Genealogy Chat

Still trying to find my grandmothers birth. I have a birth/baptism on 13 Sept 1877 at St Lukes Middlesex and a birth Oct 1877 at Holborn London. Before I order the cert do you think they could be one of the same. The Holborn birth is Q4 1b/815. The baptism is on 4 Nov 1877 at St Clement, City Road. The baptism shows the parents as Edward & Mary Anne. My grandmothers father is listed as Harry James Board Wills. If someone knows those areas they may be able to help me as I have no idea . Thanks

Civil Registration event: Birth

Name: WILLS, Harry James Board
Registration district: Cheltenham
County: Gloucestershire
Year of registration: 1856
Quarter of registration: Oct-Nov-Dec
Mother's maiden name: Not available before 1911 Q3
Volume no: 6A
Page no: 324

Civil Registration event: Death

Name: WILLS, Harry J B
Registration district: Swansea
County: Glamorganshire
Year of registration: 1919
Quarter of registration: Jan-Feb-Mar
Age at death: 63
Volume no: 11A
Page no: 1499

Civil Registration event: Marriage

Name: WILLS, Harry James B
Registration district: Derby
County: Derbyshire
Year of registration: 1882
Quarter of registration: Apr-May-Jun
Spouse's last name: Not available before 1912
Volume no: 7B
Page no: 847
MarriageFinder: Harry James B Wills married one of the following people:

GORDON, Mary Jane
WARNER, Frances Ann
ROBINSON, Samuel

Can't find them with a daughter Sophia Jane?

1891 census transcription details for: 27, Kensington Gardens, Kings Norton, Balsall Heath

National Archive Reference:
RG number: RG12
Piece: 2353
Folio: 9
Page: 12
Reg. District: Kings Norton
Sub District: Kings Norton
Parish: Kings Norton
Enum. District: 26
Ecclesiastical District: St Pauls Balsall Heath
City/Municipal Borough:
Address: 27, Kensington Gardens, Kings Norton, Balsall Heath
County: Worcestershire
Name Relation Condition Sex Age Birth Year Occupation , Disability Where Born
WILLS, Harry Head Married M 34 1857 Photograph Artist
Cheltenham
WILLS, Mary Wife Married F 32 1859
Derby
WILLS, Mabel Daughter F 6 1885
Derby
WILLS, John Son M 4 1887
Derby
WILLS, Arthur M 1 1890
Derby

If you do not know the areas then just use an internet map service, e.g. google maps:

https://maps.google.co.uk/

And use 'get directions' to input Holborn and St Clements Church City Road to see where they both are, and how close together.

(Reference)
Sophia Wills (Born 13 Sept 1877)
Baptism Date:4 Nov 1877
Father's Name:Edward Wills (Boot Maker)
Mother's Name:Mary Anne Wills
Parish or Poor Law Union:St Clement, City Road
Borough:Islington
(abode, Whitecross Court, Whitecross Street)


1881
WILLS, Edward Head Married M 52 1829 Boot Maker
Maidstone, Kent
WILLS, Mary Ann Wife Married F 51 1830
Lambeth, Surrey
WILLS, Alfred Son Single M 17 1864 Printer (Out Of Employ)
Lambeth, Surrey
WILLS, Arthur Son Single M 15 1866 Printer (Out Of Employ)
Poplar, Middlesex
WILLS, Alice Daughter Single F 8 1873 Scholar
Holborn, Middlesex
WILLS, Sophia Daughter Single F 3 1878
St Lukes, Middlesex
Piece: 365
Folio: 69
Page: 33
Registration District: Holborn
Civil Parish: St Luke
Municipal Borough:
Address: 1, White Horse Court, St Luke
County: London, Middlesex


Birth Year1877Event Quarter4 (are you using GR Birth Search)

If you use http://www.freebmd.org.uk/cgi/search.pl then you can click on Holborn and see details of area.

Chris :)

Child Surname Child Forename Father Surname Mother Surname Mother's Former Name Year District Office Register Entry
WILLS Harry J B WILLS WILLS BOARD 1856 Cheltenham Cheltenham, Cheltenham 35 235

http://ww3.gloucestershire.gov.uk/bmd/


1861
WILLS, Ann Head Married F 32 1829 ... Cleaner
Huntspill, Somersetshire
WILLS, Harry S(J) B Son M 4 1857 Scholar
..., Gloucestershire
WILLS, John H Son M 2 1859
Clifton, Gloucestershire
ROSS, Clara Servant Unmarried F 11 1850 House Servant
Bristol, Somersetshire
Piece: 1727
Folio: 101
Page: 9
Registration District: Clifton
Civil Parish: Clifton
Municipal Borough: Bristol
Address: 7, Mall Place, Clifton, Bristol
County: Gloucestershire


Year:1882
Forenames:Harry James Board
Surname:WILLS
Spouse Forenames:Mary Jane
Spouse Surname:GORDON
Place:Derby
Description:Holy Trinity
County:Derbyshire
Country:England
Reg Office:394
Register Entry:DHT/02/070
Record source:Derbyshire Registrars Marriage Index

1881 (noticed another below?)
SMITH, William Head Married M 48 1833 Builder
Alvaston, Derbyshire
SMITH, Annie Wife Married F 44 1837
Alvaston, Derbyshire
SMITH, Louisa J Daughter Single F 19 1862
Boulton, Derbyshire
SMITH, Annie S Daughter Single F 17 1864
Boulton, Derbyshire
SMITH, Catherine J Daughter Single F 12 1869 Scholar
Boulton, Derbyshire
SMITH, Henry H Son Single M 9 1872 Scholar
Boulton, Derbyshire
WILLS, Sophia J Visitor Single F 3 1878
London, London, Middlesex
Piece: 3388
Folio: 86
Page: 3
Registration District: Shardlow
Civil Parish: Boulton
Municipal Borough:
Address: ?, Boulton
County: Derbyshire

Chris :)

Been out for a couple of hours with the dogs.

