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hi can anyone please help me with an entry on ancestry,i dont have the world access,there is a baptism for ernest edward philbrick on there he was born kroonstad south africa, 13 april 1892 according to his merchant navy papers the brith date is the same given on the 1939 census. im hoping to get more info from the baptism entry, fingers crossed,many thanks x

I have world access, but I'm afraid I'm not seeing that baptism on Ancestry at all.


1939 for our reference only:

Ernest E Philbrick
in the 1939 England and Wales Register
Name: Ernest E Philbrick
Gender: Male
Marital Status: Single
Birth Date: 13 Apr 1892
Residence Date: 1939
Address: 67
Residence Place: New Forest, Hampshire, England
Occupation: Fireman & Greeset Atundale Ca?? 1-9-39 No 1053659
Line Number: 25
Schedule Number: 81
Sub Schedule Number: 4
Enumeration District: EEOG
Borough: New Forest
Registration district: 96-2
Household Members Age
George H Gravett 55
Lavinia Gravett 54
Frederick G Gravett 15
Ernest E Philbrick 47

There are several travel records for him, between Southampton and New York, as a fireman on ships.

Ah, is this the one you mean?


If so, it's the baptism of a daughter of a different (older) man of the same name:

Alice Mabel Philbrick
in the South Africa, Birth and Baptism Records, 1700s-1900s
Name: Alice Mabel Philbrick
Baptism Age: 0
Event Type: Baptism
Birth Date: 27 Sep 1899
Baptism Date: 29 Oct 1899
Baptism Place: South Africa
Father: Ernest Edward Philbrick
Mother: Alice Rebecca
Church: St. Mark's District Six
Officiant: W L Clementson
Witness 1: Joseph Stoker
Witness 2: Annie Stokker
Witness 3: Maggie Reynolds
Collection: St. Mark's District Six Baptisms, 1877 - 1915

First name(s) Ernest Edward
Card type CR1
Last name Philbrick
Archive The National Archives
Birth year 1892
Series BT349
Birth date 13 Apr 1892
Date range 1921-1941
Birth place Kronstadt So Africa
Record set Britain, Merchant Seamen, 1918-1941
Birth county/country -
Category Education & work
Event year 1921
Subcategory Merchant Navy & Maritime
Discharge number 1053659
Collections from Great Britain, UK None

There is a photo of him on an ID document dated 1918 on FMP
Nationality: British
Father's Nationality: British

The space for NoK is blank

Deaths Mar 1963 (>99%)
PHILBRICK ERNEST E 67 NEW FOREST 6B 631

Marriages Mar 1946 (>99%)
Gravett Lavinia Philbrick Southampton 2c 178
Philbrick Ernest E Gravett Southampton 2c 178

If he knew his father's name, it will be on the marriage cert - assuming he didn't invent onel

Deaths 1985 (>99%)
PHILBRICK LAVINIA 3JA1886 SOUTHAMPTON 20 1685

Marriages Mar 1906 (>99%)
CHIVERS Lavinia Southampton 2c 46
GRAVETT George Henry Southampton 2c 46

FMP version of 1939 - slightly more accurate transcription ;-) ;-)

67 Sylvia Crescent, Totton, New Forest R.D., Hampshire, England
George H Gravett 22 Sep 1884 Male Cleaner S S Aqutanid 7 4 39 No 734907 Married 81 1
Lavinia Philbuck (Gravett) 03 Jan 1885 Female Unpaid Domestic Duties Married 81 2
Frederick G Gravett 23 Oct 1924 Male Gardener Single 81 3
Ernest E Philbrick 13 Apr 1892 Male Fireman & Greaser Arundale Cas Single 81 4

