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Brick wall - my grandfather's birth details

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ProfilePosted byOptionsPost Date

Jay

Jay Report 2 Mar 2013 18:57

My grandfather Edward Hornby married my grandmother Jane Naylor on 1/4/1913 in Liverpoool. I have the certificate and his age was stated as 20. His father was Henry Hornby who was a Labourer. Edward died on 2/4/1943 in Liverpool and his age was given (by my grandmother) as 49. I am trying to find out more about him but as I don't know where he was born or the names of any siblings I am struggling. Any help would be appreciated.

patchem

patchem Report 2 Mar 2013 19:02

Have you looked for him in the censuses?

His birth?
Births Dec 1892
Hornby Edward Prestwich 8d 3_8

Was his Father still alive according to the marriage certificate?
Thanks

Chrissie2394

Chrissie2394 Report 2 Mar 2013 19:11

Who were the witnesses on the marriage certificate.

Chris

Gwyn in Kent

Gwyn in Kent Report 2 Mar 2013 19:21

On his Service papers dated 20 June 1917, he states that he is 24 years 10 months.

Gwyn in Kent

Gwyn in Kent Report 2 Mar 2013 19:29

Just found a page on his service record which states that he was born in West Derby, Liverpool on 14 - 7- 1892

lancashireAnn

lancashireAnn Report 2 Mar 2013 21:37

witnesses were William Edward Jenkins & Mary Jenkins

father Henry not stated as deceased

Mary's father was deceased so I would guess that Henry was still alive otherwise it would have been recorded

lancashireAnn

lancashireAnn Report 2 Mar 2013 21:43

presumabley the witnesses were Jane's siter and b-in-l

Marriages Jun 1912 (>99%)
Jenkins William Naylor W.Derby 8b 560
Naylor Mary Jenkins W.Derby 8b 560

how inconsiderate of Edward not to have had one of his relatives!! :-(

Reggie

Reggie Report 2 Mar 2013 23:15

What was Edward's occupation when he married?

brummiejan

brummiejan Report 2 Mar 2013 23:20

I assume this is him? Wife is Jane.

Says daughter Mary born 39 Conway St. 1913 but no Hornby's there 1911. Do you have an address on his marriage cert?

British Army WWI Service Records, 1914-1920 about Edward Hornby
Name: Edward Hornby
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1893
Age at enlistment: 24
Residence: 39 Gordon Street, Liverpool
Document Year: 1917
Regimental Number: 30797
Regiment Name: York and Lanc Regt
Number of images: 17

Jan

ArgyllGran

ArgyllGran Report 2 Mar 2013 23:37

Is this him in 1901?
Don't know what relation he is to the Henry listed here, though, and DOB's a bit off.


1901 England Census about Edward Hornby
Name: Edward Hornby
Age: 2
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1899
Relation: Visitor
Gender: Male
Where born: Liverpool, Lancashire, England

Civil parish: Kirkdale
Ecclesiastical parish: North Shore St Paul
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England

Street Address:

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Education:

Employment status:

View image

Registration district: West Derby
Sub-registration district: Kirkdale
ED, institution, or vessel: 36
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 51
Piece: 3470
Folio: 139
Page Number: 10
Household Members:
Name Age
Henry Hornby 24
Mary A Hornby 24
Jeffrey Hornby 3
Annie Hornby 27
Edward Hornby 2
Margaret Hornby 5 Months
Louis Hornby 26

brummiejan

brummiejan Report 2 Mar 2013 23:53

Not sure about that one argyllgran - the age is consistent on both census, and he married 1913!
Jan

lancashireAnn

lancashireAnn Report 2 Mar 2013 23:55

As Edward was a fireman on his marriage I wonder if that meant a fireman on a ship as in Liverpool was often the case. He could have been at sea in 1911 making him rather hard to identify.

both Edward and Jane gave their address as 84 Arkwright St Everton so not really much help

lancashireAnn

lancashireAnn Report 2 Mar 2013 23:59

interestingly Jane Naylor lived at 44 Gordon St in 1911 - close to that enlistment address

wonder why he did not enlist until 1917

ArgyllGran

ArgyllGran Report 3 Mar 2013 00:02

brummiejan -
Sorry - I had come to that conclusion myself, and deleted the 1911 census before I saw your post.

brummiejan

brummiejan Report 3 Mar 2013 00:07

Completely wrong area, must be a strange co-incidence surely? I know there is an Arkwight St Everton also:

1911 England Census

Name: William Hornby
Age in 1911: 73
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1838
Relation to Head: Head
Gender: Male
Birth Place: Seaforth, Lancashire, England
Civil parish: Bolton
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England
Street Address: 84 Arkwright St Bolton
Marital Status: Married
Occupation: Mineral-Water Box Maker
Registration district: Bolton
Registration District Number: 461
Sub-registration district: Little Bolton

William Hornby 73
Mary Ellen Hornby 71
Elizabeth Hermine Hornby 40
Thomas Baldwin Hornby

lancashireAnn

lancashireAnn Report 3 Mar 2013 00:13

mmm ......it did not actually say Everton on the certificate - just assumed it was as the marriage was at st Peter's Everton

jansmith

jansmith Report 3 Mar 2013 02:41

Ann yes it stats ships fireman on army papers as occupation

Flip

Flip Report 3 Mar 2013 07:59

I don't think his birth was reg England/Wales - at least not under the given name.

The one reg Prestwich is with his parents on census - father James - living north Manchester. The one reg Garstang has parents William and Grace (nee Isles). One in Hunslet is son of Robert. The one reg Birkenhead was with his mother Mary on the census she was a widow formerly Mary Martin - she married Richard Hornby in 1890.

Possible he was registered under his mothers name and assumed the name of Hornby if his mother later married? Though why he's not showing up on census is a bit strange.

Jay

Jay Report 3 Mar 2013 11:11

Thanks everyone, unable to go through all suggestions until pm today but - Jane's mother did live at 44 Gordon st, Arkwright St and Conway st were close by. I do know that Edward had an accident when he was burned but I don't know when that was. He did work for Harland & Wolf so I suspect he may not have been a mariner and also there was never mention of this (being at sea) in the family.

Flip

Flip Report 3 Mar 2013 11:24

According to his army enlistment he had previously been in the RN fleet auxiliary, and he was a marine fireman - so he must have served at some point before his enlistment in 1917.

Added: I've sent you a PM with his enlistment paper showing his occupation and mention of previous service.