This is harry in 1871

1871 census transcription details for: Maldon Rd, St Pancras


National Archive Reference:
RG number: RG10
Piece: 240
Folio: 87
Page: 15
Reg. District: Pancras
Sub District: Kentish Town
Parish: St Pancras
Enum. District: 20
Ecclesiastical District:
City/Municipal Borough:
Address: Maldon Rd, St Pancras
County: London, Middlesex
Name Relation Condition Sex Age Birth Year Occupation Where Born
WILLIS, John H Head M 35 1836 Gloucestershire
WILLIS, Harry J B Son M 14 1857 Gloucestershire
WILLIS, John K Son M 12 1859 Gloucestershire
WILLIS, Ann Wife F 44 1827 Somerset
WILLIS, William P Son M 9 1862 Kent
WILLIS, Charles A Son M 5 1866 Middlesex
BOARD, Sussanna Mother-In-Law F 77 1794 Somerset
BOARD, Susan Son-In-Law F 53 1818 Somerset

In 1881 he is noted as widower and is in Derby

1881 census transcription details for: 57, Bloomfield St, Litchurch


National Archive Reference:
RG number: RG11
Piece: 3403
Folio: 88
Page: 10
Reg. District: Derby
Sub District: Derby
Parish: Litchurch
Enum. District:
Ecclesiastical District:
City/Municipal Borough:
Address: 57, Bloomfield St, Litchurch
County: Derbyshire
Name Relation Condition Sex Age Birth Year Occupation , Disability Where Born
ROBINSON, Sarah Head Widow F 50 1831 Dress Maker
Derby, Derbyshire
ROBINSON, Sarah Daughter Single F 16 1865 Household Duties
Derby, Derbyshire
ROBINSON, William Son Single M 9 1872 Scholar
Derby, Derbyshire
ROBINSON, John Son Single M 6 1875 Scholar
Derby, Derbyshire
CHRISTIAN, William Boarder Single M 18 1863 Horse Keeper
Belper, Derbyshire
WELLS, H B Boarder Widower M 24 1857 Photographer
Cheltenham, Gloucestershire
KIDDY, Mary A Daughter Married F 27 1854 Dressmaker
Belper, Derbyshire
KIDDY, Francis F G Grand Son Single M 0 1881
Derby, Derbyshire

http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/boards/board/ancestors/thread/1324883

http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/read/Middlesex_County_UK/2013-03/1363524226
(looks to relate (edits, has already be added on above)

Chris :)

Thanks. I suspect that Sophia was illegitimate. The only evidence of her father being Harry James Board Wills is on her marriage cert.

it's a very strange name to pluck out of the blue. She must have known his name for some reason.

http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/boards/board/tips_board/thread/1333105

Does her death certificate from 1931 Australia give her date of birth?

My guess would be that the birth certificate for Holborn would be the same Sophia Wills who was baptised at Islington. Especially as there's no mention of her having the middle name of Jane.

Thanks. Only her age is on her death cert. On my mothers birth cert Sophia's place of birth is 'Western Grove London" Have been unable to find such a place. Maybe that was what she was told. I am of the opinion that her mother is Louisa Jane Smith. She lived with the Smith family and they in turn raised her illegitimate son Henry Inniss. I have only just found paperwork of the estate of Annie Sarah Stewart nee Smith (louisa's sister) and in it she left money to my mother, her two brothers and a legacy to Henry. Maybe Sophia was registered under a different name but after much searching have been unable to find anything. From the C 1881 where Harry boarded and the Smith family lived was not that far away. If anyone has any ideas as to where to look next please let me know. Many thanks

Do you have the marriage cert for harry in 1882,to see if it says he was a widower?

Try as I might I can't find another marriage for him, although it states he is a widow on 1881 census in Derby.

There is a Sophia Jane Hewson born O/N/D 1877 registered in Kensington London.
No other records of her after that.

Maryb.

Thanks Mary. In the 1881 census he is listed as a boarder - thought maybe if he said he was a widower he would be more acceptable. I also found the Hewson birth and wondered?? Previously Reggie said 'bet she was not born in London'
I guess if that was what she was told then that is what she believed. I have even searched all the Smith family for some clue. Also searched William Smith's brothers to find a female that could be her mother - no luck. Maybe she was not registered at all. Even if I purchased the Hewson birth cert I don't know what that would prove unless of course the fathers name is listed. Anyone else with a suggestion?? Many thanks

Hi. With info to hand I have deducted that Sophia was born between 1 April 1877 (census date) and 13 August 1877 which helps somewhat. On checking births have found a Sophia Jane Hallows born Q2 1877 Ecclesall B. 9C/372. I'm unable to find
any other records for her. If my grandmother (Sophia Jane Wills) was indeed adopted by the Smith family in Derby and changed her surname I may be on to something. Can anyone find any records at all for a Sophia Jane Hallows?
Does anyone have any other suggestions. Thanks Valda

I think Sophia Jane Hallows was the daughter of Sarah Hallows who married Richard Marsden at the end of 1877.
She shows on the 1881 Census as Jane and the 1891 as Sophia Jane.