

Flick

Flick Report 31 Dec 2011 18:42

Births Jun 1912 (>99%)
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Holyome William H Walter Bethnal G. 1c 307

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Births Mar 1914 (>99%)
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HOLYOME Elizabeth V Walter Shoreditch 1c 187

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Births Sep 1921 (>99%)
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Holyome Ivy M Walter Hackney 1b 964

Flick

Flick Report 31 Dec 2011 18:46

You'd be well advised to invest in Ivy's birth cert

Gavin

Gavin Report 1 Jan 2012 17:17

Flick

So on the births information you have William H Holyome born in Bethnal Green (mothers maiden name as Walter) So that would indicate his name was William Henry Holyome..... which is the name his father was using when he married Lily Walter (according to the certificate).
The birth information of the William who married Lily shows his name would have been William Robert Holyome (matched to birth and death records for the period)
So, why would he use the name Henry on his marriage certificate and then name his son with the same name.... if he was actually William Robert? Any idea's?
Can we be sure they are the same person.... all the certs seem to tie up but it doesnt make sense.

Flick

Flick Report 1 Jan 2012 22:26

You refer to the 'certs'...but I don't think you have actually got them.

He could have given his father's second name as his own in error.............nervousness, perhaps?

As advised above......Iv'ys birth cert is a necessity, if you wish to trace the line accurately. Or her marriage cert, to establish who she said her father was..................

I'm not able to say whether the info I found relates to one person, or two. I just find the info and post it for your evaluation, as does anyone else on here

Good luck with your quest

Flick

Flick Report 1 Jan 2012 22:33

This is the one born in 1881................couldn't have fathered Ivy

Name: William H Holyome
Birth Date: abt 1881
Date of Registration: Apr-May-Jun 1917
Age at Death: 36
Registration district: West Ham
Inferred County: Essex
Volume: 4a
Page: 338

So you can rule out this famliy

Name: William H Holyome
Age: 10
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1881
Relation: Son
Father's Name: William Holyome
Mother's name: Joyce S Holyome
Gender: Male
Where born: Bethnel Green, London, England

Civil parish: Leyton
Ecclesiastical parish: All Saints
Town: Leyton
County/Island: Essex
Country: England


Registration district: West Ham
Sub-registration district: Leyton
ED, institution, or vessel: 14
Neighbors: View others on page
Piece: 1345
Folio: 48
Page Number: 16
Household Members: Name Age
William Holyome 40
Joyce S Holyome 40
Alice S Holyome 14
Florence A Holyome 13
William H Holyome 10
Arthur G Holyome 6

For William and his widowed mother Joyce (who died 14/7/1917) Administration was granted to Arthur G Holyome.
William's address was the same as his mother's

Gavin

Gavin Report 2 Jan 2012 08:43

magnificent Flick.... thank you so much.

Gavin

Gavin Report 2 Jan 2012 08:58

So, that now discounts William Henry Holyome from 1881.

Leaving William Robert Holyome 07/06/1889 who has the correct parentage but seems to have lied about his age and middle name on his wedding certificate to Lily Mary Walters.

William and Lily had 4 children (according to my relatives), Ivy, William, Albert and Elizabeth...... would any of their marriage certificates reference their fathers name?? It could clarify if he continued to use Henry as his middle name or referred back to his real name of Robert.

Thanks

Flick

Flick Report 2 Jan 2012 12:55

As per my earlier message, Ivy's marriage cert will include her father's name......as she knew it.

I offered a possible explanation for the age quoted by William on his marriage cert.

It may also be that he didn't like Robert as a name, and preferred to use Henry.

It's perfectly legal to call onself whatever one chooses, as long as no intent to deceive or defraud is involved

Flick

Flick Report 2 Jan 2012 12:59

Deaths Dec 1922 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Holyome Lily M 35 Hackney 1b 474


Did William marry again?

Buying his death cert might prove helpful - for the informant's details

Gavin

Gavin Report 2 Jan 2012 17:07

Hi Flick

Yes I believe he did marry again.... someone named Susan we believe.

I am doing all of this remotely, once home I will invest in the certs to prove things out... this is to give the clearest options before spending too much on certs.

