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BASS (assumed name) - LILIAN MARY

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ProfilePosted byOptionsPost Date

Jennifer

Jennifer Report 1 Jul 2012 14:09

Any advice on how to find the real surname of someone who lived for 30 years 1920 - 1959 with Henry Frederick Bass and called herself Lilian Mary Bass on the London Voters list? Until I know her name I can't trace her death. If someone uses an assumed name, when it comes to a death registration the real surname is given surely.

patchem

patchem Report 1 Jul 2012 14:11

If everyone assumes the surname she uses is the correct one, then that is what she will be buried under..............

When do you think she was born, and may have died?
Thanks

MarieCeleste

MarieCeleste Report 1 Jul 2012 14:11

Hello Jennifer, unfortunately a death would be registered in the name that the informant knew the deceased as.

When did Henry Frederick die?

patchem

patchem Report 1 Jul 2012 14:18

I think Henry Frederick was born 1885, according to Jennifer's tree.

?
Births Dec 1885
Bass Henry Frederick Bethnal Green 1c 206

MarieCeleste

MarieCeleste Report 1 Jul 2012 14:21

Could this be him in 1911?

BASS, Henry Frederick Head Married M 25 1886 Motor Van Driver London Bethnall Green
BASS, Mary Ann Wife Married F 21 1890 Nil London Whitechapel

RG number: RG14 Piece: 1593 Reference: RG14PN1593 RG78PN56 RD21 SD1 ED22 SN365
Registration District: Mile End Old Town
Sub District: Mile End Old Town South Western Enumeration District: 22 Parish: Mile End Old Town

Address: 25 Arbour Sqr Stepney E County: London

Married three years, no children.

Stuart

Stuart Report 1 Jul 2012 14:22

Presume this is Henry with his wife. Says married 3 years, no children
1911 census transcription details for: 25 Arbour Sqr Stepney E

National Archive Reference:
RG14PN1593 RG78PN56 RD21 SD1 ED22 SN365
Reg. District: Mile End Old Town
Sub District: Mile End Old Town South Western
Parish: Mile End Old Town
Enum. District: 22
Address: 25 Arbour Sqr Stepney E
County: London
Name Relation Condition/Yrs married Sex Age Birth Year Occupation Where Born
BASS, Henry Frederick Head Married M 25 1886 Motor Van Driver London Bethnall Green
BASS, Mary Ann Wife Married F 21 1890 Nil London Whitechapel

Stuart

Stuart Report 1 Jul 2012 14:23

? Henry's death
Civil Registration event: Death

Name: BASS, Frederick H
Registration district: Camberwell
County: London
Year of registration: 1959
Quarter of registration: Jul-Aug-Sep
Age at death: 73
Volume no: 5C
Page no: 139

MarieCeleste

MarieCeleste Report 1 Jul 2012 14:29

On some of the ERs she's down as Mary Lilian e.g.

London, England, Electoral Registers, 1847-1965
Name: Mary Lilian Bass
Electoral Year: 1926
Parliamentary Division: Camberwell
County or Borough: Southwark

On others she is Lilian Mary

There are records for different people called Frederick Henry Bass and also Henry Frederick so we'll need not to get in a muddle with them!

Porkie_Pie

Porkie_Pie Report 1 Jul 2012 14:32

Marriages Dec 1907

>>>>>BASS Henry Frederick Mile End 1c 768
>>>>>CONNOR Mary Ann Mile End 1c 768
MOTTRAM Charles Mile End 1c 768
SEELEY Loo Elizabeth Mile End 1c 768


Roy

patchem

patchem Report 1 Jul 2012 14:32

There were these 2 Frederick H's born along with Henry F:
Births Mar 1887
BASS Frederick Harold Hackney 1b 602
Births Mar 1889
Bass Frederick Henry Holborn 1b 764
so we need feedback.

patchem

patchem Report 1 Jul 2012 14:35

Well, if this were her birth:
Births Mar 1889
Connor Mary Anna L St. Geo. H. Sq. 1a 494
the L might explain it.
But age probably out.

