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Help please, I'm looking for my great grandparents

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ProfilePosted byOptionsPost Date

Philip

Philip Report 25 Jan 2013 17:28

rootgatherer, I haven't been able to find any information about where and when John died through Scotlands People nor the UK research sites. I haven't been able to find them in the 1901 census either, heaven knows where they were.

rootgatherer

rootgatherer Report 25 Jan 2013 12:07

Where did the John Cox born 1898 die please? He presumably died before they named another son John in 1911.


I don't see them in 1901 either.

Just in the passing the district that they married would be Dennistoun not Dennistown. Dennistoun is easy walking distance from Calton where New Street was.

Philip

Philip Report 25 Jan 2013 12:06

Got to go out now, will log back in later.

Philip

Philip Report 25 Jan 2013 12:03

I saw that Thomas was living with his grandmother in 1901 but was unable to find either John or Lucy on the 1901 census.

Philip

Philip Report 25 Jan 2013 12:00

Hi rootsgatherer

That looks like the George mentioned on the census, I shall have to apply for the certificate. I have heard of the Mitchell Library but wasn't aware that they held such records, looks like I may have to make a visit. Thanks for your help.

rootgatherer

rootgatherer Report 25 Jan 2013 11:59

Have you found John and Lucy on the 1901 census please?

Lucy's son Thomas is with his grandmother.

1901

Name: Thomas H Mooney
Age: 5
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1896
Relationship: Grandson
Gender: Male
Where born: Glasgow, Lanarkshire
Registration number: 644/4
Registration district: Calton
Civil parish: Glasgow St Luke
County: Lanarkshire

Address: 39 New St

ED: 21
Household schedule number: 48
Line: 4
Roll: CSSCT1901_281
Household Members:
Name Age
Lucy Mooney 59 b. Ireland
Thomasina Mooney 21 b. Glasgow
Thomas H Mooney 5
Mary Petrie 20 Boarder

rootgatherer

rootgatherer Report 25 Jan 2013 11:43

Have you looked at the Poor Relief records in the Mitchell Library in Glasgow please?

These records are indexed and often give lots of information and they may well give the birthplace of John Cox.

rootgatherer

rootgatherer Report 25 Jan 2013 11:39

?????

Births Mar 1902 Cox George Leonard Redruth 5c 178

Philip

Philip Report 25 Jan 2013 11:30

Thanks MarieCeleste, I hadn't thought of that.

Stuart, details writen on the certificates of the number of birth that I have:

1896: 7th March, 39 New Street Glasgow - Thomas Holmes Mooney (Illegitimate), mother Lucy, no father mentioned

1898: 8th June, 39 New Street Glasgow - John Cox, mother Lucy, father John Cox, Contractors Engine Driver

1903: 4th November, City Poorhouse, Glasgow - Thomasina Cox, mother Lucy, father John Cox, water pipe layer, living at 39 New Street, Glasgow

1908: 14th March, 28 Strathearn Road, Sinclairtown, Dysart - Elizabeth Ann Cox, father John Cox, coal miner, mother Lucy

1913: Lydia KIrk Mooney Cox, unfortunately there is no image of her birth certificate, but I got this information from the GROS Data 440/00 0011

1915: 4th December, Muttonhall Cottages, Kirkcaldy - Christina Kirk (Ilegitimate), father Andrew Kirk, Miner (Private 1154 National Reserve), mother Lucy widow of John Cox, Miner, who died 4 years ago at Leslie

1917: 23rd April, Muttonhall Cottages, Kirkcaldy Parish - Catherine Brown Kirk (Illegitimate), father Andrew Kirk, Miner, mother Lucy Mooney or Cox widow of John Cox who died 6 years ago at Leslie - Catherine was my mother

On the 1911 census at South Walkerton, private house are:
Lucy Cox, head, aged 35, born Glasgow
Thomas Mooney, son, aged 15, coal miner drawer, born Glasgow
George Cox, son, aged 9, scholar, born Rosecroggan, Cornwall
Elizabeth Ann Cox, daughter, aged 3, born Fife, Kirkcaldy
John Cox, son, aged 3 months, born Fife, Leslie

I did log onto an Irish genealogy site and entered John and Eliza's names but nothing came up, although I haven't discounted that they may have married in Ireland.

Likewise I entered George's name to see if I could get a match for a birth in Cornwall, again nothing came up.

rootgatherer

rootgatherer Report 25 Jan 2013 11:21

Just to clarify, Philip was not saying that deceased persons attended the marriage. Scottish marriage certificates name BOTH parents and give the mother's maiden surname. It is also usual to note if the parents were deceased.

