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Charles Martin and George Martin

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ProfilePosted byOptionsPost Date


stephen Report 23 Aug 2013 16:05

We are trying to find more about two of our grandfather's brothers - Charles and George Martin. According to the 1911 census they lived at 112 Longfellow Road, Walthamstow, London.

George was single at the time and 28 years old. Charles was 32 and married to Frances aged 29. They had four children - Charles, Francis, Lily and Frances. Both brothers were sons of William Martin and his wife Emma (nee Reader). At that time, Charles was employed as a waterworks engineer.

The family was previously at 13 Felton Street, Hoxton and if anybody has any later info on them or their families we would love to hear from you.


AnnCardiff Report 23 Aug 2013 16:12

difficult as 1911 was the last census


MarieCeleste Report 23 Aug 2013 19:03

Hello Stephen, have you used the Search Trees facility to see if anyone else is researching them?


GlitterBaby Report 23 Aug 2013 21:08

Have you managed to work out the full names of the children listed on 1911 census

One possible as Walthamstow comes under West Ham

Births Dec 1910 (>99%)

MARTIN Frances E W. Ham 4a 408

Did Charles or George have any middle names ?


Reggie Report 23 Aug 2013 22:10

Have you tried looking for info yourself?


Reggie Report 23 Aug 2013 22:13


1911 census

Person: MARTIN, Frances Address: 112 Longfellow Road Walthamstow

MARTIN, Charles Head Married M 32 1879 Waterworks Engine Stoker London Hoxton VIEW
MARTIN, Frances Wife Married7 years F 29 1882 London Waterloo VIEW
MARTIN, George Brother Single M 28 1883 Carter Essex Walthamstow VIEW
MARTIN, Charles Son M 6 1905 London Hoxton VIEW
MARTIN, Francis Son M 4 1907 Essex Leyton VIEW
MARTIN, Lily Daughter F 2 1909 Essex Leyton VIEW
MARTIN, Frances Daughter F 0 (6 MONTHS) 1911 Essex Walthamstow

Marked As Answer Marked as Answered


Reggie Report 23 Aug 2013 22:25



Name: WEBSTER, Francis Emily
Registration district: Ipswich
County: Suffolk
Year of registration: 1988
Month of registration: June
Date of Birth:26 September 1910
Volume no: 10
Page no: 2541
Reg no: 688

Name: HURST, Lily Esther
Registration district: Maidstone
County: Kent
Year of registration: 1988
Month of registration: September
Date of Birth:14 January 1909
Volume no: 16
Page no: 1177
Reg no: 988


stephen Report 23 Aug 2013 22:39

the reason why we try to get information through genes reunited is because the only thing we have to go on is often quite old information and we cant get access to later census records etc for example if i ask if someone is a descendent of someone born in 1900s they are likely to know through family hearsay pass ons legacies etc also we didnt know until recently even the names of our grandfathers relatives because he changed his name so any amount of info is welcome short snappy comments arent


GlitterBaby Report 23 Aug 2013 22:45

What short snappy comments ?


Reggie Report 23 Aug 2013 22:46

If you hope for links on GR................look in 'search all trees'

............people using the boards are very unlikely to be in any way connected

And comment re the info posted would be good......................

No-one can access censuses after 1911..........we all have to research using freebmd....................

The fun of FH is trying to do it could start by finding the births of the children for full name info


GlitterBaby Report 23 Aug 2013 22:53

Name: George Stanley D Hurst
Birth Date: 19 Jul 1906
Date of Registration: Mar 1979
Age at Death: 72
Registration District: Ipswich
Inferred County: Suffolk
Volume: 10
Page: 2947

Could be the husband of Lily

The marriage is on FreeBMD


Reggie Report 23 Aug 2013 23:00

Exactly, GlitterBaby.................


