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John Smith McKeand 1853 -1937

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AnnMac

AnnMac Report 29 Jan 2013 16:27

I've hit a brickwall tracing my great grandfather John Smith McKeand and would be hugely grateful for any help or suggestions. He was a policeman in the Liverpool area, married twice and had 13 children in total so surely some other descendant is out there trying to find him!
I've found him in the 1881-1911 censuses and have the certificate of his first marriage in 1876 to a Mary Proctor. He is described in the census returns as having been born in Scotland and that fits with family recall, but no-one knows when he moved south. The 1911 census says he was from Maxwelltown, Kirkcudbrightshire, others say Dumfrieshire. Maxwelltown is now a suburb of Dumfries so its possible both are right. BUT I can't find him in the 1871 census (age c 17yrs) or the 1861 census (age 7yrs) in Scotland or England. Nor can I find a record of his birth. The 1876 marriage certificate gives his father's name as John McKeand, labourer - no indication of whether he was still alive at the time.
Can't find him in the Scottish censuses either,
Any ideas of what I might try next? It seems so odd for someone to be completely documented from age 23 onwards but for there to be no trace before that.
Many thanks, Ann
PS Sorry for length of post - hope I've included all the salient details

brummiejan

brummiejan Report 29 Jan 2013 16:43

Might be him 1871, though it doesn't help!!

1871 Scotland Census
Name: John Mckeand
Age: 17
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1854
Relationship: Visitor
Gender: Male
Where born: Dumfries, Dumfriesshire
Registration number: 871
Registration district: Kirkcudbright
Civil parish: Kirkcudbright
Town: Kirkcudbright
County: Kirkcudbrightshire
Address: High Street

Agnes Korgan 71
John K Milligan 40
Jean Mckeand 15
John Mckeand 17
Samuel McConaty 62

Shirley~I,m getting the hang of it

Shirley~I,m getting the hang of it Report 29 Jan 2013 16:59

Scottish BMDs dint start til 1855 so he wouldnt have been reg

Have you tried Scotlands People for a possible baptism

alviegal

alviegal Report 29 Jan 2013 17:07

Could this be his sister in above census?

parents: John Mckend,? Elizabeth Mccourtie

name: Jane Smith Mckend
gender: Female
birth date: 12 Aug 1855
birthplace: IRONGRAY,KIRKCUDBRIGHT,SCOTLAND
father's name: John Mckend
mother's name: Elizabeth Mccourtie
indexing project (batch) number: C11867-1
system origin: Scotland-ODM

Maddie

Maddie Report 29 Jan 2013 17:08

bit of a long shot
name: John Mckeand
gender: Male
baptism/christening date: 09 Mar 1851
baptism/christening place: , GLENCAIRN, DUMFRIES, SCOTLAND
birth date: 15 Dec 1850
birthplace:
death date:
name note:
race:
father's name: John Mckeand
father's birthplace:
father's age:
mother's name: Agnes Reid
mother's birthplace:
mother's age:
indexing project (batch) number: C11826-4
system origin: Scotland-VR
source film number: 1067962
reference number: - 2:1623069
Citing this Record

alviegal

alviegal Report 29 Jan 2013 17:14

Other births to that couple.

1)Marianne Mckeand

Scotland, Births and Baptisms, 1564-1950

birth: 19 Feb 1838 ,? Borgue,? Kirkcudbright,? Scotland
christening: ,? BORGUE,? KIRKCUDBRIGHT,? SCOTLAND
residence: 1838 Borgue,? Kirkcudbright,? Scotland

parents: John Mckeand,? Elizabeth Mccourtie


2)Alexander Mckeand

Scotland, Births and Baptisms, 1564-1950

birth: 05 Dec 1836 ,? Borgue,? Kirkcudbright,? Scotland
christening: ,? BORGUE,? KIRKCUDBRIGHT,? SCOTLAND
residence: 1836 Borgue,? Kirkcudbright,? Scotland

parents: John Mckeand,? Elizabeth Mccourtie


3)Margaret Crosbie Mckeand

Scotland, Births and Baptisms, 1564-1950

birth: 11 Jan 1833
christening: 05 Feb 1833 ,? BALMAGHIE,? KIRKCUDBRIGHT,? SCOTLAND
residence: 1833 Balmaghie,? Kirkcudbright,? Scotland

parents: John Mckeand,? Elizabeth Mccourty


4)Jane Keand

Scotland, Births and Baptisms, 1564-1950

birth: 03 Oct 1834 ,? Twynholm,? Kirkcudbright,? Scotland
christening: ,? TWYNHOLM,? KIRKCUDBRIGHT,? SCOTLAND
residence: 1834 Twynholm,? Kirkcudbright,? Scotland

parents: John Keand,? Elizabeth Mccourtie

alviegal

alviegal Report 29 Jan 2013 17:18


1841 Scotland Census about Margaret Reand
Name: Margaret Reand
[Margaret McKeand]
Age: 8
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1833
Gender: Female
Where born: Kirkcudbrightshire, Scotland

Civil parish: Borgue
County: Kirkcudbrightshire
Address: Upper Senwick
Parish Number: 858
Household Members:
Name Age
Mr. John Reand 25, ag lab
Elisabeth Reand 25
Margaret Reand 8
Janet Reand 6
Mary Reand 3
Elisabeth Reand 10 Mo
Mexander Reand 70

John McKeand husband Elizabeth McCourtie married: 27 Jul 1832 Buittle, Kirkcudbright... Son Alexander & Mary

This is a comment that was posted with the correction.