Thank you

Gavin

Gavin Report 17 Feb 2013 16:26

looking for information on Lily Mary Walter b1886

Gavin

Gavin Report 17 Feb 2013 18:38

update on this thread;

Married in the Parish Church of St. mary of Etm (probably short for Edmonton), Middlesex
April 16th, 1911
William Henry Holyome aged 26, polisher, Father's name : Thomas Holyome, Carman
Residence: 12 Chapman Road
Lily May Walter aged 24, no profession, Father's name : John Walter, deceased
Residence: 12 Chapman Road
Witnesses: Francis Herbert and Elizabeth Herbert

His death cert reads William Robert Holyome died 16th Sept 1962

According to his living relative (grand-daughter), she recalls the confusion where William always thought his middle name was Henry, however the family did have his birth cert at one point and corrected him by confirming it was actually Robert, which was used on his death cert. So it is the same person.

Also, he also married again;
His second marriage was to Susan Line on the 12th Sept 1942 at the registry office in the district of Romford, county of Essex

His age then was 56 and Susan was 50
His address at that time was 24 Powell Gardens , Dagenham
And Susan's was 500 Heathway, Dagenham

His father was Thomas Henry Holyome (deceased and he was a carman upholsterers)
Susan's father was William Hammond (deceased, general labourer)
Witnesses were : Joseph James Trinder and Lillian Reynolds

I noticed on an earlier post there is a reference to a Joyce 'S' Holyome... this could be Susan using her middle name, I am having her cert checked by relative.

Also, it is known that Susan had 12 children... so the name 'Line' could be a previous marriage because her birth certificate shows she was a Hammond;

Susan's birth cert reads:
Registration District: Stepney, birth in the sub district of Ratcliff in the county of London

Date of birth 2nd Dec 1891 at 10 Dorset Street
Father: William Hammond - bricklayer, labourer
Mother: Susan Hammond formerly Fletcher

Gavin

Gavin Report 17 Feb 2013 18:39

also, Lily Mary Walter, may have an Italian link in her history...... her family are conviced they are from Italian decent...

Gavin

Gavin Report 17 Feb 2013 19:01

Further update, from the grand-daughter of William Holyome and Lilly Walter;

Mum (Ivy May Holyome) used to tell us about her grandmother (probably the one we think is of Italian decent) that she chased her husband with a carving knife but somehow had him put into an asylum (should have been her put away by the sounds of it).
Her grandmother then had a manfriend who lived with her but according to mum he wasn't allowed out of the bedroom, presumably because of the shame of living with a man and not being married. She obviously hadnt divorced her first husband who was put away.

My grandfather used to deliver fuel by horse and cart and one of the places he delivered to was the asylum. One day he and another man were delivering fuel and my grandad was talking to one of the inmates when his friend asked him if he knew this inmate and my grandfather said yes it was his dad. I dont know if he visited him from time to time or if he was just delivering the fuel and recognised his father.

Wonder where this will lead us....

UPDATE: all of this was in London....

Chris Ho :)

Chris Ho :) Report 17 Feb 2013 19:03

Name: Lily May Walter
Record Type: Baptism
Baptism Date: 14 Nov 1886
Father's Name: John Walter (Boot Laster)
Mother's Name: Elizabeth Victoria Walter
Parish or Poor Law Union: Hackney Wick
Borough: Hackney
Register Type: Parish Registers
(address, 27, Wick Road)

Chris :)


Births Dec 1886 (>99%)
------------------------------------------------
Walter Lily May Hackney 1b 602

Gavin

Gavin Report 17 Feb 2013 19:19

Hi Chris..... I am a pain arent I.... still its better than the Sheffield Whites..

Just you wait... my paternal gradmother was a White before she married so another line of Whites to search... :-D

The post above... could be lily Mary.... seems right.

So at least we now have Elizabeth Victoria Walter to search... she is the one we believe is from Italian stock...

Gavin

Gavin Report 17 Feb 2013 19:21


Births Jun 1867 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
1c 204

Elizabeth Victoria Walter

Shoreditch

She would only be 19 ish when she had a child...

UPDATE: I am stupid... she wouldnt be a Walter at birth... DOH