GlitterBaby Report 23 Aug 2013 23:08

Have you checked if Charles and Frances had more children after 1911

Think the two births in 1913 and 1914 belong to another couple

Have you looked at military records to see if either served during WW1 etc etc


GlitterBaby Report 23 Aug 2013 23:18

Name: Frances Gertrude Sandford
Record Type: Baptism
Baptism Date: 28 Mar 1880
Father's Name: John Sandford
Mother's Name: Caroline Sandford
Parish or Poor Law Union: Horselydown St John
Borough: Southwark
Register Type: Parish Registers

Born 11th Feb

Might help you find her death record


HeyJudeB4Beatles Report 24 Aug 2013 08:21

Military record of the man married to Frances Gertrude

Name: Charles Martin
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1879
Age at enlistment: 18
Birth Parish: Bermondsey
Birth County: Surrey
Document Year: 1897
Regimental Number: 13172
Regiment Name: Army Service Corps
Number of images: 5 children listed. Born Bermondsey. Father James...mother Letitia? Brother William James Sisters Louisa and Elizabeth (all listed as nok)

In short the family in 1911 are not the family of William and Emma??????



HeyJudeB4Beatles Report 24 Aug 2013 08:26

This is the Charles that married Frances

Name: Charles Martin
Age: 3
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1878
Relationship to Head: Son
Father: James Martin
Mother: Lucretia Martin
Gender: Male
Where born: Bermondsey, Surrey, England
Civil Parish: Bermondsey
County/Island: London
Country: England
Street Address: 78 Lynton Rd

Employment status:

View Image
Registration District: St Olave Southwark
Sub-registration District: St James Bermondsey
ED, institution, or vessel: 22
Neighbors: View others on page
Piece: 570
Folio: 70
Page Number: 16
Household Members:
Name Age
James Martin 37
Lucretia Martin 37
James Martin 17
Saml. G. Martin 16
Albert E. Martin 14
Lucretia Martin 13
Henry Martin 11
William Martin 9
Joseph Martin 6
Elizabeth Martin 4
Charles Martin 3
Thomas Martin 1

So to go back to basics...who was your grandfather? How have you connected to Charles and George (other than the 1911 census)?



stephen Report 24 Aug 2013 09:58

Our Grandfather was William Martin. Born 1881 Camberwell. We know all about him. Charles and George were his brothers. We know when and where they were born. Charles in 1879 and George in 1883 - both at Hoxton. In 1891 the Martin family was living at 13 Felton Street, Hoxton.

They were still there in 1901 but by 1911 they had split up with Charles having married Frances and his family living at 112 Longfellow Road, Walthamstow where his brother George was living with them. We are trying to find any further info as to what happened to them after 1911.

We fully realise that 1911 was the last published census but there are other records such as electroral rolls etc that I dont have access to - but others may. We were merely hoping that someone might have that information and, if so, they could pass it on to us. So far, we have found them only on one other tree on Genes, and have been in contact. There are some others on Ancestry but they have got no further than us.

As far as middle names go. Charles had a second initial "J" but we dont know what it stood for. George had no other name.


Reggie Report 24 Aug 2013 10:13

Look for his birth...........

Do some research isn't difficult to use freebmd

And kindly acknowledge the post-1911 info posted on here


stephen Report 24 Aug 2013 10:35

Reggie, I really don't understand what you are trying to say!

We have done lots of research and arrived where we are now. BMD also told us who Charles married and we know all about the births of his family. We have done all that is possible within the scope of Genes membership and are merely asking if anyone has come across anything else.

If you dont wish to be helpful please refrain from tetchy comments!

Yes we are grateful for the post 1911 info that has come from other members but it takes time to check it out before replying.


GlitterBaby Report 24 Aug 2013 10:59


You are really not helping by making such remarks as "tetchy comments" and "short snappy comments"

The members that help on the boards are just members the same as you.

We ask questions to try and help with other members research and do like them to be answered.

Sometimes a thank you goes a long way.

The Charles on the 1911 census married without a middle initial so I think some of your research is wrong.

Just for info
Name: Charles Martin
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1878
Age: 25
Spouse Name: Frances Gertrude Sandford
Spouse Age: 23
Record Type: Marriage
Event Date: 17 May 1903
Parish: Bermondsey St James
Borough: Southwark
Father Name: James Martin - deceased
Spouse Father Name: John Hugh Sandford
Register Type: Parish Register

So I think you must go back to the drawing board and revise your research on this because as at the moment you are wasting our time.

Glitter Baby