He's in a tree on Ancestry - no info other than his name and DoB

The marriage of the parents per the baptism record

Name Ernest Edward Philbrick
Age 25
Birth Year (Estimated) 1868
Spouse's Name Alice Rebecca Melville
Spouse's Age 17
Spouse's Birth Year (Estimated) 1876
Marriage Date 16 Oct 1893
Marriage Place Bloemfontein, Orange Free State, South Africa
Marriage Place (Original) Bloemfontein

alice mabels parents

Name Ernest Edward Philbrick
Age 25
Birth Year (Estimated) 1868
Spouse's Name Alice Rebecca Melville
Spouse's Age 17
Spouse's Birth Year (Estimated) 1876
Marriage Date 16 Oct 1893
Marriage Place Bloemfontein, Orange Free State, South Africa
Marriage Place (Original) Bloemfontein
Ernest Edward Philbrick's Spouses and Children
Alice Rebecca Melville
Spouse
17

Just because it came up.....................

Marriages Mar 1892 (>99%)
CURTIS Mary Elizabeth Epsom 2a 3
Philbrick Alice Maud Epsom 2a 3
Philbrick Ernest Edward Epsom 2a 3
Sharp Matthew Isaac Epsom 2a 3

SHARP, JOHN CURTIS
GRO Reference: 1894 D Quarter in EPSOM Volume 02A Page 1
SHARP, MATTHEW CURTIS
GRO Reference: 1896 D Quarter in EPSOM Volume 02A Page 9

Name Mary Selina
Baptism Date 04 Feb 1903
Baptism Place Cape of Good Hope, South Africa
Second Parent's Name Alice Rebca Philbrick
Entry Number 3964
Page 376
Event Place Cape Town, St John
Parent Name Ernest Ed Philbrick

from a tree on ancestry

ernest edward 1868
Birth
abt 1868

189224
Marriage
13 Jan 1892 • Benhilton, All Saints, Surrey, England
Alice Maude Philbrick

(1863–1892)

189224
Departure
15 Jan 1892 • Southampton, England

189224
Birth of daughter Gertrude Sarah Philbrick(1892–)
07 Nov 1892 • South Africa

189224
Death of wife Alice Maude Philbrick(1863–1892)
18 Nov 1892 • South Africa

189325
Marriage
16 Oct 1893 • Free State, South Africa
Alice Rebecca Melville

(1877–)

189931
Birth of daughter Alice Mabel Philbrick(1899–1953)
27 Sep 1899 • South Africa

189931
Residence
29 October 1899 • City Gates Cape Town

190234
Birth of daughter Mary Selina Philbrick(1902–1993)
26 Dec 1902

190739
Arrival
14 Sep 1907 • Southampton, England

190739
Departure
19 Sep 1907 • Liverpool, England

195385
Death of daughter Alice Mabel Philbrick(1899–1953)
1953 • Ryde, New South Wales, Australia
Departure
Liverpool, England
Departure
Durban, South Africa
Divorce
Alice Rebecca Melville

(1877–)
Residence
Kroonstadt, South Africa

Marital Status: Widower

no mention of a son

As that couple had a daughter in November 1892 (presumably the mother died as a result) they can’t have had a son in April 1892.....and there is no record anywhere of their having done so.

He was stated as widower

Ernest Edward Phillbrick
Gender: Male
Age: 25
Marital status: Widower
Record Type: Marriage
Birth Date: abt 1868
Residence Place: Kroonstadt, South Africa
Marriage Date: 16 Oct 1893
Marriage Place: Bloemfontein, Free State, South Africa
Marriage Place Notes: Cathedral of St Andrew & Michael
Parish as it Appears: Bloemfontein
Spouse: Alice Rebecca Melville
Occupation: Railway Guard
Collection: Bloemfontein: St Andrews Marriages, 1850-1938
Archive Name: Anglican Church Archives Wits
Page Number: 89
Entry Number: 326

First wife

Alice Maude Philbrick
1863–1892
BIRTH ABT 1863 • Gosport Hampshire England
DEATH 18 NOV 1892 • South Africa



Name: Alice Maude Philbrick
Gender: Female
Age: 29
Birth Year: abt 1863
Marriage Date: 13 Jan 1892
Marriage Place: Benhilton, All Saints, Surrey, England
Parish as it Appears: Benhilton
Father: George Edward Philbrick
Spouse: Ernest Edward Philbrick


