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Would anyone be able to cross-reference a marriage, please?

I have William Guest, married Liverpool in the second quarter 1859, Vol 5B, 143 but have been unable to match him up with anyone with the surnames I have.

Joyce, have you tried finding him in the 1861 census to see which he might have married?

Have found this:


Liverpool, Lancashire, England, Marriages and Banns, 1813-1921

Name: William Guest - Publican
Birth Year: abt 1859
Age: Full Age
Marriage Date: 4 Apr 1859
Parish: Liverpool Christ Church
Spouse's Name: Elizabeth McNeal, minor
Father's name: Edward Guest - Grocer
Spouse Father's Name: Thomas McNeal - Railway Superintendant

Both William and Elizabeth gave their address as 171 Scotland Road.

Witnesses were William Doyle and Martha Gr....... (can't read it)

Tried that but I think she died young, leaving a very young family behind as William's mother was living with him and his children at one stage. Of course, she could have 'done a runner' but without the right surname I have been unable to trace her.

Many thanks, MarieCeleste. This looks right - I'll search the census material to see what I can find now. It might give me a clue as to whether she did die young or simply 'went'.

Have you got the birth certificates of the children for her maiden name?

Sorry Joyce, I would like to help but I really don't understand what it is that you are looking for.

Has not MarieCeleste just given you the name of William's wife from that 1859 marriage?

Is it that you are trying to find Elizabeth McNeal before the marriage?

Dea x

This looks like the couple from the 1859 marriage in 1861 census:

GUEST, William Head Married M 29 1832 Licensed Victualler Bolton Lancashire
GUEST, Elizabeth Wife Married F 22 1839 Pilling Lancashire
GUEST, Jane Daughter F 1 1860 Liverpool Lancashire
HEARNS, Bernard Servant Unmarried M 25 1836 Barmaid Liverpool Lancashire
ROBERTS, Emma Servant Unmarried F 19 1842 House Servant Wrexham Denbighshire Wales

Registration District: Liverpool
Sub District: 1 St Martin
Enumeration District: 12
Ecclesiastical Parish: St Matthews
Civil Parish: Liverpool
Municipal Borough: Liverpool

Address: 165, Gt Homer Street, Liverpool County: Lancashire

Got copies of other birth/marriage/death certs but none for their children.

I've cross-referenced the marriage and thank you again, MarieCeleste, because the entries for both surnames were very faded and I had the wrong volume number.

Now I'll search census and other sites.

Dea,

Initially, trying to find out who married William Guest and where she disappeared to.

Now find from the marriage information that William's father was Edward Guest - I had that wrong so it's back to the drawing board, I think!

pm from Joyce:

This is proving difficult as William (b 1931) when he married Elizabeth McNeal in 1859 gave his father's name as Edward yet I foundMary Waters Guest in the 1871 census she was living with grandparents, William and Esther Guest (nee Broker).

I have photocopies of parish registers of the births of
Priscilla Guest, baptized March 1929, Mary, bapt 1835 and William, bapt 1830 all listing William Guest and Esther Guest (nee Broker).

In addition, Mary Waters Guest gives her father's name as William Guest on her marriage cert.

Can you fathom out where I've gone wrong?

Joyce, the best thing is to start from one of your direct ancestors and work back.

(I guess those 19.. years should be 18..)

Who is Mary Waters Guest?

Mary Waters Guest is my great grandmother. On her marriage cert she gave her father's name as William Guest. I did not know her mother's name but from the above it would seem to be Elizabeth McNeal, however I've found Mary and siblings on the 1871 census living with grandparents, William and Esther Guest (nee Broker).
They must have been William's parents yet on his marriage cert, William names his father as Edward Guest, a grocer.
Which line would you suggest I follow because I named William and Esther, the grandparents, as William's parents on my tree - not Edward.

Joyce, on Mary Water's marriage certificate, what was her father's occupation, and who were the witnesses?

Who did she marry, where and when?

For reference, this is the 1871 referred to:

GUEST, William Head M 68 1803 Cheshire - horticultural labourer
GUEST, Esther Wife F 68 1803 Lancashire
GUEST, Isabella E Granddaughter F 9 1862 Lancashire
GUEST, Mary W Granddaughter F 7 1864 Lancashire
GUEST, William R Grandson M 3 1868 Lancashire

Registration District: West Derby
Sub District: Everton
Enumeration District: 99
Ecclesiastical Parish:
Civil Parish: Kirkdale
Municipal Borough: Liverpool

Address: Westminster Road, Kirkdale, Liverpool
County: Lancashire

Children all born Kirkdale

So this must be Mary Water's father with his family in 1851:

GUEST, William Head Married M 47 1804 Smithy Labour Lyme Cheshire
GUEST, Esther Wife Married F 48 1803 Wrightington Lancashire
GUEST, Priscilla Daughter Unmarried F 22 1829 At Home Liverpool Lancashire
GUEST, William Son Unmarried M 20 1831 App To Ship Carver Liverpool Lancashire
GUEST, Mary Daughter Unmarried F 16 1835 At Home Liverpool Lancashire

Registration District: West Derby
Sub District: Everton
Enumeration District: 31
Ecclesiastical Parish:
Civil Parish: Kirkdale
Municipal Borough: Liverpool

Address: 1, Alcocks Buildings, Kirkdale, Liverpool
County: Lancashire

Mary Waters Guest married Joseph Henry Thomas
Edge Hill, Lancs
Free Marriage Index: Reg. March 1891, Vol. 8b, 504 at West Derby
Witnesses: (I think) Sarah Oates and Harry Spencer (unless this the next marriage registered).

I don't have the marriage cert but the bride's father's name is given as William Guest.

Now that the facts are emerging, I don't think that 1859 marriage is your William.

Joyce, this marriage registration:

Surname First name(s) District Vol Page
Marriages Mar 1891
Guest Mary Waters W. Derby 8b 504
Oates Sarah Jane W. Derby 8b 504
Spencer Harry W. Derby 8b 504
Thomas Joseph Henry W. Derby 8b 504

Names two different couples marriages recorded at same time

I would strongly recommend getting a copy of Mary and Joseph's marriage cert to be 100% sure.

I think this may be William, son of Esther and William, in 1861 (the occupation fits in):

GUEST, William Head Married M 30 1831 Ship Carrier Liverpool
GUEST, Elizabeth Wife Married F 28 1833 Scotland

Registration District: West Derby
Sub District: 2 Everton
Enumeration District: 63
Ecclesiastical Parish: St Marys
Civil Parish: Kirkdale
Municipal Borough: Liverpool

Address: 10, Alcocks Buildings, Marley Street, Kirkdale, Liverpool
County: Lancashire