KathleenBell

KathleenBell Report 1 Jul 2012 14:44

That sounds like the right person to me Patchem. If I was Jennifer I would buy the birth certificate and see if the "L" stands for Lilian.

What makes you think it is an assumed name Jennifer?

Kath. x

Jennifer

Jennifer Report 1 Jul 2012 14:44

Thanks everybody. - I know for a fact that Mary Ann Bass nee Connor, did not stay in the marriage and that is why the person calling herself Lilian Mary Bass was using his name as divorce was too expensive for working class people. As she first appeared with him in the early 20's she must have been at last 21 at that time. I cannot trace any children from either woman. but I do have Henry Frederick's death cert in 1959. The informant was a John J O'Keefe - another mystery person. All the above answers are correct thanks but the mystery remains and will never be solved unless there is some elderley person in the Camberwell area who remembers them and knows.
Mary Ann Bass probably in turn resided with another man and used his name! No way of knowing is there? Suggestions would be welcome but I fear you will all say "Forget it" :-(

KathleenBell

KathleenBell Report 1 Jul 2012 14:50

Have you looked at electoral registers after Henry Frederick's death to see if Lilian Mary was still living in the same house and if she was still calling herself Bass?

Kath. x

Jennifer

Jennifer Report 1 Jul 2012 16:49

Wow - Thanks everybody.
My Mary Ann Connor was born in Whitechapel on 9 August 1888 and registered 22 Sept. Her niece knows that for sure and also knows she did not stay married to Henry Frederick Bass. He was a van driver and later a HGV driver and would not have been able to afford a divorce.
Lilian Mary Bass was not listed at the same house after his death and in fact was not there one year before in 1958 which leads me to believe she died before him or went into hospital.
Henry Frederick Bass was born Q4 1885 in Bethnal Green to parents Frederick Henry and Catherine Lydia Bass. Siblings Lydia ELeanor, William Charles, Thomas Alfred and Matilda who died in childhood.

Jennifer

Jennifer Report 1 Jul 2012 16:57

Also - the informant on Henry's death certificate a John J O'Keefe who described himself as a nephew gave the name as Frederick Henry Bass - even though all his other records show him as Hen Fred. If Lilian Mary had still been there she would have known Henry's real name. As this O'keefe man only appeared at the house in 1955 he probably did not know that he was really Hen Fred. This leads me to thinking that he was known as "Fred" in his later life. "Oh what a tangled web we weave - when first we practise to deceive!"

MarieCeleste

MarieCeleste Report 1 Jul 2012 17:29

The mysterious John J O'Keefe stayed on in the property after the death of Hen Fred.

London, England, Electoral Registers, 1847-1965
Name: John J O'Keefe
Electoral Year: 1961
Parliamentary Division: Dulwich
County or Borough: Southwark

The address is 27 Philip Road and he was with a Vera M Johnson

Jennifer

Jennifer Report 1 Jul 2012 18:12

Thanks everybody. So another unknown creeps into 27 Philip Road. I'll have a look and see where she goes. Wish we had another few years on the London Voters!
Jennifer

MarieCeleste

MarieCeleste Report 19 Jul 2012 22:58

New thread re: Mary Ann

http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/boards.page/board/ancestors/thread/1304217?jump=1304217

" wonder if there are any kind GR members in New Zealand who can look up our Mary Ann Bass nee Connor who disappeared from an unhappy marriage some time after the 1911 census in London. There is a female M Bass who sailed to Napier New Zealand in 1912. Could this be her - emigrating with her new man? Any help would be gratefully received.
Jenny"

It's much better for us if it's dealt with on here so we have all the background info to refer to.

Jennifer

Jennifer Report 19 Jul 2012 23:03

Oh - I see what you mean now. There is also a Lilian Mary Bass who lived with my uncle from the 1920's to his death in 1959 but this is not the same lady. I thought that a post with New Zealand in the headlines re Mary Ann Bass would maybe attract a GR member down under to assist. Thanks for your help. Jennifer