1851 Scotland Census about Maryann McKen
Name: Maryann McKen
[Maryann McKeand]
Age: 13
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1838
Relationship: Daughter
Father's Name: John McKen
Mother's Name: Elesabeth McKen
Gender: Female
Where born: Borgue, kirkcudbright
Parish Number: 882
Civil parish: Troqueer
County: Kirkcudbrightshire
Address: 66 Colledge Street
Occupation: At School
ED: 24
Page: 6 (click to see others on page)
Household schedule number: 23
Line: 9
Roll: CSSCT1851_214
Household Members:
Name Age
John McKen 38
Elesabeth McKen 39
Maryann McKen 13
Elesabeth McKen 10
Agness McKen 8
Matilda McKen 4
Ann P McKen 1



1861 Scotland Census about John Mckeand
Name: John Mckeand
Age: 58
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1803
Relationship: Head
Spouse's name : Elizabeth Mckeand
Gender: Male
Where born: Kirkinner, Wigtown
Registration number: 897
Registration district: Sorbie
Civil parish: Sorbie
County: Wigtownshire
Address: Sorbie Village
Occupation: Ploughman
ED: 6
Household schedule number: 8
Line: 1
Roll: CSSCT1861_149
Household Members:
Name Age
John Mckeand 58
Elizabeth Mckeand 56
Matilda Mckeand 15


No sign of John though. Drat :-( :-(

rootgatherer

rootgatherer Report 29 Jan 2013 17:27

This is the John born in 1851

Name: John Mckeand
[John McKen]
Age: 4 Mo
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1851
Relationship: Grandson
Gender: Male
Where born: Glencairn, Dumfries
Parish Number: 826
Civil parish: Glencairn
Town: Dunreggan
County: Dumfriesshire
Address: Dunreggan
ED: 7
Page: 9 (click to see others on page)
Household schedule number: 53
Line: 12
Roll: CSSCT1851_207
Household Members:
Name Age
James Reid 61
Agnes Reid 53
Agnes Reid 29
Hannah Reid 27
Catherine Reid 25
Grace Reid 12
James Reid 3
John Mckeand 3 months

And the correction added

John McKen rather than John Mckeand
John McKen is the son of Agnes Reid. John dies in Yorkton, Saskatchewan, Canada.

AnnMac

AnnMac Report 29 Jan 2013 17:29

Thank you everyone for these suggestions.
BrummieJan - I had also found the 1871Census entry with John visitng a household with a servant called Jean Mckeand, possibly younger sister. Thought that was a lead but I can't find a family in 1861 with a bro' and sister called john and jean from Dumfries. I'll look into the Jane McKend option and see if I can find that family in 1861.
The Agnes Reid mother thread does make him at least 2 years too old but I'll check it out.
Not there yet but you've renewed my enthusiasm for pressing on with this!

rootgatherer

rootgatherer Report 29 Jan 2013 17:30

Might be worth checking out that 1855 birth for Jane Smith McKeand on Scotlandspeople. I think the 1855 entries give more info than later ones.

AnnMac

AnnMac Report 29 Jan 2013 17:43

Rootgatherer. Not sure I quite understand your post . This help is coming in so thick and fast I can't keep up! If the John McKeand you've found died in Canada then He can't be my 1853 born gt grandfather becuase he died in wirral Cheshire in 1937. Am I safe to ignore that possible line of enquiry or am I being dense?
Ann

rootgatherer

rootgatherer Report 29 Jan 2013 17:50

I posted that census showing the John McKeand born 1851 just to eliminate as he seems from that correction on Ancestry to have died in Canada - so he can't be yours.


AnnMac

AnnMac Report 29 Jan 2013 17:51

Rootgather again. Thanks for the suggestion of looking for a possible sibling in the 1855 births because they give such good level of detail. I'm afraid i already tried that - can't honestly remember now what I found and I seem to have lost my notes - but it didn't get me to the answer I'm looking for. The amazing thing I'm learning from all these dead ends tho' is the curiuos family set ups that there were in those days - kids produced in eye watering numbers, offspring parked with relatives and daughters sent into domestic service at very young ages. It's hiostory in the raw, even iof it isn't my exact ancestors!

rootgatherer

rootgatherer Report 29 Jan 2013 17:55

This is from Scotlandspeople website showing what you can expect to see on a Statutory birth record.

