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And this birth for the brother


Births Mar 1901
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Haynes Philip John Pontypridd 11a 632


But yes, the certificate to be sure

Just popped back..........

I think you are on to a winner there Alviegal!!!

Guess it's all down to the MC Gins as is so often the case.
I hope margaret will let us know the outcome if she sends away for it.

***alviegal*** you might have a point

There is no birth for Elizabeth in Neath, other than the one that has already been posted?

Births Jun 1912 (>99%)
Reeves William F Haynes Pontypridd 11a 1004
Births Jun 1914 (>99%)
REEVES Thomas H Haynes Pontypridd 11a 1135

I know it doesn't look very promising for this family but Elizabeth Jane is recorded as being married.
I don't suppose the parents could have entered her name down because she is their daughter even though she was married and living elsewhere? Her surname is put down as Haines.
Fred's place of birth has changed.



1911 census transcription details for: 14 River Row Treorci Rhondda
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National Archive Reference:

RG14PN32340 RG78PN1853A RD589 SD4 ED12 SN33
Reg. District: Pontypridd
Sub District: Rhondda
Parish: Rhondda
Enum. District: 12
Address: 14 River Row Treorci Rhondda
County: Glamorganshire
Name Relation Condition/
Yrs married Sex Age Birth Year Occupation Where Born
HAINES, Fred Head Married M 39 1872 Underground Helcher Somerset Weston England
HAINES, Ann Wife Married F 38 1873 Llanelly Glamorgan
>>HAINES, Elizabeth J Daughter Married F 20 1891 Neath Glamorgan
HAINES, Fred Son Single M 15 1896 Coal Miner Hewer Treorchy Glamorgan
HAINES, Phillip Son M 10 1901 School Treorchy Glamorgan
HAINES, Tommy Son M 8 1903 Treorchy Glamorgan
HAINES, Annie Daughter F 5 1906 Treorchy Glamorgan
HAINES, Willie Son M 2 1909 Treorchy Glamorgan

Thanks Brummiejan - calling it a day now (well an afternoon anyway) - must go and think about what the evening meal is going to be !!

Oh dear - nothing for it but the marriage cert then. I agree it's very annoying when you have a fairly distinctive name to look for - she might at least have the grace to be easy to find!
Jan

Have looked for the 'Hynes' family with Fred as head and daughter Elizabeth J. Found the family on 1911 census - spelt Haines - and daughter Elizabeth J is aged 20 and still at home whereas my Elizabeth Jane Haynes is already married to Thomas Reeves with a baby daughter. Back to the drawing board !!! Thanks again everyone.

1881 census transcription details for: 8, Savours Court, Neath
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National Archive Reference:
RG number: RG11
Piece: 5341
Folio: 24
Page: 16
Reg. District: Neath
Sub District: Neath
Parish: Neath
Enum. District:
Ecclesiastical District:
City/Municipal Borough:
Address: 8, Savours Court, Neath
County: Glamorganshire
Name Relation Condition Sex Age Birth Year Occupation , Disability Where Born
GOWMAN, John Head Married M 35 1846 Laborer In Colliery
Northam, Devon
GOWMAN, Jane Wife Married F 35 1846 Laborers Wife
Neath, Glamorganshire, Wales
GOWMAN, Eliza Daughter Single F 13 1868 Scholar
Neath, Glamorganshire, Wales
GOWMAN, William Son Single M 11 1870 Scholar
Neath, Glamorganshire, Wales
>>GOWMAN, Ann Daughter Single F 9 1872 Scholar
>>Llanelly, Carmarthenshire, Wales
GOWMAN, Thomas Son Single M 7 1874 Scholar
Neath, Glamorganshire, Wales
GOWMAN, Josiah Son Single M 4 1877 Scholar
Neath, Glamorganshire, Wales
GOWMAN, Jane Daughter Single F 1 1880 Laborers Daur
Neath, Glamorganshire, Wales



1891 census transcription details for: 2, Cornish Court, Neath
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National Archive Reference:
RG number: RG12
Piece: 4462
Folio: 161
Page: 13
Reg. District: Neath
Sub District: Neath
Parish: Neath
Enum. District: 24
Ecclesiastical District: Neath
City/Municipal Borough: Neath
Address: 2, Cornish Court, Neath
County: Glamorganshire
Name Relation Condition Sex Age Birth Year Occupation , Disability Where Born
GOWMAN, John Head Married M 44 1847 Labourer In Shipyard
Neath, Glamorganshire
GOWMAN, Jane Wife Married F 44 1847
Neath, Glamorganshire
GOWMAN, Josiah Son M 15 1876
Neath, Glamorganshire
GOWMAN, Jane Daughter F 13 1878
Neath, Glamorganshire
GOWMAN, John Son M 7 1884
Neath, Glamorganshire
GOWMAN, Mary Daughter F 4 1887
Neath, Glamorganshire
GOWMAN, William Son Single M 22 1869 Coal Miner
Neath, Glamorganshire
>>GOWMAN, Ann Daughter Single F 20 1871 General Servant Domestic
Neath, Glamorganshire

Well, the Elizabeth J. Haynes birth i put above is almost certainly her wouldn't you say?
Jan

??



England & Wales, FreeBMD Marriage Index: 1837-1915 about Frederick Haynes
Name: Frederick Haynes
Date of Registration: Apr-May-Jun 1891
Registration district: Pontypridd
Inferred County: Glamorgan
Volume Number: 11a
Page Number: 645
Spouse: Ann Gowman

Yes Brummiejan - I will have to send for the marriage cert. Why it is driving me mad is because each time I embark on a line - or twiglet - I seem invariably to have to end up buying umpteen certificates. Just for once I wish I could just have a line which goes smoothly and slots into place. It would make a pleasant change but then again most of us I know have to end up getting certs just to establish one single name. Thank you everyone for your help.

There is no birth for an Eliz* J Hynes

If you are still unsure, buy the marriage cert - always best to do this anyway

Strugging to find that family as Hynes or Haynes in the 1911.

I have to do the school run so will pop back later.

But why is it driving you mad? If you don't already have it you can get her marriage cert.
Jan

Ah - perhaps I should now start trying for an Elizabeth Jane Haynes with a birth year of 1892 and not 1890. She must have told a 'porkie' on the census return. I'll give it a go. Thank you.

I did come across that one Prickly Holly but was unsure about it once I saw how clearly Hynes was written on the original document. This is driving me mad !!

Births Jun 1892 (>99%)
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Haynes Elizabeth Jane Neath 11a 828

?

Births Jun 1892 (>99%)
Haynes Elizabeth Jane Neath 11a 828