General Chat

Historic England often helps with the financing of heritage building repair and restoration regardless of who owns the property. Fairly obviously owners and insurance companies have to bear a good part of the cost.

https://historicengland.org.uk/

Although the Hampshire Bere Mill is grade II the key issue from HE point of view is the making of bank notes there. They will be looking for what potential there might be for not only restoring the mill but also elements of the paper making process.

On this basis HE put a v sig chunk of funds into restoring to working order the water mill in Christchurch, Dorset which otherwise would have collapsed. They also shelled out for the nearby C19 bandstand.

The alterations at Bere Mill are very extensive and the original point of the buildings is not at all obvious. If public funding is to be made available for restoration - and I hope it is - then no doubt purpose and access will be issues.

Old buildings and electricity just don't get on. I have rewired our house in France ( built C15 ) so as to eliminate potential fire raising events but it was very expensive and extremely difficult. When the work is done there is nothing much to show for it but switches and sockets which look like any other. Here or in France you tend to get to know the conservation people very well. They love spending other people's money.

Could be interesting as it was a family home before the fire, and as I questioned before how badly was it damaged from what I'm reading it might be beyond repair; I hope not. Their butchers is still open this weekend though as it was in a separate building.

As Caroline and I have both said, and you have acknowledged - it was a private building, 'restored' way beyond it's original purpose, and not open to the public.
As for the cause of the fire, no immediate cause has been given - to 'suppose' it's the electricity is a bit of a wild guess.
I'm sure the owners followed all electrical regulations, as set down by English law.

Maybe they even employed a qualified electrician to do the job......

why should the usage of a listed bhulding as a home be a consideration in whether to use public funds to help with the restoration? A silly idea and fortunately not policy.

Given the degree of destruction to Bere Mill and the lack of physical connection to its interesting history I fear that restoration is unlikely. It is a very long way from that to planning permission for a replacement building being granted. There are several examples in Hampshire where after serious fires planning permission for replacement was refused on a permanent basis. In any event nothing much visible will happen during 2018. The loss adjusters won't hang around though.

Electrical faults are the cause of most serious building fires whether the building is old or new. In the case of old buildings just following regs will for sure not leave you well protected.

Leaving aside listed buildings there are two common and dengerous situations often found in UK residential homes but hidden until there is a fire.

All domestic wiring should be replaced on a 30 year cycle. This rarely happens, vendors might fit some nice looking socket covers but that's about it. A variation of this problem is rubber insulated wiring designed for 120v going back as far as the 1930s sometimes.

The second common problem is the English use of what is called "the ring main". It is only used for single phase domestic wiring in the UK, Eire, Hong Kong, Gib and assorted colonies. At one time it was used in Cyprus. Implementing a ring main is a criminal offence in the USA, France and most of the EU. The main advantage of a ring main is a big saving in cost at the price of a serious reduction in safety. A properly installed ring main on a new build is usually ok. The problem is that time passes. If you want to have a bleat about how wonderful ring mains are do a bit of research first.

Even in the UK ring main installations are not compulsory.

Completely avoidable but increasingly common is the practice of pluggng gang sockets into more gang sockets until there is a festoon of connections all going back to one 13 amp plug. Aaaaaaaaagh!

An associated problem is leaving phone chargers etc on all night. This is risky with OEM units plain dumb with cheap replacements from eBay or the High St. As well as fires several people have been killed by non compliant chargers.

"why should the usage of a listed bhulding as a home be a consideration in whether to use public funds to help with the restoration? A silly idea and fortunately not policy."

Well at least this is about the topic of the thread.....

I think it's a consideration otherwise who's going to pay for a new home for the family, one which they'd like to keep in the same place as their business is there. It's not been a mill for many years can't see it happening.....but then what do I know :-D

Rollo, you say:
"Given the degree of destruction to Bere Mill and the lack of physical connection to its interesting history I fear that restoration is unlikely"

Which, if you had read any of the other threads, is what has been said by others all along! But I suppose we should be grateful our input has been verified by yourself - eventually. All's apparently well with the world.
Unfortunately for you, I don't simper when I've been mansplained.

As for the 'information ' about electrical things - thanks. (Yawn)
Nothing to do with the thread, and I feel capable of looking it up myself if ever (never) I decide to re-wire the house!

They bought a .listed building and made all kinds of changes to suit their business and life style. Now it is all gone in 60 minutes or so.

They will now be facing the problems tupical for people with fire gutted residential or commercial buildings - it makes little idfference which.

1. It is unlikely that the insurance company will meet much more than half of the rebuild costs whether restoration or replacement build.
2. In the case of replacement the owner will have to go through a full planning application the outcomes of which are unpredictable.
3. The various sources of grant money will not be available in the case of new / replacement build.

Many people just take whatever insurance money is on the table and sell up.
Sad but there it is.

So......we're back to what an unfortunate fire in someone family home.

Following the recent spate of fires in the UK, it is understandable why the French might be a little reluctant to lend us the Bayeux Tapestry.

stretching logic a little more should they sell French wine as it might get ruined in the heat of all these fires!!

True Dermot!! :-D :-D :-D

Ah well, apparently English Heritage will rebuild it.

Do you know, I only said my daughter was a bit 'gutted' the building had burnt down - because her ancestors had worked there.
I really didn't expect to have electrical circuitry and an imaginary amateur 'blind' building survey thrown at me!! :-D :-D :-D

Real World Rollo - Real World!!

More than 50 firefighters tackle large fire at ... - Andover Advertiser
www.andoveradvertiser.co.uk/.../15963987.More_than_50_firefighters_tackle_large_...
1 day ago - The flames damaged the ground floor, first floor and roof of the historic Bere Mill in London Road. The Saxon building, which was previously used to supply the Bank of England, was badly damaged, with the flames spreading through the farmhouse and mill. Hampshire Fire and Rescue Service sent 12 fire ..

Oh what a tragic thing to happen.

Maggie,

Look at the 5 pics on the advertisers page in link,,,,,,,,,and image 3&4 are spooky if you look close...what can you see in the flames. ;-)

Don't know about Maggie but I can see an angry face!

In photo No3 right of the flames I can see a man in a hat and No 5 a man on a horse.!!

but maybe its the pills. ;-) :-D

I am a qualified electricial engineer. Sorry about that.

I first saw this building over 50 years ago and have always loved it. I like the changes which have been made. If EH are going to help with it then I would delighted.
Our cultural heritage, in this case the built environment, belongs to all of us in the wider sense not just the current reg owners. I have no problem with public money being used to bring this wonderful place back from near death. If that should happen then some elements of the Portals should be brought back too.

Considering some of the resurrection projects current in Hampshire and Dorset the cost of Bere Mill would be buttons.

History you can touch is worth paying for.

...an English Heritage sign? :-D :-D

..or a witchy thing :-D

You say use public money to restore it and then it would have to be open to the public, not sure as already mentioned they'd like that for their family home, it's hardly a Mansion where they can just live in one wing while the public roams through the rest of it.

witchy thing,,,


btw,,,,,,,,,,,did I telll you I've got flu and lost 3 days of living.......... unfair. :-D.