Births
The following table indicates when particular details were introduced to and/or removed from statutory birth registration. Please note that only images of statutory births from 1855 to 1910 are presently available to view on this site.

Registers of Births Date Range
Child: name, sex, date, time & place of birth 1855 to date
Mother: name & maiden surname 1855 to date
Mother: occupation (usually shown only if parents not married or no father's name given) 1855 - 1998
Mother: occupation 1999 to date
Mother: age & place of birth 1855 only
Father: name & rank, profession or occupation 1855 to date
Father: age & place of birth 1855 only
Parents: date & place of marriage 1855 only, then 1861 to date
Siblings: parents' other children, living or deceased (numbers and sex only) 1855 only
Informant: qualification & signature (address if different from location of birth) 1855 to date
Registrar: date & place of registration, signature 1855 to date


So if you get some credits and checkout the birth in 1855 for Jane Smith McKeand it may help you.

Eringobragh1916

Eringobragh1916 Report 29 Jan 2013 17:58

If you do a quick search for McKeand...Lancashire 1871 onwards....(use search on this site) you will see there are a couple or more McKeand's listed for Toxteth Park and West Derby from Kirk./Dumfries...It may be worthwhile looking initially at Liverpool for other family if you havent already done so....

AnnMac

AnnMac Report 29 Jan 2013 18:15

I fear I have already searched in Liverpool in 1871 and 1861 (in case my chap came as child with his family) but no joy. There is a scottish born David McKeand policeman and family living quite close to where my family was (West Derby and Toxteth Park keep cropping up as locations for my grandmother and her sisters)- but they are the wrong forename, age and offspring's names to be my ancestor himself. I was considering checking out if this might be an uncle or cousin who struck out from the home country and sent back good news so a younger relative followed in his career footsteps.

rootgatherer

rootgatherer Report 29 Jan 2013 18:17

Looked at that Birth on SP

Father John McKend a Farm Servant aged 43 years.
Parents married 1834 Kelton.

2 boys and 2 Girls living 1 Boy and 1 Girl had died.

rootgatherer

rootgatherer Report 29 Jan 2013 18:40

????

1841

Name: Mr. John Reand
[John McKeand]
Age: 25
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1816
Gender: Male
Where born: Kirkcudbrightshire, Scotland
Civil parish: Borgue
County: Kirkcudbrightshire
Address: Upper Senwick
Occupation: Ag Lab
Parish Number: 858
Household Members:
Name Age
Mr. John Reand 25
Elisabeth Reand 25
Margaret Reand 8
Janet Reand 6
Mary Reand 3
Elisabeth Reand 10 Mo
Mexander Reand 70



The corrections added

Name
John McKeand rather than John Reand
See freecen.org.uk
Submitted by santosjames on 07/11/2012

Comments
John McKeand husband Elizabeth McCourtie married: 27 Jul 1832 Buittle, Kirkcudbright... Son Alexander & Mary
Submitted by santosjames on 07/11/2012



Freecen version

Piece: SCT1841/858 Place: BORGUE -Kirkcudbrightshire Enumeration District: 5
Civil Parish: Borgue Ecclesiastical Parish, Village or Island: -
Folio: 5 Page: 2
Address: Upper Senwick

Surname First name(s) Sex Age Occupation Where Born Remarks
MCKEAND John M 25 Agricultural Labourer Kirkcudbrightshire
MCKEAND Elisabeth F 25 Kirkcudbrightshire
MCKEAND Margaret F 8 Kirkcudbrightshire
MCKEAND Janet F 6 Kirkcudbrightshire
MCKEAND Mary F 3 Kirkcudbrightshire
MCKEAND Elisabeth F 10m Kirkcudbrightshire
MCKEAND Alexander M 70 Agricultural Labourer Kirkcudbrightshire

Eringobragh1916

Eringobragh1916 Report 29 Jan 2013 19:23

This may help....So he was certainly in the Lancashire area at that time... You can send for his details on this link...
http://www.lancashire.gov.uk/education/record_office/records/policesearch.asp


First names: JohnSmith
Surname: McKeand
Location: Lancashire

Records are held for Lancashire Constabulary, for period of 1873-1874 (REF: PLA 11/18)



Also a William Chambers McKeand 1909-1912

AnnMac

AnnMac Report 29 Jan 2013 22:03

Rootgatherer - I'm really grateful but a tad confused!
Whose birth have you found with a fatherJohn McKeand farm labourer aged 43?Was it jane smith mckeand? That record doesn't seem to quite match the marriage to Elizabeth McCourtie in 1832.
I've tried to find these records myself and I'm failing dismally! The 1841 family that you've listed with parents aged 25 and 4 daughters might be mine - the older siblings of john Smith and jane smith mckeand- but to show that surely I'd have to find them in 1851 and then 1861 but I can't seem to get any results that match. It would also be heck of a long reproductive lifespan for Elizabeth, married in 1832 and still giving birth in 1855. Makes me tired just to think of it!