Name: Alice Maud Philbrick
Gender: Female
Baptism Date: 6 Dec 1863
Baptism Place: Holy Trinity, Ryde, Hampshire, England
Father:
George Edward Philbrick
Mother:
Sarah
FHL Film Number: 1470883
Reference ID: item 12 p 112

Ernest senior and first wife ("Mrs Philbrick") travelling to SA two days after their wedding:

Ernest Philbrick
in the UK and Ireland, Outward Passenger Lists, 1890-1960
Name: Ernest Philbrick
Gender: Male
Departure Age: 26
Birth Date: abt 1866
Departure Date: 15 Jan 1892
Departure Port: England
Ship Name: Nubian
Destination Port: Cape
Master: G M Molony


Their daughter Gertrude Sarah was born on 7 November 1892 (a tree on Ancestry
- Malott Family Tree - has an image of the birth record.

I suppose it's just possible that they could have had a son in April 1892, if Alice had become pregnant again almost immediately, and if Gertrude was born prematurely.

Just because I've been idly fiddling with this family - though I expect Jacqueline knows all this:

Ernest Edward senior and his first wife Alice Maud(e) were first cousins.
Their fathers George Edward (1832) and Edward (1843) were brothers -

sons of John Fillbrock/Fillbrook/Philbrick and Jane Salter.

Jane married three times -

1822 to George Saunders (he died 1828), 1831 to John Fillbrooks (died 1843) , 1857 to Charles Williams.

She was born c1807, although the censuses say c1808-11.

Ernest Edward senior and his first wife Alice Maud(e) were first cousins.
Their fathers George Edward (1832) and Edward (1843) were brothers -

sons of John Fillbrock/Fillbrook/Philbrick and Jane Salter.

Jane married three times -

1822 to George Saunders (he died 1828), and had a daughter Emma c1824; 1831 to John Fillbrooks (died 1843) , 1857 to Charles Williams.
She's listed as Mary Williams in 1861.
She may still be alive in 1881, listed as Mary Williams, living in St Mary Newington, London.

Jane Salter
in the England & Wales, Christening Index, 1530-1980
Name: Jane Salter
Gender: Female
Christening Date: 15 Feb 1807
Christening Place: Godshill (near Newport), Hampshire, England
Father: James Salter
Mother: Elizabeth Salter


Jane Saunders
in the England, Select Marriages, 1538-1973
Name: Jane Saunders
Gender: Female
Marriage Date: 29 Sep 1831
Marriage Place: Brading, Southampton, England
Spouse:
John Philbrooks
FHL Film Number: 1596473
Reference ID: #257


Jane, Widow Filbrook
in the England, Select Marriages, 1538-1973
Name: Jane, Widow Filbrook [Jane, Widow Salter]
Gender: Female
Marriage Date: 15 Aug 1857
Marriage Place: Newchurch, Hampshire, England
Father: James Salter
Spouse: Charles Williams
FHL Film Number: 1596476
Reference ID: p 159


PHILBRICK, EDWARD mmn SAUNDERS
GRO Reference: 1843 D Quarter in ISLE OF WIGHT Volume 08 Page 235


George Edward Fillbrook
Principal
England, Hampshire Bishop's Transcripts 1680-1892
Baptism15 April 1832
Brading, Hampshire, England, United Kingdom
FatherJohn Fillbrook
MotherJane Fillbrook

you are all amazing,thankyou all so much, im sorry i havent been on iv had 2 small grandchildren all wk and have been collapsing into bed after they had gone home,lol, edward was a second husband to my lavinia, i have his photo already from the navy paper and stuff from when he was with lavinia, i didnt have anything to do with southafrica or his parents etc, so well done everyone and thankyou once again, im on it today :) xx :-)

argyllgran i ndidnt have any of the filbrook info, thankyou, ernest gave his yr of birth as 1892 but on the death record it states he was 67 birth yr 1896, but the only things i csan find are what we all hav found ,the navy record and 1939 censuss wchich gave 1892 .its weird not to find him on any other census at all