Stuart

Stuart Report 25 Jan 2013 11:10

Above family in 1881 - but would have expected younger children to be at home, so don't think your family
1881 census transcription details for: 128, Harmony Row, Govan

National Archive Reference:
RG number: RG11 Piece: 6461 Folio: 33 Page: 45
Reg. District: Govan Church Sub District:
Parish: Govan Enum. District:
Ecclesiastical District: City/Municipal Borough:
Address: 128, Harmony Row, Govan
County: Lanarkshire
Name Relation Condition Sex Age Birth Year Occupation , Disability Where Born
COX, John Head Married M Power Loom Tenter England
COX, Eliza Wife Married F 50 1831 Dressmaker England
ROBERTSON, John C Grandson M 4 1877 Ayr, Ayrshire

1871 - 4 Marr Street, Govan with daughter Martha aged 17, all born England. He's a Power Loom Tenter

Marriage Martha Cox to ___ Robertson 1874 Lanarkshire, Govan

Stuart

Stuart Report 25 Jan 2013 10:49

Closest I can get to an Innkeeper for a John Cox with wife Eliza. She could have had a child mid 1870's

1891 census transcription details for: King Street, Eastwood, Pollokshaws

National Archive Reference:
RG number: RG12 Piece: 562 Folio: 7 Page: 9
Reg. District: Eastwood Sub District: Parish: Eastwood Enum. District: 7
Ecclesiastical District: City/Municipal Borough:
Address: King Street, Eastwood, Pollokshaws
County: Renfrewshire
Name Relation Condition Sex Age Birth Year Occupation , Disability Where Born
COX, John Head Married M 59 1832 Wine & Spirit Merchant England
COX, Eliza Wife Married F 59 1832 Wife England
ROBERTSON, Eliza Granddaughter Unmarried F 12 1879 Scholar Ayr, Ayrshire

Stuart

Stuart Report 25 Jan 2013 10:31

On an earlier post you state "On other birth certificates I have for further children Lucy had she states that she is the widow of John Cox who died in 1911, again I can't find any record of his death".

Can you give the information from these birth certificates please - seems rather odd if she named him as father after he was dead, or is a father not named?

Also, who else is on the 1911 census with Lucy - you have only given a reference number - and what are their details?

Could John Cox and Eliza Newberry have married in Ireland and that is why we haven't found them? John could have most recently been an Inn keeper, but that isn't necessarily what he may be found as on a census.

Haven't discounted John Cox junior, the soldier in Maryhill Barracks on the 1891 census as Lucy's husband, despite a year or so difference in age. Can't find an obvious service record for him unfortunately.

MarieCeleste

MarieCeleste Report 25 Jan 2013 08:28

Just a thought, although Lucy is stated as a widow in 1911 it doesn't necessarily mean that she was. Many women described themselves as such rather than admit their husbands had deserted them.

Off to work now but will look later.

Philip

Philip Report 25 Jan 2013 00:24

MarieCeleste, I haven't been able to find Lucy on the 1901 census, only her mother, Lucy Mooney, her sister Thomasina, and her son Thomas, aged 5.



Philip

Philip Report 25 Jan 2013 00:13

I'm really sorry that I seem to be confusing everyone and not giving the info you need, your responses are coming in thick and fast, for which I'm really grateful and I'm obviously not keeping up with them. I'll try and answer all your questions.

John Cox is aged 22 on the certificate and he is noted as a contractors engine driver. Lucy is aged 21 and is noted as a laundress.

The 1911 census - is this what you are looking for as I can't copy and paste the whole page.

No Year Surname Forename Sex Age District City/
County GROS
Data Image Extract
1 1911 COX LUCY F 35 KINGLASSIE /FIFE 440/00 002/00 035

Many, many thanks for your help and patience!

Stuart

Stuart Report 24 Jan 2013 23:41

This COX death is the only one that comes up in 1911, when stating Scotland as place of death. No further details showing
Registration event: death

Name: COX
Date of death: November 1911
Age:
Place of death:
Place of birth:
Belonging to service:
Ship's name: Toronts
Series: BT334 - Registers and Indexes of Births, Marriages and Deaths of Passengers and Seamen at Sea
Box: 0050
Page:

MarieCeleste

MarieCeleste Report 24 Jan 2013 23:41

Philip - do you have them on the 1901 census?

Philip

Philip Report 24 Jan 2013 23:37

Thanks Stuart, this Lucy is the bride on the certificate I have, it seems that John and his family are being difficult to find.

Stuart

Stuart Report 24 Jan 2013 23:29

Scotland's People shows only 1 Lucy Mooney born 1870-1882
This narrows down to 1876 in Lanarkshire